Croatia Vs England

[Colchester Kev]

You know in truth, we are weak in a lot of positions.

Goalkeepers ... none of international quality imo.

Defenders we can muster a good quality back 4.

Midfield ... again we seem to struggle here, we dont have anyone that gets stuck in and wins the ball.

Strikers ... out and out strikers, we are really struggling.

[turny]

There are only 4 players who seem to really care about playing for England at the moment, David James, Joe Cole, Emile Heskey and Michael Owen (and only 1 of them started on Saturday).

Beckham cares, even if he is nearly as old and past it as tikay.

Have I missed any exciting moments ?

Yeah Beckham cares more than most, but i'm not sure he cares as much as he used to when he was captain.

You missed John Terry being branded a 'lionheart' when he chucks himself in front of a shot to block it - even though he was caught out of position in the first place which caused the opportunity.

This will probably sound daft (but hey i'm good at it) but imo John Terry still hasn't proved he's good enough to play at international level.I've watched him in a few games where i've thought his defending has been really poor.This isn't another dig at a chelsea player and he is immense at club level but i don't think he should be captain as i don't think he should even be guarenteed his game he still needs to prove his quality for England as i say imo.

yawn!!! imo

If he was saying the same about Rio Ferdinand your response wouldnt be yawn.

People need to take off their club blinkers when talking about the players playing for England - it is not only Chelsea fans, it is Liverpool, Man U and Arsenal fans.

IMO fwiw, Ashley Cole and Frank Lampard should not be in the England team - they are over-rated and would not make any of the top clubs national sides.
John Terry and Rio Ferdinand are also over-rated. Ferdinand is made to look very good by playing alongside Vidic, likewise Terry alongside Carvalho.  Given the choice of defensive partnerships over Terry and Ferdinand and Vidic and Carvalho, to me it is a no brainer and would never be Terry and Rio.  

As i support Palace (no chance of anyone playing for England), i can be honest in how i believe that players have performed, without bigging up my own clubs players, and i'm not the only one who can see that our players are not as good as we like to think.

my response for ferdinand would also be yawn i think you'll find.

all 4 centre backs you named are very good players, all worthy internationals and all good enough. but only 2 of em are english so it must be terry and ferdinand.

carvalho is a great player in his own right and so is terry, likewise vidic and ferdinand.

as for ash cole and frank lampard not being worthy of their places i find this laughable tbh, tell me a better left back out there to replace cole? and other than stevie g another midfielder who has as much influence on a game than lampard?

i really dont want to get into a slanging match but im afraid your comments hardly inspire a good knowledge of football (being a palace fan may have something to do with it   )

[TheChipPrince]

For me:



   
                                          David James

Micah Richards          John Terry            Rio Ferdinand            Ashley Cole

                            
Joe Cole             Stephen Gerrard       Frank Lampard           Gareth Barry
                                                               

                                             Wayne Rooney

                                              Dean Ashton

[turny]

I've decided this would be the best bet for England atm:                                                   


                                                  Robert Green

Micah Richards      Jonothan Woodgate            Rio Ferdinand        Ashley Cole

         
                   
                   Stephen Gerrard       Frank Lampard       Gareth Barry
                                                               

 
               Theo Walcott                                                   Joe Cole


                                                 Dean Ashton

a number of those arent available tonight, i think the debate is about the squad available for selection tonight

[Colchester Kev]

For me:



   
                                          David James

Micah Richards          John Terry            Rio Ferdinand            Ashley Cole

                            
Joe Cole             Stephen Gerrard       Frank Lampard           Gareth Barry
                                                               

                                             Wayne Rooney

                                              Dean Ashton

Fat Frank and Gerrard should never be allowed to be on the pitch at the same time, it never works.

[turny]

For me:



   
                                          David James

Micah Richards          John Terry            Rio Ferdinand            Ashley Cole

                            
Joe Cole             Stephen Gerrard       Frank Lampard           Gareth Barry
                                                               

                                             Wayne Rooney

                                              Dean Ashton

am i missing something??? is gerrard available?

i put my team from the available squad and as shit as it is imo its the best we can muster

[turny]

For me:



   
                                          David James

Micah Richards          John Terry            Rio Ferdinand            Ashley Cole

                            
Joe Cole             Stephen Gerrard       Frank Lampard           Gareth Barry
                                                               

                                             Wayne Rooney

                                              Dean Ashton

Fat Frank and Gerrard should never be allowed to be on the pitch at the same time, it never works.

dont agree kev, i think the right manager will find a way, i hope capellos that man.

[AndrewT]

For me:



   
                                          David James

Micah Richards          John Terry            Rio Ferdinand            Ashley Cole

                            
Joe Cole             Stephen Gerrard       Frank Lampard           Gareth Barry
                                                               

                                             Wayne Rooney

                                              Dean Ashton

Fat Frank and Gerrard should never be allowed to be on the pitch at the same time, it never works.

dont agree kev, i think the right manager will find a way, i hope capellos that man.

They have the same game - they play in the same part of the pitch and run into the same areas. The only way they can successfully play in the same team is if they take turns playing in a completely different way than they're used to.

You can only play one and, if fit, that should always be Gerrard - Lampard should be in the squad as Gerrard's understudy.

[AdamG]

                                  David James

Micah Richards       Rio Ferdinand    John Terry      Ashley Cole

David Beckham      Frank Lampard  Gareth Barry    Joe Cole

                        Wayne Rooney    Jermaine Defoe

[turny]

For me:



   
                                          David James

Micah Richards          John Terry            Rio Ferdinand            Ashley Cole

                            
Joe Cole             Stephen Gerrard       Frank Lampard           Gareth Barry
                                                               

                                             Wayne Rooney

                                              Dean Ashton

Fat Frank and Gerrard should never be allowed to be on the pitch at the same time, it never works.

dont agree kev, i think the right manager will find a way, i hope capellos that man.

They have the same game - they play in the same part of the pitch and run into the same areas. The only way they can successfully play in the same team is if they take turns playing in a completely different way than they're used to.

You can only play one and, if fit, that should always be Gerrard - Lampard should be in the squad as Gerrard's understudy.

good players adapt to the right system, people said ballack and lampard wouldnt be able to play in the same team at chelsea i think they have proved that wrong.

agree gerrard should play ahead of lampard but i dont think that we should forget lampard is miles above any other midfielder available to england

[Colchester Kev]

                                 David James

Micah Richards       Rio Ferdinand    John Terry      Ashley Cole

David Beckham      Frank Lampard  Gareth Barry    Joe Cole

                        Wayne Rooney    Jermaine Defoe

Jesus, have you ever seen defoe play for england, he has had MORE than enough chances to impress... he aint got it, never has had it, never will have it.

[Matt50]

There are only 4 players who seem to really care about playing for England at the moment, David James, Joe Cole, Emile Heskey and Michael Owen (and only 1 of them started on Saturday).

Beckham cares, even if he is nearly as old and past it as tikay.

Have I missed any exciting moments ?

Yeah Beckham cares more than most, but i'm not sure he cares as much as he used to when he was captain.

You missed John Terry being branded a 'lionheart' when he chucks himself in front of a shot to block it - even though he was caught out of position in the first place which caused the opportunity.

This will probably sound daft (but hey i'm good at it) but imo John Terry still hasn't proved he's good enough to play at international level.I've watched him in a few games where i've thought his defending has been really poor.This isn't another dig at a chelsea player and he is immense at club level but i don't think he should be captain as i don't think he should even be guarenteed his game he still needs to prove his quality for England as i say imo.

yawn!!! imo

If he was saying the same about Rio Ferdinand your response wouldnt be yawn.

People need to take off their club blinkers when talking about the players playing for England - it is not only Chelsea fans, it is Liverpool, Man U and Arsenal fans.

IMO fwiw, Ashley Cole and Frank Lampard should not be in the England team - they are over-rated and would not make any of the top clubs national sides.
John Terry and Rio Ferdinand are also over-rated. Ferdinand is made to look very good by playing alongside Vidic, likewise Terry alongside Carvalho.  Given the choice of defensive partnerships over Terry and Ferdinand and Vidic and Carvalho, to me it is a no brainer and would never be Terry and Rio.  

As i support Palace (no chance of anyone playing for England), i can be honest in how i believe that players have performed, without bigging up my own clubs players, and i'm not the only one who can see that our players are not as good as we like to think.

my response for ferdinand would also be yawn i think you'll find.

all 4 centre backs you named are very good players, all worthy internationals and all good enough. but only 2 of em are english so it must be terry and ferdinand.

carvalho is a great player in his own right and so is terry, likewise vidic and ferdinand.

as for ash cole and frank lampard not being worthy of their places i find this laughable tbh, tell me a better left back out there to replace cole? and other than stevie g another midfielder who has as much influence on a game than lampard?

i really dont want to get into a slanging match but im afraid your comments hardly inspire a good knowledge of football (being a palace fan may have something to do with it   )

i dont want a slanging match either - it is all about opinions, i have mine, you have yours.  you only have to look at the different teams that people pick to understand that everyone sees things differently.

I do however have a very good knowledge of football, having played the game at a decent level for a number of years, and also obtained coaching badges and watched a lot of matches (as my missus would testify!!!)

IN MY OPINION Ashley Cole is not a good player - i believe he is picked on his reputation for making decent forward runs that he USED to produce at Arsenal and is lucky that there are no other decent English left backs.  If he had been around in the years of Kenny Sansom and Stuart Pearce then i dont think he would have made it to double figures in england caps if any at all.
Lampard is a good player for Chelsea, mainly because of the players that he has around him (makelele and Essien the last couple of years), whereas for England he just doesnt do it.  Gerrard on the other hand, doesnt have the players around him at Liverpool, but can single handedly win matches for them, as he has done for England in the past.

My point about Terry and Ferdinand is that it is the other centre half that makes them look so good.  They probably are the best two centre halves that we have, but unfortunately they are not world class.

If you asked somebody who follows world football closely (not just someone who watches a major tournament on tv every 2 years and the odd champions league game to name their best X1, i dont think many English players would make that team.............................but again it all comes down to opinions.

[turny]

shows the shit we are in up front when defoe and heskey are the best we can muster, we need another michael owen 98 bursting onto the scenes!

[AdamG]

he can hammer 'em away, he proves this in the premiership and also in games like vs Trinidad & Tob.

[Colchester Kev]

he can hammer 'em away, he proves this in the premiership and also in games like vs Trinidad & Tob.

I LOL'd

[ ] That world football highly rated team from Trinidad & Tobago

ITB would have netted 4 against them !