APAT Tournament Hand of the Week: November 5th

[George2Loose]

I still prefer to flat call the flop bet in position without building a huge pot on this type of board- I believe I have the ability to find plenty of other spots in a deep stacked tournament without having to get all my chips in this spot.

[Longy]

how do you have fold equity when you stick all your chips in the middle?

Erm beacuse in the process of raising to get to the point where we are all in, he folds his hand a certain amount of time. I accept that you think we are already beaten, i disagree, if thats the case surely we fold the flop.

[boldie]

how do you have fold equity when you stick all your chips in the middle?

Erm beacuse in the process of raising to get to the point where we are all in, he folds his hand a certain amount of time. I accept that you think we are already beaten, i disagree, if thats the case surely we fold the flop.

See, I'm thinking he's the one who is likely to push when I reraise him therefore the fold equity isn't really with me. It's one of the reasons I don't like talking about fold equity sometimes because in my opinion, in this case, it's with oppo rather than yourself. (contentious I know). The reason I wouldn't fold the flop is because I have a fairly decent piece of it and it's the sort of board where I could still take the pot if I'm behind now (admittedly I might not be) and the right card comes down for me (anything that can scare him or give me the FH

[MANTIS01]

Part II

The action gets to me after the 1,500 bet. I think the amount here is a little excessive and my worry is that if I just call the bet I allow the bb to get involved either by calling or raising and in addition I think the turn card could complicate matters. So I decide to act now on the flop and re-pop the mp player to the tune of 4,500.

He looks surprised by this...thinks...is unsure...then calls the extra 3,000.

So we go to the turn with 10,400 chips in the pot....

The Turn

 

and this makes a board of

      

My opponent considers his options and then bets a surprising 4,000

What are your thoughts about this hand now and what is the best way to proceed? In my mind this has turned into a bit of a puzzle.

If my opponent is on a strong hand and fears the outdraw why over-bet the flop, only call the re-raise and then give the draw great odds to call? Alternatively, does his actions now suggest he is on a draw himself, tried to buy the pot on the flop and now on the turn is putting in some sort of blocker bet?

After this strange small bet on the turn there is now 14,400 chips in the pot and we have 13,600 remaining chips.

So the question is...What are you going to do now and why??

[Longy]

Well firstly clearly villan is an idiot and his actions are quite hard to figure out, on the basis he probably hasn't got a clue what he is doing himself and why.

I think im going to shove, the turn is a total blank and changes nothing. I believe we were ahead on the flop and while the action is frankly bizarre, given my views on villan I still think we are. I see this alot from bad players and they rarely have a super strong hand here.

My range for villan is any kq,kj,kx of diamonds, some bizarre combo draw and of course some hands that beat us k10,k9 being the most likely, it is less likely but of course possible that he has qj,99,1010 and even aa (yes i really do see ppl play aa like this). Also this may well be the same hand.

Im shoving for value and to give draws the wrong price.

[jezza777]

pushing here maks his decision really easy doesn't it ? he pases all one pair hands and only calls with hands that are ahead. He has played this so strangely i have no idea where we are.

[kinboshi]

Well firstly clearly villan is an idiot...

Not possibly a relative novice, a beginner, an unorthodox player, but an idiot. 

[Paullie_D]

Well firstly clearly villan is an idiot...

Not possibly a relative novice, a beginner, an unorthodox player, but an idiot. 

Whatever, we are behind to so much here (any better 2 pair, trips str8 etc) but we're not dead yet, with 3:1+ on offer, I'm inclined just to call and see what the river brings and see what he does then.

[Graham C]

Trouble with calling is that he's going to push all in on the river then it's down to us again to make a decision.  I agree with Longy, and would push all in.  I'd put him on AK here. As I mentioned in my post about the flop, he's regretted not raising preflop with a big hand and now fears what he's let in and is overplaying his hand.

[goodluck2me]

Fold preflop he obviously has the straight.


Lucky lloyd, you are obviously just a gamler, and getting your chips in here is -ve if you ask me. people like you make tight play so profitable.

[boldie]

Well firstly clearly villan is an idiot...

Not possibly a relative novice, a beginner, an unorthodox player, but an idiot. 

I would almost start to think Villain knows what he's doing and is over acting being surprised at the call. He can't believe his luck that he got a caller and just thought "ok, how do I play this now?..ok I'll call and stick in a relativey small bet on the turn"..interesting if he is indeed miles ahead and if he is I love his play against someone who does think he knows what he's doing. If yuor oppo know he's up against a "thinking" player and is acting this out he's a genius and certainly not a clown.

There is no difference between calling and shoving here really. Your chips will go in the middle anyways as if you don't fold here you are beyond folding. might aswell shove here (it's the manly thing to do when the choice is between calling for all your chips or shoving them into a monster) and cry as Villain turns over his mighty mighty hand and everybody points and laughs at you at having been soo grossly outplayed and out-thought


disclaimer..OK maybe they didn't point and laugh...but wouldn't that have been funny?

disclaimer nr2...I could of course be completely wrong about you losing this hand

[Paullie_D]

Trouble with calling is that he's going to push all in on the river then it's down to us again to make a decision.  I agree with Longy, and would push all in.  I'd put him on AK here. As I mentioned in my post about the flop, he's regretted not raising preflop with a big hand and now fears what he's let in and is overplaying his hand.

Nothing wrong with a little discussion..perhaps you are right but will he push the river? Longy seems to think he's a donk..but he might not be...do you really want to gamble with your tournament life on this read? Maybe..but not me. If we call here we still have c.10k back which is still playable at 200/400.

If you really think he's got AK and will push the river then you are gonna call anyway unless the board pairs against you. Maybe the river isn't free..but it's cheap enough!

[Longy]

Well firstly clearly villan is an idiot...

Not possibly a relative novice, a beginner, an unorthodox player, but an idiot. 

Lol im in one of those moods today, yes Kinboshi your description is probably fairer, but i will stick with idiot.

[TightEnd]

I push, against this standard of opponent. In particular I am assuming this opponents "reads" are what they seem and not reverse tells, if so you must be ahead


I must confess to having no idea whatsoever about his turn bet!!

[LuckyLloyd]

Fold preflop he obviously has the straight.


Lucky lloyd, you are obviously just a gamler, and getting your chips in here is -ve if you ask me. people like you make tight play so profitable.

And the degen in me says to shove the balls off this turn.