Vegas & The Aftermath - Diary

[Tal]

*Facepalm

[tikay]

I have just learned that a word you use to avoid swearing (fiddlesticks, shucks, dang...), it is called a minced oath.

Language. Bloomin brilliant, ain't it?!

Very!

I had never heard of "Minced Oath" previously, in fact I was pretty sure the expression was false. I was very wrong.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minced_oath

It seems, more precisely, to mean a non-swearing way of swearing. "Darn" for "Damn", "ruddy" for "bloody".

It is a bit odd, because I very much dislike to see "written" swearing, I think it comes across terribly, but I'm 100% fine with the minced oath versions.  

Chompy, for example, & much as I diss his dreadful tipping & pokering ability, is a bright guy - VERY bright, bright enough to live well without ever doing a proper days work, uses "farking" instead of "fucking". Infinitely better, imo.

We do not, of course, need to swear to insult anyone, either. Now & then Methuselah Minor or Red will want to express a view strongly, but they do it with beautifully chosen words, an iron fist wrapped in a velvet glove. It's an absolute delight to see & read, too, almost a pleasure being attacked by them.

It is a generation gap thing of course, readily conceded, but swearing is still a no-go in so many parts of society, & I'm very glad about that. Newsreaders on TV, & for the most part, swearing on TV generally is not deemed acceptable. It's not acceptable in parts of business, either. I must have attended hundreds, if not thousands of Board Meetings as a Company Director, & I doubt I ever heard the word "fuck" once.

Next door, as part of our message, we do not allow it, either. Which causes a deal of mocking from some, but it does not seem to have harmed the business one iota, quite the opposite in fact. If I ever uttered a genuine profanity on the TV Show, I'd not wait for the message from upstairs, I'd just clear my desk & walk. And yes, I DO swear in the real world, but I think life has to be sub-divided into little compartments, where the rules are different.

I swore on a Live stream once, deliberately, though misguidely perhaps, different compartment, different rules. Of course I got some right stick for it, & I suppose rightly so, but it's hard to explain this compartment thing to those who don't want to understand.  

It's widely known that I love LilDave to bits, be in no doubt, I do, I think his crusade to make the poker world a better place, more enjoyable, less abuse, dissing & mocking, a GAME we ENJOY, is the greatest thing, & I hope to enjoin with him on that somehow. But, here's the thing.....

I have a "Sky Poker facing" Twitter feed, set up by the business for no other reason than for me to promote the business. And I try to mix it up a bit, dilute the % of spam with readable blogs & little anecdotes or stories that are not spam.  

So I started spamming Dave's Blog (& others), which did the blogs no harm at all, as I have a few thousand followers. But..........I had to stop doing it, because of the amount of profanities contained - it was not on message for us.  (I know Dave will understand what I'm saying, & I say it openly, not behind his back).

So, (I got there eventually), yes, language is THE most wonderful thing, & the great thing is that we all see it so differently. It will always be so, too.

Really interesting post. I think swearing can be absolutely f***ing fantastic and a gift to language. But it has to be used in the right context and not to the exception of other words. When someone simply replaces every other word with f*** it's not really the swearing that's offensive to me it's the absence of any real communication. It's just noise.

I don't see any reason ever to intentionally offend people, so in a context where people are offended by swearing then simply don't use it. But in a modern world, and even a modern workplace, to get overly offended by the way people speak seems as silly as insisting people strap bits of material around their necks to look smart. Oh wait, we still do that...

Phew - someone understood, & got where I was coming from. I think.....

Context = compartment.

"Noise", well we know what that means.

Life, people, language, all so incredibly fascinating, perceived so differently by so many.

[tikay]

*Facepalm

Oh dear - did I walk into something?

[AlunB]

I have just learned that a word you use to avoid swearing (fiddlesticks, shucks, dang...), it is called a minced oath.

Language. Bloomin brilliant, ain't it?!

Very!

I had never heard of "Minced Oath" previously, in fact I was pretty sure the expression was false. I was very wrong.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minced_oath

It seems, more precisely, to mean a non-swearing way of swearing. "Darn" for "Damn", "ruddy" for "bloody".

It is a bit odd, because I very much dislike to see "written" swearing, I think it comes across terribly, but I'm 100% fine with the minced oath versions.  

Chompy, for example, & much as I diss his dreadful tipping & pokering ability, is a bright guy - VERY bright, bright enough to live well without ever doing a proper days work, uses "farking" instead of "fucking". Infinitely better, imo.

We do not, of course, need to swear to insult anyone, either. Now & then Methuselah Minor or Red will want to express a view strongly, but they do it with beautifully chosen words, an iron fist wrapped in a velvet glove. It's an absolute delight to see & read, too, almost a pleasure being attacked by them.

It is a generation gap thing of course, readily conceded, but swearing is still a no-go in so many parts of society, & I'm very glad about that. Newsreaders on TV, & for the most part, swearing on TV generally is not deemed acceptable. It's not acceptable in parts of business, either. I must have attended hundreds, if not thousands of Board Meetings as a Company Director, & I doubt I ever heard the word "fuck" once.

Next door, as part of our message, we do not allow it, either. Which causes a deal of mocking from some, but it does not seem to have harmed the business one iota, quite the opposite in fact. If I ever uttered a genuine profanity on the TV Show, I'd not wait for the message from upstairs, I'd just clear my desk & walk. And yes, I DO swear in the real world, but I think life has to be sub-divided into little compartments, where the rules are different.

I swore on a Live stream once, deliberately, though misguidely perhaps, different compartment, different rules. Of course I got some right stick for it, & I suppose rightly so, but it's hard to explain this compartment thing to those who don't want to understand.  

It's widely known that I love LilDave to bits, be in no doubt, I do, I think his crusade to make the poker world a better place, more enjoyable, less abuse, dissing & mocking, a GAME we ENJOY, is the greatest thing, & I hope to enjoin with him on that somehow. But, here's the thing.....

I have a "Sky Poker facing" Twitter feed, set up by the business for no other reason than for me to promote the business. And I try to mix it up a bit, dilute the % of spam with readable blogs & little anecdotes or stories that are not spam.  

So I started spamming Dave's Blog (& others), which did the blogs no harm at all, as I have a few thousand followers. But..........I had to stop doing it, because of the amount of profanities contained - it was not on message for us.  (I know Dave will understand what I'm saying, & I say it openly, not behind his back).

So, (I got there eventually), yes, language is THE most wonderful thing, & the great thing is that we all see it so differently. It will always be so, too.

Really interesting post. I think swearing can be absolutely f***ing fantastic and a gift to language. But it has to be used in the right context and not to the exception of other words. When someone simply replaces every other word with f*** it's not really the swearing that's offensive to me it's the absence of any real communication. It's just noise.

I don't see any reason ever to intentionally offend people, so in a context where people are offended by swearing then simply don't use it. But in a modern world, and even a modern workplace, to get overly offended by the way people speak seems as silly as insisting people strap bits of material around their necks to look smart. Oh wait, we still do that...

Phew - someone understood, & got where I was coming from. I think.....

Context = compartment.

"Noise", well we know what that means.

Life, people, language, all so incredibly fascinating, perceived so differently by so many.

No I did, and I agree for the most part. Just because I think it's silly when people get overly offended doesn't mean I therefore think it's right to ignore them. Context is always so so important in any communication.

[Laxie]

*Facepalm

Oh dear - did I walk into something?

Thought you had, but changed my mind.

[tikay]

I have just learned that a word you use to avoid swearing (fiddlesticks, shucks, dang...), it is called a minced oath.

Language. Bloomin brilliant, ain't it?!

Very!

I had never heard of "Minced Oath" previously, in fact I was pretty sure the expression was false. I was very wrong.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minced_oath

It seems, more precisely, to mean a non-swearing way of swearing. "Darn" for "Damn", "ruddy" for "bloody".

It is a bit odd, because I very much dislike to see "written" swearing, I think it comes across terribly, but I'm 100% fine with the minced oath versions.   

Chompy, for example, & much as I diss his dreadful tipping & pokering ability, is a bright guy - VERY bright, bright enough to live well without ever doing a proper days work, uses "farking" instead of "fucking". Infinitely better, imo.

We do not, of course, need to swear to insult anyone, either. Now & then Methuselah Minor or Red will want to express a view strongly, but they do it with beautifully chosen words, an iron fist wrapped in a velvet glove. It's an absolute delight to see & read, too, almost a pleasure being attacked by them.

It is a generation gap thing of course, readily conceded, but swearing is still a no-go in so many parts of society, & I'm very glad about that. Newsreaders on TV, & for the most part, swearing on TV generally is not deemed acceptable. It's not acceptable in parts of business, either. I must have attended hundreds, if not thousands of Board Meetings as a Company Director, & I doubt I ever heard the word "fuck" once.

Next door, as part of our message, we do not allow it, either. Which causes a deal of mocking from some, but it does not seem to have harmed the business one iota, quite the opposite in fact. If I ever uttered a genuine profanity on the TV Show, I'd not wait for the message from upstairs, I'd just clear my desk & walk. And yes, I DO swear in the real world, but I think life has to be sub-divided into little compartments, where the rules are different.

I swore on a Live stream once, deliberately, though misguidely perhaps, different compartment, different rules. Of course I got some right stick for it, & I suppose rightly so, but it's hard to explain this compartment thing to those who don't want to understand. 

It's widely known that I love LilDave to bits, be in no doubt, I do, I think his crusade to make the poker world a better place, more enjoyable, less abuse, dissing & mocking, a GAME we ENJOY, is the greatest thing, & I hope to enjoin with him on that somehow. But, here's the thing.....

I have a "Sky Poker facing" Twitter feed, set up by the business for no other reason than for me to promote the business. And I try to mix it up a bit, dilute the % of spam with readable blogs & little anecdotes or stories that are not spam. 

So I started spamming Dave's Blog (& others), which did the blogs no harm at all, as I have a few thousand followers. But..........I had to stop doing it, because of the amount of profanities contained - it was not on message for us.  (I know Dave will understand what I'm saying, & I say it openly, not behind his back).

So, (I got there eventually), yes, language is THE most wonderful thing, & the great thing is that we all see it so differently. It will always be so, too.

Really interesting post. I think swearing can be absolutely f***ing fantastic and a gift to language. But it has to be used in the right context and not to the exception of other words. When someone simply replaces every other word with f*** it's not really the swearing that's offensive to me it's the absence of any real communication. It's just noise.

I don't see any reason ever to intentionally offend people, so in a context where people are offended by swearing then simply don't use it. But in a modern world, and even a modern workplace, to get overly offended by the way people speak seems as silly as insisting people strap bits of material around their necks to look smart. Oh wait, we still do that...

Phew - someone understood, & got where I was coming from. I think.....

Context = compartment.

"Noise", well we know what that means.

Life, people, language, all so incredibly fascinating, perceived so differently by so many.

No I did, and I agree for the most part. Just because I think it's silly when people get overly offended doesn't mean I therefore think it's right to ignore them. Context is always so so important in any communication.

Well yes, & there is a difference between "disliking" & "being offended". Inappropriate (time, place, compartment) bad language does not offend me, not at all, but I just don't like to see it. Big difference.

Deliberately inappropriate comments - as opposed to swearing - do offend me though. I know it is not intended literally, but comparisions between poker players deemed to be inferior, & those with physical or mental health issues, strikes me (and many others, be assured) as particularly insensitive & unfortunate. But in poker, or at least online - huge difference to real world - nobody seems to bat an eyelid.

I've been playing Online poker since it was invented, but I still shudder & wince at some of the stuff I see every day - and of course they would never say it face to face. I guess people think that it's OK Online. Different compartment.

[tikay]

*Facepalm

Oh dear - did I walk into something?

Thought you had, but changed my mind.

I seem to do it a lot these days. Ah well, whatever, as they say.

[AlunB]

I have just learned that a word you use to avoid swearing (fiddlesticks, shucks, dang...), it is called a minced oath.

Language. Bloomin brilliant, ain't it?!

Very!

I had never heard of "Minced Oath" previously, in fact I was pretty sure the expression was false. I was very wrong.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minced_oath

It seems, more precisely, to mean a non-swearing way of swearing. "Darn" for "Damn", "ruddy" for "bloody".

It is a bit odd, because I very much dislike to see "written" swearing, I think it comes across terribly, but I'm 100% fine with the minced oath versions.   

Chompy, for example, & much as I diss his dreadful tipping & pokering ability, is a bright guy - VERY bright, bright enough to live well without ever doing a proper days work, uses "farking" instead of "fucking". Infinitely better, imo.

We do not, of course, need to swear to insult anyone, either. Now & then Methuselah Minor or Red will want to express a view strongly, but they do it with beautifully chosen words, an iron fist wrapped in a velvet glove. It's an absolute delight to see & read, too, almost a pleasure being attacked by them.

It is a generation gap thing of course, readily conceded, but swearing is still a no-go in so many parts of society, & I'm very glad about that. Newsreaders on TV, & for the most part, swearing on TV generally is not deemed acceptable. It's not acceptable in parts of business, either. I must have attended hundreds, if not thousands of Board Meetings as a Company Director, & I doubt I ever heard the word "fuck" once.

Next door, as part of our message, we do not allow it, either. Which causes a deal of mocking from some, but it does not seem to have harmed the business one iota, quite the opposite in fact. If I ever uttered a genuine profanity on the TV Show, I'd not wait for the message from upstairs, I'd just clear my desk & walk. And yes, I DO swear in the real world, but I think life has to be sub-divided into little compartments, where the rules are different.

I swore on a Live stream once, deliberately, though misguidely perhaps, different compartment, different rules. Of course I got some right stick for it, & I suppose rightly so, but it's hard to explain this compartment thing to those who don't want to understand. 

It's widely known that I love LilDave to bits, be in no doubt, I do, I think his crusade to make the poker world a better place, more enjoyable, less abuse, dissing & mocking, a GAME we ENJOY, is the greatest thing, & I hope to enjoin with him on that somehow. But, here's the thing.....

I have a "Sky Poker facing" Twitter feed, set up by the business for no other reason than for me to promote the business. And I try to mix it up a bit, dilute the % of spam with readable blogs & little anecdotes or stories that are not spam. 

So I started spamming Dave's Blog (& others), which did the blogs no harm at all, as I have a few thousand followers. But..........I had to stop doing it, because of the amount of profanities contained - it was not on message for us.  (I know Dave will understand what I'm saying, & I say it openly, not behind his back).

So, (I got there eventually), yes, language is THE most wonderful thing, & the great thing is that we all see it so differently. It will always be so, too.

Really interesting post. I think swearing can be absolutely f***ing fantastic and a gift to language. But it has to be used in the right context and not to the exception of other words. When someone simply replaces every other word with f*** it's not really the swearing that's offensive to me it's the absence of any real communication. It's just noise.

I don't see any reason ever to intentionally offend people, so in a context where people are offended by swearing then simply don't use it. But in a modern world, and even a modern workplace, to get overly offended by the way people speak seems as silly as insisting people strap bits of material around their necks to look smart. Oh wait, we still do that...

Phew - someone understood, & got where I was coming from. I think.....

Context = compartment.

"Noise", well we know what that means.

Life, people, language, all so incredibly fascinating, perceived so differently by so many.

No I did, and I agree for the most part. Just because I think it's silly when people get overly offended doesn't mean I therefore think it's right to ignore them. Context is always so so important in any communication.

Well yes, & there is a difference between "disliking" & "being offended". Inappropriate (time, place, compartment) bad language does not offend me, not at all, but I just don't like to see it. Big difference.

Deliberately inappropriate comments - as opposed to swearing - do offend me though. I know it is not intended literally, but comparisions between poker players deemed to be inferior, & those with physical or mental health issues, strikes me (and many others, be assured) as particularly insensitive & unfortunate. But in poker, or at least online - huge difference to real world - nobody seems to bat an eyelid.

I've been playing Online poker since it was invented, but I still shudder & wince at some of the stuff I see every day - and of course they would never say it face to face. I guess people think that it's OK Online. Different compartment.

Oh that's a whole other conversation. Try going on some other forums, or just reading some twitter feeds. What passes as 'banter' is depressing at best. And that's not even getting into trolling. The interwebs really does bring out the worst in people at times.

[Tal]

It was just this bit that got me facepalming:


But in a modern world, and even a modern workplace, to get overly offended by the way people speak seems as silly as insisting people strap bits of material around their necks to look smart. Oh wait, we still do that...

Everything else was arguing that context is key and this last sentence is apparently arguing function over form.

I like formality in the right place. I like wearing a suit to go to work, even though I don't have face-to-face interaction with the public. I dont mind that I can say words to my friends that I wouldn't use within earshot of my mother, even if given a rocket to get away in. I don't like the idea of getting married in jeans or using the F word as a word to be used while you're thinking of another word.

Context is critical because language is a communication device and, as such, should be focussed entirely on the audience. You wouldn't swear to your mother any more than you would use tell a toddler her verbosity was superfluous, any more than you would speak to me when we next meet in Klingon. The reason why it wouldn't work is less important than the very fact it wouldn't work. We naturally tailor our language, our level of interaction, our body language and our delivery to suit the recipient.

A war on swearing is equally missing the point and that seems to be accepted by all.

In the words of Ireland's finest, "a man who calls a spade a spade should be fit only to use one; it's all he's good for".

[Tal]

By point of clarification, "audience" includes anyone else within earshot, whether involved in the conversation or not. This is partly perhaps where the debate about Team Eureka started, IMO: it's those who were there on a more noisy or energetic day who were put off from joining the game. Team Eureka might never have known they were even contemplating joining the game.

That is purely an example and may not be justified in that case, I accept. Interesting tho.

[tikay]

It was just this bit that got me facepalming:


But in a modern world, and even a modern workplace, to get overly offended by the way people speak seems as silly as insisting people strap bits of material around their necks to look smart. Oh wait, we still do that...

Everything else was arguing that context is key and this last sentence is apparently arguing function over form.

I like formality in the right place. I like wearing a suit to go to work, even though I don't have face-to-face interaction with the public. I dont mind that I can say words to my friends that I wouldn't use within earshot of my mother, even if given a rocket to get away in. I don't like the idea of getting married in jeans or using the F word as a word to be used while you're thinking of another word.

Context is critical because language is a communication device and, as such, should be focussed entirely on the audience. You wouldn't swear to your mother any more than you would use tell a toddler her verbosity was superfluous, any more than you would speak to me when we next meet in Klingon. The reason why it wouldn't work is less important than the very fact it wouldn't work. We naturally tailor our language, our level of interaction, our body language and our delivery to suit the recipient.

A war on swearing is equally missing the point and that seems to be accepted by all.

In the words of Ireland's finest, "a man who calls a spade should be fit only to use one; it's all he's good for".

That is a fantastic Post. Oh that I could even begin to explain my thoughts one tenth as well.

[smashedagain]

As this is a different compartment.......here's Lil Dave's latest blog.

See, there is a difference.


http://lildaveslife.blogspot.co.uk/

sick slow roll. Read that one a few days ago

[AlunB]

It was just this bit that got me facepalming:


But in a modern world, and even a modern workplace, to get overly offended by the way people speak seems as silly as insisting people strap bits of material around their necks to look smart. Oh wait, we still do that...

Everything else was arguing that context is key and this last sentence is apparently arguing function over form.

I like formality in the right place. I like wearing a suit to go to work, even though I don't have face-to-face interaction with the public. I dont mind that I can say words to my friends that I wouldn't use within earshot of my mother, even if given a rocket to get away in. I don't like the idea of getting married in jeans or using the F word as a word to be used while you're thinking of another word.

Context is critical because language is a communication device and, as such, should be focussed entirely on the audience. You wouldn't swear to your mother any more than you would use tell a toddler her verbosity was superfluous, any more than you would speak to me when we next meet in Klingon. The reason why it wouldn't work is less important than the very fact it wouldn't work. We naturally tailor our language, our level of interaction, our body language and our delivery to suit the recipient.

A war on swearing is equally missing the point and that seems to be accepted by all.

In the words of Ireland's finest, "a man who calls a spade a spade should be fit only to use one; it's all he's good for".

You seem to be disagreeing with me and simultaneously agreeing with me. Good work! I was making a joke. I'm sorry that you didn't get it.

[AlunB]

Actually I take that back. Ironically in a post about communication I made my point pretty badly and you are right to pick me up on it. We clearly agree on this and it would be daft to fall out over a minor point about ties made mostly for (failed) comic effect.

[Tal]

Actually I take that back. Ironically in a post about communication I made my point pretty badly and you are right to pick me up on it. We clearly agree on this and it would be daft to fall out over a minor point about ties made mostly for (failed) comic effect.

No problem, squire.

All good.