Drugs in poker

[PocketLady]

In my case, having never touched recreational drugs in my life (cigarettes excluded)

Tony, do you not consider alcohol to be a recreational drug then? an interesting viewpoint when you do put cigarettes into that group

or was it just an age related oversight?

Yes, it was an oversight, age-related or not.

In mitigation, I have not touched alcohol for 39 wonderful years.

 

I assumed that was just an oversight

but what about the follow up question re caffeine? do you not consider that to be a recreational drug?

I'm really interested in how people put this big divide between legal and illegal substances

To be honest I don't really think about caffeine as being a drug, although it is.  That's probably due the fact that there are no sale restrictions on buying coffee and coca cola and the like.  Caffeine isn't at all dangerous in the amounts people generally consume, but as with everything if you take too much it will kill you.  I see caffeine as more of a necessity.  It isn't a recreational drug because I don't take it for fun or to make me feel good.  I probably either take it after I have been up all night doing other drugs (ie alcohol) and need to stay awake, and I also have many not so fond memories of caffeine overdosing at uni trying to stay up all night cramming for exams.  Once I took a whole box of pro plus, 5 cups of tea, and 2 cans of red bull over night because I had an exam the next day.  I was shaking for hours and I narrowly avoided passing out and puking on the bus on my way home.  It wasn't pretty.

In my mind there are two different types of drugs; those which are recreational and those which are medical.  Although caffeine doesn't really fit into either of these categories, because the effects of caffeine aren't generally as strong or enjoyable as the consumption of recreational drugs like alcohol and cannabis, I'm more inclinded to see it more as I perhaps see paracetamol.  It's there to provide a purpose, to keep me awake, just like paracetamol gets me through the day if I have a headache.  As to whether it could enhance performance in poker - although caffeine can help make you more alert in a game, the effects of it aren't very natural.  I'm not sure about anyone else, but for me to play my best game I need to be concentrating and alert and be able to trust my instincts.  The use of any drug wouldn't help with that because you will never be in your usual frame of mind when you are on them, and I personally would lack confidence in myself and my actions because of that. 

[PocketLady]

Some drugs do of course transend the barrier of medical vs recreational, like cannabis and alcohol.  They have medical purposes as well as recreational ones, and opium as well while I think about it.

[GlasgowBandit]

Some drugs do of course transend the barrier of medical vs recreational, like cannabis and alcohol.  They have medical purposes as well as recreational ones, and opium as well while I think about it.

So too does coke when we go to the dentists

I prefer to do my own fillings now

[boldie]

Some drugs do of course transend the barrier of medical vs recreational, like cannabis and alcohol.  They have medical purposes as well as recreational ones, and opium as well while I think about it.

So too does coke when we go to the dentists

I prefer to do my own fillings now

you're hardcore mate

[ShatnerPants]

Strip snap is still a sport though.

 

[Supernova]

Some drugs do of course transend the barrier of medical vs recreational, like cannabis and alcohol.  They have medical purposes as well as recreational ones, and opium as well while I think about it.

So too does coke when we go to the dentists

I prefer to do my own fillings now

Make friends with your dentist, chances are he'll give you a line from his own stash while he does your filling and if you insist he partakes too, he may even forget to bill you

[Jon MW]

...  Caffeine isn't at all dangerous in the amounts people generally consume,... 

caffeine is probably one of the drugs with the best claim to being a 'wonder drug' precisely because it isn't dangerous and does have a profound effect - unfortunately none of us can make use of that effect because we're all so used to it day in day out.

[s.tahcker]

I don't get - what on earth makes folks want to do it?

-They find life boring
-They are trying to block out unpleasant feelings/memories
-Peer pressure
-Once they start, they're addicted

Again as many people have said before it's the same as asking why do people drink alcohol?  They drink it to make them feel good and give them confidence, for the most part.  Drugs make you feel good, and quite often without the nasty hangover that alcohol brings.  Obviously a lot of people might say "Well if you are happy with your life then you shouldn't need to use drugs to make you feel good."  Whilst it's true that unhappy people are most likely to become alcoholics or drug addicts, for many people drugs are an experience.  A friend of mine once told me about something called Saliva which is a legal drug originating from Mexico (I think) which Shamans used to use to obtain a higher level of consciousness.  Two of my friends tried it once at home.  One of them was convinced that they were actually a floorboard, and the other fell in love with a giant Winne The Pooh which was behind the sofa.  All safe experiences but an experience that you are never going to be able to have otherwise (although not an experience everyone will want to have I'm sure...), and I think the whole point of life is to experience as much as you can while you're here.  The problem is when the addiction comes along.

Like I said previously, the worst drug I have ever done is smoked weed, nothing that serious.  I remember one night I had been at one of my local casinos playing a comp when a few of us decide we were going to go back to one of our friends house to carry on the night with some more poker and booze etc.  It just so happened that this guy was a drug dealer, mainly in the form of growing and selling weed.  So we went to his house and he produced this huge box full of weed, never seen anything like it before, and just basically said help yourselves.  As the night went on some coke was produced from somewhere, and my boyfriend of the time asked me if I wanted some.  Although personally I think I would like to experience some of these narcotics in my life, I'm fully aware that I get addicted to stuff extremely easily.  I smoke and play poker for starters!  So I declined on the basis that if I liked it, I know it could easily turn into a habit and I'm not ever going to let that happen. 

I can understand the people who hate drugs and alcohol, are tee total, and want them both to be banned.  But I cannot understand the people who think drinking is ok - and smashing up windows and people's faces, and threatening people and throwing up, and killing people in drink driving accidents - but that cannabis (and others) is not ok.  And in my opinion this all comes from the fact that the governement tells us alcohol is ok (because it's legal) and that drugs are not.  Drugs are bad and we all have that drilled into us from when we are old enough to go to school.  They tell us about the extreme cases, kids dying from taking one E, coke addicts becoming prostitutes, people getting HIV from sharing needles, Amy Winehouse, and this becomes the public perspective on drugs.  But if anyone cared to actually think about it for themselves for a while and considered the possibility that the government isn't always right, then their perspective might change somewhat when they see that for the most part drugs aren't actually like that at all.  For example I asked a friend (completely tee total, anti drugs, anti everything) last night if they would rather be sat next to a drunk person or a person on drugs in a poker game.  They immediately said "Drunk" as a reflex, but once they'd thought about it said "Oh actually I'm not too sure." 


I think youre showing your age a wee bit pocketlady.I couldnt care less if people use drugs but to say governement tells us alcohol is ok isnt correct.Common sense tells us what would happen if they banned alcohol  ,they can't ,its too late.Alcohol is a big problem to the governement with money spent on the nhs and police but not as bigger problem as drugs.Drugs are not legal and your friendly drug dealer dosn't really know what hes selling you.So one week youll get one thing and another something else.Thats where most od's come from the strenth changing and substance and the user not knowing. They would like to ban alcohol so how could they now make drugs legal?Drugs are far more dangerous.In most cases if you drink to much you end up in bed with the hebejebies.Many drugs you take too much of you dont live to tell the tale.

[boldie]

I don't get - what on earth makes folks want to do it?

-They find life boring
-They are trying to block out unpleasant feelings/memories
-Peer pressure
-Once they start, they're addicted

Again as many people have said before it's the same as asking why do people drink alcohol?  They drink it to make them feel good and give them confidence, for the most part.  Drugs make you feel good, and quite often without the nasty hangover that alcohol brings.  Obviously a lot of people might say "Well if you are happy with your life then you shouldn't need to use drugs to make you feel good."  Whilst it's true that unhappy people are most likely to become alcoholics or drug addicts, for many people drugs are an experience.  A friend of mine once told me about something called Saliva which is a legal drug originating from Mexico (I think) which Shamans used to use to obtain a higher level of consciousness.  Two of my friends tried it once at home.  One of them was convinced that they were actually a floorboard, and the other fell in love with a giant Winne The Pooh which was behind the sofa.  All safe experiences but an experience that you are never going to be able to have otherwise (although not an experience everyone will want to have I'm sure...), and I think the whole point of life is to experience as much as you can while you're here.  The problem is when the addiction comes along.

Like I said previously, the worst drug I have ever done is smoked weed, nothing that serious.  I remember one night I had been at one of my local casinos playing a comp when a few of us decide we were going to go back to one of our friends house to carry on the night with some more poker and booze etc.  It just so happened that this guy was a drug dealer, mainly in the form of growing and selling weed.  So we went to his house and he produced this huge box full of weed, never seen anything like it before, and just basically said help yourselves.  As the night went on some coke was produced from somewhere, and my boyfriend of the time asked me if I wanted some.  Although personally I think I would like to experience some of these narcotics in my life, I'm fully aware that I get addicted to stuff extremely easily.  I smoke and play poker for starters!  So I declined on the basis that if I liked it, I know it could easily turn into a habit and I'm not ever going to let that happen. 

I can understand the people who hate drugs and alcohol, are tee total, and want them both to be banned.  But I cannot understand the people who think drinking is ok - and smashing up windows and people's faces, and threatening people and throwing up, and killing people in drink driving accidents - but that cannabis (and others) is not ok.  And in my opinion this all comes from the fact that the governement tells us alcohol is ok (because it's legal) and that drugs are not.  Drugs are bad and we all have that drilled into us from when we are old enough to go to school.  They tell us about the extreme cases, kids dying from taking one E, coke addicts becoming prostitutes, people getting HIV from sharing needles, Amy Winehouse, and this becomes the public perspective on drugs.  But if anyone cared to actually think about it for themselves for a while and considered the possibility that the government isn't always right, then their perspective might change somewhat when they see that for the most part drugs aren't actually like that at all.  For example I asked a friend (completely tee total, anti drugs, anti everything) last night if they would rather be sat next to a drunk person or a person on drugs in a poker game.  They immediately said "Drunk" as a reflex, but once they'd thought about it said "Oh actually I'm not too sure." 


I think youre showing your age a wee bit pocketlady.I couldnt care less if people use drugs but to say governement tells us alcohol is ok isnt correct.Common sense tells us what would happen if they banned alcohol  ,they can't ,its too late.Alcohol is a big problem to the governement with money spent on the nhs and police but not as bigger problem as drugs.Drugs are not legal and your friendly drug dealer dosn't really know what hes selling you.So one week youll get one thing and another something else.Thats where most od's come from the strenth changing and substance and the user not knowing. They would like to ban alcohol so how could they now make drugs legal?Drugs are far more dangerous.In most cases if you drink to much you end up in bed with the hebejebies.Many drugs you take too much of you dont live to tell the tale.

I would be hiding now, if i were you lol

[ShatnerPants]

I'm really interested in how people put this big divide between legal and illegal substances

Respect for the law / society.  Probably totally unwarranted, especially in this day and age.  

Same thing as sex.  Some sex acts used to be illegal, and now aren't.  Some sex acts are still theorectically illegal.

But if two consenting adults get on down in the privacy of their own home, then I don't care what they get up to.  I just don't want to see it in public.  ( Now if I've paid good money to watch it on dvd - again, privately - that's a different matter.  )

With one proviso.  

As long as it's not affecting anyone else.

If someone wants to get drunk in a pub, then I think it's fair that society puts a restriction on their activities.   But at home if they want to drink themselves unconcious, and choke themselves on their own vomit, no probs.  Again, if they get drunk, then go home and beat their partner, I think it's fair that we judge them against what society decides is reasonable behaviour.

Taking that to comparing drugs.  If someone has a line, then goes out, not a problem.  If they're out, and want more, then go and sit in someones car ( someone hopefully not on drugs, that is ) and do it.  Don't do it in a public loo.  Then if they reenter the public building, the bouncers can judge as to whether their behaviour is ok, or if it's too bad, then either refuse entry, or put them in a chilling room for half an hour ( or however long it takes to come down just enough so their behaviour is no longer offensive.)

That's just my opinion, not the way things happen in real life, I know.

Is it true that until recently, getting caught supplying grass was a couple of years inside.  Supplying heroine is 10 - 15 years.  But now they've changed the law so that supplying grass gets the same stretch ?

If so that seems really, really stupid to me.

[Claw75]

...  Caffeine isn't at all dangerous in the amounts people generally consume,... 

caffeine is probably one of the drugs with the best claim to being a 'wonder drug' precisely because it isn't dangerous and does have a profound effect - unfortunately none of us can make use of that effect because we're all so used to it day in day out.

I know I'm addicted to caffeine.  I drink about a litre of diet coke a day.  I don't notice the effects of the caffeine unless I go without for a while.  If I don't have any for a period of as little as one day I start to get tetchy and irritable (very similar to nicotine withdrawal).  In that respect, I suppose I'm making use of the effect because it's keeping me 'normal'

[ShatnerPants]

I think youre showing your age a wee bit pocketlady.I couldnt care less if people use drugs but to say governement tells us alcohol is ok isnt correct.Common sense tells us what would happen if they banned alcohol  ,they can't ,its too late.Alcohol is a big problem to the governement with money spent on the nhs and police but not as bigger problem as drugs.Drugs are not legal and your friendly drug dealer dosn't really know what hes selling you.So one week youll get one thing and another something else.Thats where most od's come from the strenth changing and substance and the user not knowing. They would like to ban alcohol so how could they now make drugs legal?Drugs are far more dangerous.In most cases if you drink to much you end up in bed with the hebejebies.Many drugs you take too much of you dont live to tell the tale.

Is that true ?  Or is it that they don't care what they're selling you ?

And is it fair to tar all dealers with the same brush ?

[Acidmouse]

I think youre showing your age a wee bit pocketlady.I couldnt care less if people use drugs but to say governement tells us alcohol is ok isnt correct.Common sense tells us what would happen if they banned alcohol  ,they can't ,its too late.Alcohol is a big problem to the governement with money spent on the nhs and police but not as bigger problem as drugs.Drugs are not legal and your friendly drug dealer dosn't really know what hes selling you.So one week youll get one thing and another something else.Thats where most od's come from the strenth changing and substance and the user not knowing. They would like to ban alcohol so how could they now make drugs legal?Drugs are far more dangerous.In most cases if you drink to much you end up in bed with the hebejebies.Many drugs you take too much of you dont live to tell the tale.

Is that true ?  Or is it that they don't care what they're selling you ?

And is it fair to tar all dealers with the same brush ?

Yes perish the thought we actually prejudged DRUG dealers.

[Josedinho]

Is it true that until recently, getting caught supplying grass was a couple of years inside.  Supplying heroine is 10 - 15 years.  But now they've changed the law so that supplying grass gets the same stretch ?

If so that seems really, really stupid to me.

Why?

[ShatnerPants]

...  Caffeine isn't at all dangerous in the amounts people generally consume,... 

caffeine is probably one of the drugs with the best claim to being a 'wonder drug' precisely because it isn't dangerous and does have a profound effect - unfortunately none of us can make use of that effect because we're all so used to it day in day out.

I know I'm addicted to caffeine.  I drink about a litre of diet coke a day.  I don't notice the effects of the caffeine unless I go without for a while.  If I don't have any for a period of as little as one day I start to get tetchy and irritable (very similar to nicotine withdrawal).  In that respect, I suppose I'm making use of the effect because it's keeping me 'normal'

Very interesting.  I drink a couple of cups of tea / coffee every day. I don't notice it having any effect on me at the time ( if I'm feeling droopy I'll drink red bull, which does seem to have an effect ).   And  I don't notice any 'withdrawal' symptoms if I don't drink it for a while.

But I drink most days.  1/2 bottle of wine most days during the week, and just a little more at the weekend.  I used to be a real drinker, but cut down about 6 or 7 years ago, naturally, not out of any concious decision.

In the old days, if I went even a couple of days without a drink, I'd notice it.  Nowadays I don't notice anything particlular, apart from the fact that I can look back after, say, a week off the booze, and notice more bounce in my step.  My eyes are just a tad clearer.  Just better for it, generally.  

But I like a drink.  After a tough old day at work ( aren't most days ) it helps me relax.  So is it fair to say I'm addicted ?  I've never been totally sure.  I always used to judge it by how much I needed a drink.  And if ever I felt the need to drink, I'd make sure I didn't, until the urge went away. Then I'd reward myself - with a drink. ( clever , eh   )

How do most people who are regular smokers feel after a week off ?  Or are you like me and booze, and avoid being too clean of it ?

I know many people here say that coke taking is rife, but noone has openly said they take it.  What's the down time like for a few days after that stuff ?

These are meant to drugs that aren't physically addictive.  I don't think I'm physycally addicted to booze, but I'm pretty sure I'm mentally addicted to it.  Is Claw's addiction physical, or mental ?  Does it matter ?

Sorry if this is a crap post, but this is the stuff I've been wanting to ask for days, and this seems a good time to open up the discussion a bit.   But feel free to tell me if this is crossing personal barriers, and I'll wipe it all.