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Author Topic: PLO thoughts on this hand:  (Read 1729 times)
GlasgowBandit
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« on: June 18, 2007, 01:29:08 AM »

This table is absolutely manic, in 30 minutes I had gone from $150 to short of $7, due to a combination of missing draws, bad luck and mistiming a bluff.

Then here is this hand, I took the whole allotted time before deciding to fold, your thoughts on how it played out?

** Game ID 772808493 starting - 2007-06-18 01:20:36
** Loch Gairloch [Omaha] (0.15|0.30 Pot Limit - Cash Game) Real Money

- ivasemi sitting in seat 1 with $124.71 [Dealer]
- pelotudo359 sitting in seat 2 with $23.18
- V_RealBandit sitting in seat 3 with $26.74
- beanys sitting in seat 4 with $81.40
- DjNice sitting in seat 5 with $43.43
- tollingtons sitting in seat 6 with $27.30

pelotudo359 posted the small blind - $0.15
V_RealBandit posted the big blind - $0.30

** Dealing card to V_RealBandit: Ace of Diamonds, Jack of Clubs, 9 of Clubs, 10 of diamonds
beanys called - $0.30
DjNice called - $0.30
tollingtons called - $0.30
ivasemi folded
pelotudo359 called - $0.30
V_RealBandit bet - $1.80
beanys called - $1.80
DjNice called - $1.80
tollingtons called - $1.80
pelotudo359 called - $1.80

** Dealing the flop: 10 of Hearts, 7 of Spades, 8 of Hearts
pelotudo359 checked
V_RealBandit checked
beanys checked
DjNice bet - $9.00
tollingtons went all-in - $25.50
pelotudo359 folded
V_RealBandit folded
beanys folded
DjNice called - $25.50

** Dealing the turn: Queen of Clubs

** Dealing the river: Jack of Diamonds
tollingtons shows: Queen of Diamonds, 3 of Hearts, Ace of Hearts, 4 of Spades
DjNice shows: King of Hearts, 9 of Spades, Queen of Hearts, 5 of Diamonds
DjNice wins $57.00 from the main pot

End of game 772808493
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rudders
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« Reply #1 on: June 18, 2007, 11:38:51 AM »

ok.... you would have lost.... on that flop with a (now) small stack you have flopped the current nuts. you are winning! I know you have no improvement( except runner runner) and will have to dodge bullets but you may well be a favourite- especially with idiots/maniacs you are up against. flush draws ,2 pr a set even top pair. Your stack size means that you wont even have to make difficult decisions on the turn and river. You fold the nuts! What are you waiting for? Er i call btw....

For the record.. You are 59 % to win on that flop v these 2 players (The  is 34% and  is 7%)

and on the turn 75% fav v 19% v 6%

reading these %s even though you would have lost do you think you made a good fold?
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AlexMartin
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« Reply #2 on: June 18, 2007, 11:59:55 AM »

invoice sent, 50p paid directly to "i got my money in as a favourite in a +EV situation and am whining about a bad beat" Wink

You did it all right, the cards didnt cooperate. You would have to be A LOT deeper to ever pass the nuts here.
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rudders
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« Reply #3 on: June 18, 2007, 12:10:44 PM »

invoice sent, 50p paid directly to "i got my money in as a favourite in a +EV situation and am whining about a bad beat" Wink

You did it all right, the cards didnt cooperate. You would have to be A LOT deeper to ever pass the nuts here.

He folded!
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JungleCat03
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« Reply #4 on: June 18, 2007, 12:43:14 PM »

You're such a SuperLAG Rudders. All those drugs the doctors have been giving you have addled your brain.  Calling with the nuts is so passe. These days you shouldn't overplay these hands and realise that just because you HAVE the nuts there's no need to ACT like you're nuts.

Take this example of a mistake I made. It's the classic overplay of one pair.


Seat: 1
Name: Misuki
Amount: 1725.00   Seat: 2
Name: benny284484
Amount: 1575.00   Seat: 3
Name: sha all in
Amount: 1895.00   Seat: 4
Name: heini 2
Amount: 1500.00   Seat: 5
Name: PantherZero
Amount: 2230.00   Seat: 6
Name: HalleR
Amount: 3240.00   Seat: 7
Name: miky mouse
Amount: 3545.00   Seat: 8
Name: corona84
Amount: 1580.00   Seat: 9
Name: SPRII
Amount: 2880.00   Seat: 10
Name: DENSL
Amount: 1545.00
                                                                  
Blinds
Heini2 posts          SB 100.00
PantherZero posts BB 200.00   

Dealt to PantherZero Ah

Miky Mouse raises to 400.

corona84 folds.
SPRII folds.
DENSL folds.
Misuki folds.
benny284484 folds.
sha all in folds.
heini 2 calls 400
PantherZero raises 700 to 1100.

Miky Mouse raises 2445 to 3545 and is allin.
Heini2 folds.
PantherZero calls 1130 and is allin.
Miky Mouse shows
PantherZero shows Ah.


Flop

Miky Mouse wins 4860 with three of a kind Jacks.
PantherZero draws small >))))*> in the chat box, says gg and departs.


See, now preflop I like my hand, but need to respect the fact that it is simply a one pair hand.

After I lost the hand, I correctly orientated my thinking towards the results and saw something suprising. He made trips, a good hand to beat me. When i analysed this I realised that I had only one chance of making trips (unless the board did something funky).... trip aces. On the other hand he could make trip jacks OR trip kings - 200% of the chance I had to make trips. Also if I was lucky enough to hit my 2 outer to make trip aces, he would have a big redraw to a straight with his nice 3 card straight draw.

I hadn't thought this hand through and should have realised the minimum raise UTG was going to be a big hand. This was a fairly standard fold but having the "nuts" I foolishly decided to play and severely overplayed my hand. I have learnt from my mistake and won't be so gullible next time!

Start tightening up a bit rudders and your results will improve.....
« Last Edit: June 18, 2007, 12:45:05 PM by JungleCat03 » Logged

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GlasgowBandit
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« Reply #5 on: June 18, 2007, 12:46:17 PM »

invoice sent, 50p paid directly to "i got my money in as a favourite in a +EV situation and am whining about a bad beat" Wink

You did it all right, the cards didnt cooperate. You would have to be A LOT deeper to ever pass the nuts here.

He folded!

 

My line of thought was if I was pushing my stack in against two players I at least wanted a redraw of some sort.  The way my luck had been going yesteday I felt it was inevitable that I'd push and end up coming out behind.

I know its low limits but what do you reckon of the calls pre flop with their holding i am passing both those hands at any level to a pot bet. 
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rudders
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« Reply #6 on: June 18, 2007, 03:17:02 PM »

invoice sent, 50p paid directly to "i got my money in as a favourite in a +EV situation and am whining about a bad beat" Wink

You did it all right, the cards didnt cooperate. You would have to be A LOT deeper to ever pass the nuts here.

He folded!

 

My line of thought was if I was pushing my stack in against two players I at least wanted a redraw of some sort.  The way my luck had been going yesteday I felt it was inevitable that I'd push and end up coming out behind.

I know its low limits but what do you reckon of the calls pre flop with their holding i am passing both those hands at any level to a pot bet. 

horrible calls the both of them!- especially the eventual winner. Some will call with any suited ace- and you know the that you will be against them-

I sense that the previous outdraws etc changed your decision making process- probably the lesson to learn is if that is the case then it is time to have a break- as i said you were 58% fav on that flop- you cant afford to fold.

You're such a SuperLAG Rudders. All those drugs the doctors have been giving you have addled your brain.  Calling with the nuts is so passe. These days you shouldn't overplay these hands and realise that just because you HAVE the nuts there's no need to ACT like you're nuts.

Take this example of a mistake I made. It's the classic overplay of one pair.


Seat: 1
Name: Misuki
Amount: 1725.00   Seat: 2
Name: benny284484
Amount: 1575.00   Seat: 3
Name: sha all in
Amount: 1895.00   Seat: 4
Name: heini 2
Amount: 1500.00   Seat: 5
Name: PantherZero
Amount: 2230.00   Seat: 6
Name: HalleR
Amount: 3240.00   Seat: 7
Name: miky mouse
Amount: 3545.00   Seat: 8
Name: corona84
Amount: 1580.00   Seat: 9
Name: SPRII
Amount: 2880.00   Seat: 10
Name: DENSL
Amount: 1545.00
                                                                  
Blinds
Heini2 posts          SB 100.00
PantherZero posts BB 200.00   

Dealt to PantherZero Ah

Miky Mouse raises to 400.

corona84 folds.
SPRII folds.
DENSL folds.
Misuki folds.
benny284484 folds.
sha all in folds.
heini 2 calls 400
PantherZero raises 700 to 1100.

Miky Mouse raises 2445 to 3545 and is allin.
Heini2 folds.
PantherZero calls 1130 and is allin.
Miky Mouse shows
PantherZero shows Ah.


Flop

Miky Mouse wins 4860 with three of a kind Jacks.
PantherZero draws small >))))*> in the chat box, says gg and departs.


See, now preflop I like my hand, but need to respect the fact that it is simply a one pair hand.

After I lost the hand, I correctly orientated my thinking towards the results and saw something suprising. He made trips, a good hand to beat me. When i analysed this I realised that I had only one chance of making trips (unless the board did something funky).... trip aces. On the other hand he could make trip jacks OR trip kings - 200% of the chance I had to make trips. Also if I was lucky enough to hit my 2 outer to make trip aces, he would have a big redraw to a straight with his nice 3 card straight draw.

I hadn't thought this hand through and should have realised the minimum raise UTG was going to be a big hand. This was a fairly standard fold but having the "nuts" I foolishly decided to play and severely overplayed my hand. I have learnt from my mistake and won't be so gullible next time!

Start tightening up a bit rudders and your results will improve....
.

LOL panther- another classic- not being able to release big overpairs can indeed be a big leak in your game, glad you are finally waking up to this fact.

Please believe me I am trying to tighten up but my natrual instincts are sooooooooo hard to overcome..
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« Reply #7 on: June 18, 2007, 07:19:32 PM »

Fold = mental!
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Ironside
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« Reply #8 on: June 18, 2007, 07:42:01 PM »

without having been sat with the 2 players in question for 30 minutes atleast i would probaly of folded here

1 i am likely to be up against 1 or even 2 made straights one or both of them with redraws (top set 2 pair wrapped straight and flush) basically unless you can put both players on naked flush draws then you have to fold a nut hand its omaha after all not holdem
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« Reply #9 on: June 18, 2007, 08:44:09 PM »

Can quite easily be set and fd? Already mentioned one of them is a nutter, don't think you have enough chips to pass this!
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rudders
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« Reply #10 on: June 18, 2007, 08:57:18 PM »

without having been sat with the 2 players in question for 30 minutes atleast i would probaly of folded here

1 i am likely to be up against 1 or even 2 made straights one or both of them with redraws (top set 2 pair wrapped straight and flush) basically unless you can put both players on naked flush draws then you have to fold a nut hand its omaha after all not holdem

but he Had been there for 30 mins- and also stated that it was manic. Also 6 handed tables are often much looser than full ring- 2 other made straights are unlikely- yes there  are redraws possible but your stack size means no more difficult decisions nso therefore......

Fold = mental!
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GlasgowBandit
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« Reply #11 on: June 18, 2007, 10:05:55 PM »

I had been there for longer than 30 minutes was there a good 90 minutes but the dynamic was the table was chnaging as so many players where coming and going the only constant players where myself and Nice I had intended calling his bet but when the 2nd player came in I decided not to.  I only had the made nuts at the time and no redraw if I was up against a FD, top set. 

I chose to pass based on the number of chips I had, if I had more in front of me I'd have taken a chance but was more concerned with not loosing than I was with winning.

I initially bought in for $20 just to burn some time while waiting on a few MTT's opening up and spunt it upto $150.
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« Reply #12 on: June 18, 2007, 10:42:16 PM »

I chose to pass based on the number of chips I had, if I had more in front of me I'd have taken a chance

Sounds like a good idea, pass with less than 100BB but get it in if you have 500BB......

This is a truly awful pass, you raised pre to shallow the stacks out of position with a hand that can flop str8's/big draws just so when you get in these situations they are easy to play!


P.S. Rudders i play both those hands they had 6 handed, especially when the PFR is going to check fold the nuts.
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« Reply #13 on: June 19, 2007, 10:50:45 PM »

lol Really some fine bandit play! Folding nuts 3 way!

 I do wonder sometimes tho least shows u can fold, not ur standard call down till river then muck in disgust!
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GlasgowBandit
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« Reply #14 on: June 19, 2007, 11:15:10 PM »

lol Really some fine bandit play! Folding nuts 3 way!

 I do wonder sometimes tho least shows u can fold, not ur standard call down till river then muck in disgust!

Listen to Mr High Roller!  Lol - I have yet to loose money to you in a cash game.  :-)

If I played you heads up every week I wouldn't need to work.
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