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goldfoxdom
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« on: October 12, 2007, 03:32:10 AM » |
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Tonight after busting out of the tournament i decided to play some 1/2 cash. I sat down and after about 3 hours i was dealt AA. I raise to 18 pre flop and get 2 callers the flop comes A39 rainbow i bet 40 pound and the bloke calls instantly. I then bet 40 on the turn which he also calls instantly. The river comes a 2 at which point i have 220 infront of me and he has about 160. I go all in and he instant calls and he shows AQ and says "can u believe that". I show AA.
He then says he didnt see i had him covered and refuses to give me the money from the bet on the river, i says what do u mean and he replies " u were hiding them". At no point was i hiding my chips and a manager is called. He says he only saw 60 pound worth of chips as i bet the river and he refuses to pay me.
The manager checks the cv and says that i was slighly hiding them but not intentially. She rings another casino and they state i must be givin the pot as he declared Call.. he refuses to pay and give me 60 pound and leaves.
Thanks for your help.
Dom
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« Last Edit: October 15, 2007, 06:37:18 AM by goldfoxdom »
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Graham C
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« Reply #1 on: October 12, 2007, 08:36:45 AM » |
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I think that's well out of order and the casino should think twice about letting him back in.
Poor show.
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LeKnave
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« Reply #2 on: October 12, 2007, 09:14:51 AM » |
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Something slightly similar happened at Leeds Grosvenor once: http://blondepoker.com/forum/index.php?topic=18973.0This one is a clear angle shot. If he tabled the winner would he only ask for £60 as thats all he thought you had? Its all his fault, and he should've asked for a count, bollocks ruling from the casino. |
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portfolio
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« Reply #3 on: October 12, 2007, 09:48:35 AM » |
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Tonight after busting out of the tournament i decided to play some 1/2 cash. I sat down and after about 3 hours i was dealt AA. I raise to 18 pre flop and get 2 callers the flop comes A39 rainbow i bet 40 pound and the bloke calls instantly. I then bet 40 on the turn which he also calls instantly. The river comes a 2 at which point i have 220 infront of me and he has about 160. I go all in and he instant calls and he shows AQ and says "can u believe that". I show AA.
He then says he didnt see i had him covered and refuses to give me the money from the bet on the river, i says what do u mean and he replies " u were hiding them". At no point was i hiding my chips and a manager is called. He says he only saw 60 pound worth of chips as i bet the river and he refuses to pay me.
The manager checks the cv and says that i was slighly hiding them but not intentially. She rings another casino and they state i must be givin the pot as he declared Call.. he refuses to pay and give me 60 pound and leaves.
I want to no what i can do about this and what are your thoughts. I personally think its disgusting and he only did it because i am a young lad.
Thanks for your help.
Dom
there seems to be some doubt on visibility in your own words, so you may learn for the future not to let the angle shooters in !! a better/stronger/more knowledgeable mgr may have suggested the player either pay up, or be barred from all grosvenors for cheating, which all casinos take v seriously. |
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ripple11
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« Reply #4 on: October 12, 2007, 10:00:04 AM » |
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Whayever happens DON"T ban the guy with such fantastic play as that  |
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LLevan
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« Reply #5 on: October 12, 2007, 11:03:10 AM » |
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Surely if the casino ruling was that the player should pay the full amount then if the other player only pays £60 of it the casino is responsible for the balance since they are charging table money to play in their casino. Personally I would have asked the card room manager to get the casino to pay the balance. By charging table money/rake/session fees or whatever else you want to call the charges the casino should be responsible for all monies and thats surely the reason anyone would play in a licensed premises rather than an unlicensed premises to know you have the security of your money being guaranteed.
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Wardonkey
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« Reply #6 on: October 12, 2007, 11:29:50 AM » |
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The casino can't be held responsible for one player stealing from another.
If the casino was held 'responsible for all monies' in a poker game then they would be leaving themselves open to all sorts of scams.
The money you pay is for the dealer, space and facilities and does not extend to some kind of insurance against thieves.
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LLevan
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« Reply #7 on: October 12, 2007, 11:44:08 AM » |
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The casino can't be held responsible for one player stealing from another.
If the casino was held 'responsible for all monies' in a poker game then they would be leaving themselves open to all sorts of scams.
The money you pay is for the dealer, space and facilities and does not extend to some kind of insurance against thieves.
So basically you are offered no security whatsoever from the casino and to a certain extent they are condoning stealing within their building. Surely this is even more open to scams than them policing the games within their premises. |
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The_duke
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« Reply #8 on: October 12, 2007, 11:48:27 AM » |
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That was disgusting -- Car Park, Baseball bat & right now comes to mind
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A great many people believe they are thinking, when in fact they are just rearranging their prejudices
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byronkincaid
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« Reply #9 on: October 12, 2007, 11:51:31 AM » |
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The casino can't be held responsible for one player stealing from another.
If the casino was held 'responsible for all monies' in a poker game then they would be leaving themselves open to all sorts of scams.
The money you pay is for the dealer, space and facilities and does not extend to some kind of insurance against thieves.
i read a thread like this once where the guy kicked up a huge fuss and insisted on calling the police and the casino took him away from the table, gave him the money and said please don't tell anyone we've given it to you. surely better for them to cough up than to have the police coming inside and disrupting the rest of the night? |
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« Last Edit: October 12, 2007, 12:44:48 PM by byronkincaid »
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Wardonkey
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« Reply #10 on: October 12, 2007, 11:55:49 AM » |
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The casino can't be held responsible for one player stealing from another.
If the casino was held 'responsible for all monies' in a poker game then they would be leaving themselves open to all sorts of scams.
The money you pay is for the dealer, space and facilities and does not extend to some kind of insurance against thieves.
So basically you are offered no security whatsoever from the casino and to a certain extent they are condoning stealing within their building. Surely this is even more open to scams than them policing the games within their premises. In what way is the casino condoning theft? |
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Wardonkey
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« Reply #11 on: October 12, 2007, 12:07:18 PM » |
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A casino can choose to make a discretionary payment if it wishes, but it is under no obligation to do so.
A casino may well make a small payment as a gesture of goodwill, but to expect them to guarantee the sums involved in larger cash games is ridiculous.
In tournaments, where the the casino holds all the money, then they will guarantee the security of the game. In a cash game, where the players hold the money, they can't be expected to be held responsible for the integrity of every player.
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LLevan
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« Reply #12 on: October 12, 2007, 12:11:56 PM » |
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The casino can't be held responsible for one player stealing from another.
If the casino was held 'responsible for all monies' in a poker game then they would be leaving themselves open to all sorts of scams.
The money you pay is for the dealer, space and facilities and does not extend to some kind of insurance against thieves.
So basically you are offered no security whatsoever from the casino and to a certain extent they are condoning stealing within their building. Surely this is even more open to scams than them policing the games within their premises. In what way is the casino condoning theft? In the described instance they allowed the player to leave the premises having only paid £60 out of the £160 they had ruled he should pay. Presumably he still had chips or did they also allow him to change the chips to cash as well as blatantly not paying what they said should be paid. Now if he was involved in attempting to steal money from a table game they would have got the police involved and prosecuted. What right do the casinos have to be granted a license to host games and take charges where a punter does not feel safe and secure in the knowledge that his money is protected. |
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Wardonkey
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« Reply #13 on: October 12, 2007, 12:40:36 PM » |
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It's not been said if the player left with cash or chips, both are often used on poker tables.
You can't stop someone from leaving if they wish to do so.
For a poker game to be played there has to be an element of trust. Occasionally someone will break this trust. In most instances the best course of action is to suck it up and resolve not to play with that person again.
Casinos should and do bar people who cheat or steal.
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portfolio
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« Reply #14 on: October 12, 2007, 01:23:59 PM » |
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on the way out he had the cheat to put "my" money on the roulette.
glad to see your over it tho !! only by banning cheats can casionos make a better environment to play in. |
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