correct decision?

[Onetimebabydoll]

If you miss your draw, you miss your draw.  If the guy has gone all in, he quite blatantly has a better hand than you, and if he's made a play then fair enough, he has made a good one because you can't call his all-in bet with king high.  It is all dependent on how you view etiquette, and to me that would be bad etiquette trying to steal, and i'll use the word steal a pot from someone with a more superior holding because you knew you couldn't win, but at the end of the day he's gone all in before you so you can't win it anyway.. which can be annoying.  I know that your opponents hand could be classified as dead but in fairness of play, with his two cards easily identified, you had the choice to call or fold which is the same choice you had before.  It's the same in any game you play, pool being the easy one to scenario up.  Also the flipside of the coin, if you have the nuts on that board etc, go all in you think he's folded and throw your cards towards the muck, and he's sat there with a busted king high flush draw or the likes, how would you feel if the pot got moved to the other side of the table?  (Not saying that you wouldn't not pay attention like that, but it could happen).

[Cf]

i was thinking it was best not to instamuck to conceal the fact i floated with garbage.

LOL.

+1

So tilting when people do this. Bluffing/floating/whatever is part of the game and is part of any good players arsenel. You'll occasionally be caught out on it. No need to sit there and save face (usually makes you look stupid rather than face saving anyway), just fold, and fold quickly. Live games are slow enough without people tanking on the river with king high.

Someone actually noted that I fold quickly last time I played at DTD. I 3bet a guy pre and he moved all in. My cards had hit the muck before he had finished saying the word "in". I guess I could have sat there and tanked with my seven high but I'd rather get on with the game.

[outragous76]

i was thinking it was best not to instamuck to conceal the fact i floated with garbage.

LOL.

+1

So tilting when people do this. Bluffing/floating/whatever is part of the game and is part of any good players arsenel. You'll occasionally be caught out on it. No need to sit there and save face (usually makes you look stupid rather than face saving anyway), just fold, and fold quickly. Live games are slow enough without people tanking on the river with king high.

Someone actually noted that I fold quickly last time I played at DTD. I 3bet a guy pre and he moved all in. My cards had hit the muck before he had finished saying the word "in". I guess I could have sat there and tanked with my seven high but I'd rather get on with the game.

this uber tilts me sooooooooo much

I mean, I take my time on some hands, but only when i have something to think about.

If you 3 bet light and get caught - jsut fecckking fold.

You can actually see in their eyes that they arent even thinking about the hand, there is no pot counting, no stack counting, just and air filled void thinking " i wonder if that was long enough to wait"

[StuartHopkin]

I regularly find myself folding as players reach for their chips.

Its really bad, but so am I, and my addiction for 

[acc2020]

i omitted the hand details as i believe they are irrelevant to the what i want out of the original post. I am well aware that the hand details makes me look like a knob.

What i wanted to know was is it OK to retrieve cards from muck.

From the replies there seems to be no definitive answer.

[Cf]

i omitted the hand details as i believe they are irrelevant to the what i want out of the original post. I am well aware that the hand details makes me look like a knob.

What i wanted to know was is it OK to retrieve cards from muck.

From the replies there seems to be no definitive answer.

There is a definitive answer: "yes it is". but with the catch all clause of "depending on the circumstances".

[MANTIS01]

i omitted the hand details as i believe they are irrelevant to the what i want out of the original post. I am well aware that the hand details makes me look like a knob.

What i wanted to know was is it OK to retrieve cards from muck.

From the replies there seems to be no definitive answer.

I don't think you should worry too much about whether cards in the muck are dead or not. Instead you should worry about your protest skills. Deliberately knocking yourself out of the tournament to protest about the ruling is a piss poor protest.

[nirvana]

i omitted the hand details as i believe they are irrelevant to the what i want out of the original post. I am well aware that the hand details makes me look like a knob.

What i wanted to know was is it OK to retrieve cards from muck.

From the replies there seems to be no definitive answer.

I don't think you should worry too much about whether cards in the muck are dead or not. Instead you should worry about your protest skills. Deliberately knocking yourself out of the tournament to protest about the ruling is a piss poor protest.

lol, I love a pyrrhic victory

[acc2020]

I spoke to the person in charge of the poker room who was not present that particular day who said the wrong ruling was given. The all in amount should have been returned and the pot awarded to me. Any cards that hit the muck are dead and cannot be retrieved.

The supervisor ( who in fairness maybe a trainee ) who gave the wrong ruling is to be given further training.

The point about the post was not about ethics or morals but the actual rules. In the business world and the world of law people gain advantages though tiny loopholes it is no different on the poker table.

That said , it is the onus of the player to look after their cards at all times.

If you sat at seat 9 and the dealer sweeps your pocket aces into the muck preflop you can only blame yourself.

[George2Loose]

I spoke to the person in charge of the poker room who was not present that particular day who said the wrong ruling was given. The all in amount should have been returned and the pot awarded to me. Any cards that hit the muck are dead and cannot be retrieved.

The supervisor ( who in fairness maybe a trainee ) who gave the wrong ruling is to be given further training.

The point about the post was not about ethics or morals but the actual rules. In the business world and the world of law people gain advantages though tiny loopholes it is no different on the poker table.

That said , it is the onus of the player to look after their cards at all times.

If you sat at seat 9 and the dealer sweeps your pocket aces into the muck preflop you can only blame yourself.

I agree that rules are rules but at the same time I hate angle shooters and people who have abso no right to the pot. In this case yourself.

However I accept there are people who are pretty tez at poker and need to take whatever edge they can take. If this means waiting for a player with the nuts to muck their hand when you hold ace high- so be it

[gatso]

I spoke to the person in charge of the poker room who was not present that particular day who said the wrong ruling was given. The all in amount should have been returned and the pot awarded to me. Any cards that hit the muck are dead and cannot be retrieved.

so if someone bluffs allin but then gets the feeling they're going to get called they can 'accidentally' muck and get all their pennies back? that's a good rule

[StuartHopkin]

Any cards that hit the muck are dead and cannot be retrieved.

Lol

This person should not be aloud in a card room let alone run one. They have little if no understanding of the rules.

Sigh

Will people please learn that the muck is a stupid term for a pile of cards on the table, the cards do not cease to live if they come in to contact with other cards any more than if you touched the muck.

[Colchester Kev]

Any cards that hit the muck are dead and cannot be retrieved.

Lol

This person should not be aloud in a card room let alone run one. They have little if no understanding of the rules.

Sigh

Will people please learn that the muck is a stupid term for a pile of cards on the table, the cards do not cease to live if they come in to contact with other cards any more than if you touched the muck.

Could they be aquiet in the cardroom instead ?

[NigDawG]

Any cards that hit the muck are dead and cannot be retrieved.

Will people please learn that the muck is a stupid term for a pile of cards on the table, the cards do not cease to live if they come in to contact with other cards any more than if you touched the muck.

some casinos do have the rule in place that soon as cards touch the muck they are in fact dead. that famous roland de wolfe ept barcalona hand, where his hand is declared dead since it touched the muck for a second before being turned over (ie completely identifiable) and the classy german guy celebrates about skillfully winning the pot with a worse hand, is an example.

[gatso]

rdw hand is completely different though. he clearly intended to muck what he thought was the losing hand and was forcing the dealers hand out the way to do so as opposed to this hand where the guy obv had no intention of mucking the nut straight