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pleno1
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« Reply #8205 on: November 09, 2016, 01:45:05 AM »

Went home so I could grind Sunday with a set up (home as in England rather than Hungary) so played a short session on Sunday with not many tourneys, think I cashed a little bit more than what I bought in for, so was ok.

Have been recovering in bed from the long few weeks for the last 48 hours or so, but got up late today and played a session. Got 3rd in Party 500 6max and won the $320 6max on Stars. Saw regs doing so much absurdly bad stuff and a lot of perceived borderline stuff incorrectly which gives me a lot of hope for the future of online MTT's. Anyway, woke up late and had a 5 figure day, can't be too bad.

Will do a little trip report for Nottingham now..
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Worst playcalling I have ever seen. Bunch of  fucking jokers . Run the bloody ball. 18 rushes all game? You have to be kidding me. Fuck off lol
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« Reply #8206 on: November 09, 2016, 02:02:13 AM »

So yeah, played WPT UK this week. Last time I was here I came 2nd in the high roller to Bryn and 5th in the main event for $150kish or something total. So was really looking forward to coming back.

In the main I made day 2 with around 60k. Was a little bit tilted though, I started the day really well and after 2 levels had 125k which was 4x average and went to dinner pretty happy. The next couple of hours didn't go so well and I ended with half my stack, its pretty hard to not be sad when that happens, but whatever.

Had one hand I think opponent played incorrectly.

Open, I call, and another good player calls.

763ssc, bet, I call, good player overcalls (his range here is v strong imo)
763Asscc, bet big, I call, he calls
763A5ssccx bet big, i fold, he folds, shows aces.

I think betting the river is a big mistake on the river, think about what calls the river vs 3 barrels here, the reg squeezes jj+ pre so can't bluff catch a big pair and has very few Ax that call the flop after I call. Both of our ranges are super strong hands, straights/sets and then lots of bluffs with no showdown value. When you bet the river, straights/sets will likely just call and bluffs will fold, when you bet the river yourself you allow them to bluff their draws, and you get to get a c/r in vs their value range thus winning a big pot. One of the most important things in these live tournaments is winning huge pots with your huge hands, if you slightly misplay a street you can finish the day with 70k instead of 150k or whatever. Anyway, I had t9ss and was for sure bluffing Cheesy

Day 2 I had pretty weak table, I was able to win lot of pots. I became friendly with opponent in hand from above who played really good and solid overall. On the turn I bet 2.5x pot on the last hand before dinner with 76s on A92Jhhxx where I was expecting the way their range was formed to fold around 90%, anyway, I said I show if you fold then like 20 people came and started to watch the hand, I hated that I had to show because I looked like cocky bastard trying to make them fold and showing everybody, looks bad, but was meant in good intention.

Anyway, the day went great, I chipped up a lot, almost uncontested to a big stack. I asked a reg on my table where he was from and he said Poland, I asked my polish horses who he was and before I could check he opened and I looked down at two big red aces, I 3bet him and he said "you just asked who i am, is that why you're 3betting me?" he flats

flop QT2r, he checks, I bet biggish, he calls
turn QT24, he checks, I bet biggish, he calls
river QT242, he checks, I jam and he has QQ.

Felt kind of bad about this because with my image here people hate folding these run outs. Was extremely large pot as we both had 1.5x+ average at the start of the hand. Anyway after this I went on a huge heater, winning I think 3 all ins to get back up to a nice stack.

Very last hand of the day my horse opens UTG, I defend 65o in the bb.

flop 234fd (lol) check, bet, call
turn 234A dfd, check, check Sad
river 234AJ, dfd brick, I bet over pot and he calls quickly with 55.

Felt so bad for him that I had coolered him and even worse for me that I didn't check/shove Cheesy

Anyway, back for day 3. Had an amazing table.

Around 3 hands in, aggro reg opens co, I flat sb with TT and 80ish bbs, bb jams 23?bbs, I call and he has A4o and we get the xxxxA board. Obviously poor jam and was a little tilted.

Over next few orbits had AA/KK/JJ/QQ/88/88/KK and somehow managed to get through the bubble with 10 or so bbs.

Got a lucky treble up JJ>AQ>QQ and then won a few big pots and got up to around 60 or so bbs (prob 5/20) then played very big hand.

Aggro reg opens co, i defend btn, reg defends bb.

Flop A37cc, checks to me, I bet, bb calls
Turn A372cc, checks to me, I stare at him for a minute, he's giving off a lot of tells, I bet, he gives off a lot more tells and jams huge, this is prob chip lead or very big pot, he jammed around 300k+ on the turn and average was prob 500k at the time. I couldn't not go with my reads and made pretty thin call with ATo and he had q4cc, he hit a straight on the 2 river and it hurt haha. I was still in decent shape with around 20bbs.

V aggro reg opens utg, usually I would always always flat AA here but got v strong reads he was strong, I decide to jam AA and he calls AK and we lose on the K32K5 board.

I came around 25th for £7000, was a super fun week, was so happy that my reads were correct in almost all spots throughout the week and gives me a lot more confidence for live poker after successful previous trips in Vegas, Barca especially and more recently Malta.

Caribbean next week which will be absolutely awesome, so many people I know going, literally 1000+ people going. Going to be wild. After that will go to NYC for 8 days and then to Prague for EPT.

Life feels pretty good right now, very content and in a happy place.. today a horse asked the community about whether he should stick with uni or concentrate more on poker. Going to write an article about this this week and post it here, I have very different opinions to 99% of people on this idea I'm sure. Will be interested on feedback.
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Worst playcalling I have ever seen. Bunch of  fucking jokers . Run the bloody ball. 18 rushes all game? You have to be kidding me. Fuck off lol
pleno1
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« Reply #8207 on: November 10, 2016, 03:41:30 PM »

http://www.bitb-staking.com/2016/11/10/what-if/

I wrote this on the plane. What do you guys think? Bullshit? Agree?
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Worst playcalling I have ever seen. Bunch of  fucking jokers . Run the bloody ball. 18 rushes all game? You have to be kidding me. Fuck off lol
Longines
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« Reply #8208 on: November 10, 2016, 04:00:31 PM »

http://www.bitb-staking.com/2016/11/10/what-if/

I wrote this on the plane. What do you guys think? Bullshit? Agree?

Read it between conference calls ;-) Don't have time to reply fully right now but IMO you've have a pretty skewed view of the relative likelihood of success and the opportunity costs of the binary options you've presented. Will expand on that when I'm stuck on the train home later....
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arbboy
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« Reply #8209 on: November 10, 2016, 04:45:24 PM »

Interesting read Pads.  I can relate to both sides of the coin as i did 5 years 'corporate' straight out of uni training on a big 5 firm ACA programme then left for bet365 worked 5 years 'corporate' in the gambling world and 11 years punting/arbing/poker for myself since.   I think you underestimate a lot of the downside of leaving the rat race, the huge potential earnings back weighted towards the end of your career when your earning potential is huge if you are that talented but you have to suffer in your 20s being underpaid.  No one with real talent (which you will need to win at the rates you quote at poker in 2016) will be reaching peak earnings anywhere before mid 30s at their earliest.  However these earnings can easily be a 'risk free' £500k+ for 20+ years after that period.  There is no risk free in poker.

I don't regret any part of my career and i certainly would have regretted leaving uni to gamble full time in 1996 (it wasn't possible then in reality like it is now).  I hated most of my 5 years doing ACA but it taught me so much about the reality of the business world and provides THE greatest business education going bar none imo and makes me appreciate the lifestyle i lead now.   Without doing that i would never have got the opportunity to sail into a job at 365 which, in turn, allowed me to work easily for other firms after before i gained sufficient skills and knowledge to go it alone.

I appreciate poker in 2016 is slightly different to my story but i think you massively over estimate the work ethic and drive 99% of graduates have.  You are a bit of a freak when it comes to being single minded and driven.  Because you surround yourself with similar types from all over the world i think you think you unique skill set is more common than it is.  99% of guys in their 20's want to play sport, drink loads and shag loads of birds (as well as act like a total degen for a few years gambling with your new found pay packet which i managed to do as well!).   I know i did and if i was 21 again i would do exactly the same things as i choose to do back in 1996.

The vast majority of high level graduates also have no interest in taking real risk with their life/career either.  They have no interest in taking risk and just want a cosy middle England lifestyle which they grew up in and think it totally achievable.  For every Rutter and posh boy there are literally thousands of people like them with identical backgrounds who just wouldn't even consider a poker lifestyle/career even if there was a potential to make £10m a year at the end of the rainbow.

I left the corporate world to gamble as a lifestyle choice mainly and i am sure i would be financially much better off at 42 if i had stayed as an ACA.  I would probably be earning well in excess of £500k a year now if i had never left that business.  I hated it though and left to work in an industry that i was passionate about not for financial gain ultimately.
« Last Edit: November 10, 2016, 05:13:36 PM by arbboy » Logged
tikay
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« Reply #8210 on: November 10, 2016, 06:07:11 PM »

http://www.bitb-staking.com/2016/11/10/what-if/

I wrote this on the plane. What do you guys think? Bullshit? Agree?

Disagree very strongly, partly because of the same reasons as Longines.

Life is a long, long, road. I'd bet all the tea in China that you'll not be able to earn much money in poker after you reach your, say, mid-forties. By which point you now need an income for the next 30 or 40 years.

A good career outside of poker is not only just as rewarding as one in poker, but it carries amazingly good salary & - wait for it - lifetime pension benefits.

I thoroughly respect & admire your success in poker, I really do. But there are other interesting jobs than poker, & to some of us, "work" is not a dirty word, it is something we thoroughly enjoy, & do with every bit as much passion as you & poker.   

Well you did ask.
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pleno1
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« Reply #8211 on: November 10, 2016, 06:38:18 PM »

Maybe you didn't read, but this is for people who are currently playing and winning in poker not random guys from university.
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pleno1
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« Reply #8212 on: November 10, 2016, 06:46:08 PM »

http://www.bitb-staking.com/2016/11/10/what-if/

I wrote this on the plane. What do you guys think? Bullshit? Agree?


Life is a long, long, road. I'd bet all the tea in China that you'll not be able to earn much money in poker after you reach your, say, mid-forties. By which point you now need an income for the next 30 or 40 years


With all due respect, if able to make minimum of 3x (5x+ when you consider no tax)for 25 years why would somebody need an income for the next "30-40 years"

Unfortunately I don't think I'll be able to make money when I'm 40 playing poker by if I can I certainly wouldn't be searching for alternative income streams at 50.
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Worst playcalling I have ever seen. Bunch of  fucking jokers . Run the bloody ball. 18 rushes all game? You have to be kidding me. Fuck off lol
tikay
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« Reply #8213 on: November 10, 2016, 06:57:15 PM »

http://www.bitb-staking.com/2016/11/10/what-if/

I wrote this on the plane. What do you guys think? Bullshit? Agree?


Life is a long, long, road. I'd bet all the tea in China that you'll not be able to earn much money in poker after you reach your, say, mid-forties. By which point you now need an income for the next 30 or 40 years


With all due respect, if able to make minimum of 3x (5x+ when you consider no tax)for 25 years why would somebody need an income for the next "30-40 years"

Unfortunately I don't think I'll be able to make money when I'm 40 playing poker by if I can I certainly wouldn't be searching for alternative income streams at 50.

Well you asked for opinions, & I gave them.

I know a decent number of 45, 50 & 60 year old poker players who have been relatively successful. Not "pleno successful", but, you know, did OK. I am struggling to think of more than a handful who don't need an outside income now. Poker players, for the most part, are gamblers, & I doubt many have squirelled away money for the future.   

A decent % of the long term poker payers I know are skinto, & always have been. Nature of the beast.
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dwayne110
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« Reply #8214 on: November 10, 2016, 08:33:47 PM »

Expanding on Tikay's point, I'd note that annual pension contributions are restricted to a max of:

- £3,600; and
- 100% of 'relevant earnings'

Relevant earnings does not (currently!) include poker profit or investment income (such as dividends and rental income), but does include self employment/partnership income and of course employment income (if you have non-poker sources of income). There's also a max 'annual allowance' for personal pension contribs (currently £40k), but I won't go into that too much per the above restriction. The key point is your ability to pay into a registered pension scheme is restricted if your source of income is 'non qualifying'.

I think most people would agree that paying into an approved pension scheme, either through your employment (deduction at source) or via personal pension contributions, would seem prudent for future income planning - compound interest, etc.

I think making voluntary NIC contributions should also be considered for someone in your fairly unique position, if you expect to stay out of the standard NIC contribution system (i.e. Employment and self employment) - to preserve certain entitlements you may one day need (full state pension, etc); we of course don't know what the state benefit system will be like in thirty years but the risk-reward (v small yearly contribution compared to full state pension you'd currently get) seems a no brainer...


One other point I'd note is you're at the peak of your powers currently, but when you're 55+,  it quite as able at 12-tabling, and Pleno version 12 is winning the lot, you might regret some of the decisions you made now if you haven't planned wisely.
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EvilPie
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« Reply #8215 on: November 10, 2016, 08:38:22 PM »

You give a lot of people far too much credit by assuming they are in the same motivational league as yourself.

You have a 'bitb' attitude that will see you be successful in pretty much anything you choose to do. 99.9% of the population don't have that same attitude.

If someone with your attitude to poker put the same effort in to their University life they would end up with top grades and most likely a phd at the end of it. If they carry that attitude through to a career they'd absolutely piss the poker figures you're talking about whilst probably making a meaningful contribution to the world.

A top University graduate I believe would earn more than the top poker player.

The average University graduate will earn more than the average poker player.

A crap University student will earn something whereas a crap poker player will be living on the streets.

What I think you're talking about in your blog is someone half arsing it at Uni who would put in a decent amount of effort in to poker. That being the case then 100% drop out of Uni because you're wasting an opportunity to do something better.

You yourself appear to have been a pretty average University student but an excellent poker player. I'm not saying you didn't have the brain to do well at Uni you just didn't enjoy it and preferred poker. In your case staying at Uni would've been stupid because you could do so much better elsewhere.

If you dropped out of Uni to half arse it at poker you'd have been an idiot because you'd have wasted an opportunity to be able to half arse it through life on £30k+ a year.

So in my opinion it all comes down to which one you're going to apply yourself to the most. If you're applying yourself equally to both then 100% stick to Uni. If you're 50/50 but quitting poker means you'll apply yourself fully to Uni then quit poker. If you're not that arsed about Uni whatever happens then quit it but only if that means you'll focus 100% on poker because if you don't make a success of poker you'll be homeless.

Hopefully you get the gist of where I'm coming from. I'd like to put more in to this post as it's not very well laid out but I have to walk my dog and he's more important than poker or Uni. Apologies if you have to decipher it a bit yourself.

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« Reply #8216 on: November 10, 2016, 08:41:39 PM »

Expanding on Tikay's point, I'd note that annual pension contributions are restricted to a max of:

- £3,600; and
- 100% of 'relevant earnings'

Relevant earnings does not (currently!) include poker profit or investment income (such as dividends and rental income), but does include self employment/partnership income and of course employment income (if you have non-poker sources of income). There's also a max 'annual allowance' for personal pension contribs (currently £40k), but I won't go into that too much per the above restriction. The key point is your ability to pay into a registered pension scheme is restricted if your source of income is 'non qualifying'.

I think most people would agree that paying into an approved pension scheme, either through your employment (deduction at source) or via personal pension contributions, would seem prudent for future income planning - compound interest, etc.

I think making voluntary NIC contributions should also be considered for someone in your fairly unique position, if you expect to stay out of the standard NIC contribution system (i.e. Employment and self employment) - to preserve certain entitlements you may one day need (full state pension, etc); we of course don't know what the state benefit system will be like in thirty years but the risk-reward (v small yearly contribution compared to full state pension you'd currently get) seems a no brainer...


One other point I'd note is you're at the peak of your powers currently, but when you're 55+,  it quite as able at 12-tabling, and Pleno version 12 is winning the lot, you might regret some of the decisions you made now if you haven't planned wisely.


Saying something like this is a no brainer is ridiculous, especially so, when Pleno lives in Hungary.
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EvilPie
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« Reply #8217 on: November 10, 2016, 08:44:35 PM »

Expanding on Tikay's point, I'd note that annual pension contributions are restricted to a max of:

- £3,600; and
- 100% of 'relevant earnings'

Relevant earnings does not (currently!) include poker profit or investment income (such as dividends and rental income), but does include self employment/partnership income and of course employment income (if you have non-poker sources of income). There's also a max 'annual allowance' for personal pension contribs (currently £40k), but I won't go into that too much per the above restriction. The key point is your ability to pay into a registered pension scheme is restricted if your source of income is 'non qualifying'.

I think most people would agree that paying into an approved pension scheme, either through your employment (deduction at source) or via personal pension contributions, would seem prudent for future income planning - compound interest, etc.

I think making voluntary NIC contributions should also be considered for someone in your fairly unique position, if you expect to stay out of the standard NIC contribution system (i.e. Employment and self employment) - to preserve certain entitlements you may one day need (full state pension, etc); we of course don't know what the state benefit system will be like in thirty years but the risk-reward (v small yearly contribution compared to full state pension you'd currently get) seems a no brainer...


One other point I'd note is you're at the peak of your powers currently, but when you're 55+,  it quite as able at 12-tabling, and Pleno version 12 is winning the lot, you might regret some of the decisions you made now if you haven't planned wisely.


The pension argument isn't a great one to be honest. The main benefit of paying in to a pension pot is that you don't pay any tax. If you aren't paying tax anyway then sticking something in a fund of some kind is just as good if not better.
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tikay
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« Reply #8218 on: November 10, 2016, 08:55:24 PM »

You give a lot of people far too much credit by assuming they are in the same motivational league as yourself.

You have a 'bitb' attitude that will see you be successful in pretty much anything you choose to do. 99.9% of the population don't have that same attitude.

If someone with your attitude to poker put the same effort in to their University life they would end up with top grades and most likely a phd at the end of it. If they carry that attitude through to a career they'd absolutely piss the poker figures you're talking about whilst probably making a meaningful contribution to the world.

A top University graduate I believe would earn more than the top poker player.

The average University graduate will earn more than the average poker player.

A crap University student will earn something whereas a crap poker player will be living on the streets.

What I think you're talking about in your blog is someone half arsing it at Uni who would put in a decent amount of effort in to poker. That being the case then 100% drop out of Uni because you're wasting an opportunity to do something better.

You yourself appear to have been a pretty average University student but an excellent poker player. I'm not saying you didn't have the brain to do well at Uni you just didn't enjoy it and preferred poker. In your case staying at Uni would've been stupid because you could do so much better elsewhere.

If you dropped out of Uni to half arse it at poker you'd have been an idiot because you'd have wasted an opportunity to be able to half arse it through life on £30k+ a year.

So in my opinion it all comes down to which one you're going to apply yourself to the most. If you're applying yourself equally to both then 100% stick to Uni. If you're 50/50 but quitting poker means you'll apply yourself fully to Uni then quit poker. If you're not that arsed about Uni whatever happens then quit it but only if that means you'll focus 100% on poker because if you don't make a success of poker you'll be homeless.

Hopefully you get the gist of where I'm coming from. I'd like to put more in to this post as it's not very well laid out but I have to walk my dog and he's more important than poker or Uni. Apologies if you have to decipher it a bit yourself.



POTW.
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dwayne110
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« Reply #8219 on: November 10, 2016, 09:38:02 PM »

Doobs - assuming Pads lived in the U.K. for three years continuously at some point prior to living abroad he can make voluntary Class 3 NIC contributions now and one day draw on his future UK state pension from Uruguay if he so wished...

Class 3 contributions I believe are currently £14/week, state pension is currently c £120/week - seems a no brainer to me, but I'd welcome your views.

Evilpie - I take your point, I guess my overriding theme is having some form of future savings scheme in place, particularly with a poker career...which I would suggest has similarities to that of a professional footballer in terms of peak years, and a likely tail off as mental faculties and drive diminish. I would suggest the drop off in income (or loss!) for poker players at that stage is incomparable to that of your average middle aged employee.
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