Hand Etiquette

[K9sixtwo]

Just after others views .... Played at a Casino last night for the second time . The game was P/L Hold em after about an hour and a bit playing and being dealt nothing but rags and therefore only entering the occasional hand ...thus presenting the image of a tight player.. i find myself dealer and put in a small raise with A 9 o/s it goes round 1 call followed by a good raise and two other callers . I fold and discard my hands into the muck . I then deal out the hand and on the completion of the hand one player (the hand winner ) pushes his cards in and then pushes in other cards but "manages" to turn my two cards over ... Now my initial though was he wanted to see the discards ...but then thinking about it he didnt do it before or after that hand so i have to surmise that he did it to see what I was calling .... How do you make representation about this when the guy was a regular and well known against me being new?? Am I reading to much into this. 
                         K9

[Ironside]

about an hour into a PLHE event and you folded A9o?

i guess as you had been dealt nothing all game you would have
a smallish stack compared to the table with all the rebuys

why were you not all in???

remember you can always rebuy and your getting close to the end of the rebuys?
and scraping into the freezeout section with a small stack puts you at a huge disadvantage

unless it was a big buy in event which with so many callers i doubt folding the A9o in this postion was a mistake not least because at that stage of the event the A9o could of been the best ace out there as during the rebuys people will raise reraise and call with alot less

now donw to the question as new players we are always at a disadvantage, if you are unhappy with something always ask for a ruling, but don't get hung up if the ruling goes against you, its more than likely the ruling is correct but there is always the chance of a hometown ruling but they are less likely to try something on you if you call for a ruling.

i remember once playing in a tourny having 3200TP (anyone who has seen me at the table know i sit there counting my chips every other hand) i pushed all my chips in on a reraise one of the stacks toppled over and the guy in teh next seat leant over and helped me move the chips witch had now miraclously changed to 2700TP the player sat next to me had now a large pile of smaller chips (when i had been looking at his stack it was short stack of larger chips)
i questioned wether he was going to put the chips back, when everyone including the dealer stood up for the other player i dropped my complaint but they would have noted that i was not scared to complain and also note that i will be watching much closer next time.

[tikay]

Thanks for the characteristically lively & amusing reply ironside - but I thought you were coming to Walsall today?

However........

I think K9's point was this. Someone reached into the muck & exposed K9's discarded hand. This is improper, and against the rules. His question, is what redress or penalty is there, or should there be?

[Ironside]

sorry tikay

forgot to tell you

just after my last email to you i was out shopping (hate shopping it should be banned) and to avoid a kid running into my path i took a detour off a kerb. end result is left leg is 3 times as big as it should be and all cut and bruised etc etc. so didnt fancy flying with an injured leg.

as for should there be a penalty then the answer is of course but how can you prove it was intentional even with CCTV footage it would be impossible so therefore and impossible rule to judge fairly and therefore a word to the floorman who would come over rule in the favour of the home player who would applogies and think twice before pulling a stunt on the newbie next time

[K9sixtwo]

Thanks for your reply Ironside ....Regarding folding A9 o/s... thats why I'm the newbie I am learning however !! Its difficult to play even with a limited bankroll when others are calling with rubbish in an  attempt to double up...As the player to my left said on one hand after losing "How can my AK win when its up against a quality hand like 63 off??"
But point taken and reflection is a grand thing ...so yes I should have played it and perhaps re raised to see what result that got
All things considered though it left a slight bitter taste ... But a thouroughly enjoyable evening and perhaps next time I shall look towards a freezeout...
                K9

[jbsc7769]

I don't think there is anything wrong with mucking A9o to a reraise, in fact i woudl go one step furthre and say it is good discipline, even in rebuy mode. It is a risky hand and even if you hit your Ace, good chance you are behind. I guess that is the beauty of the game, we all play it differently.

[redsimon]

No easy answer to this one. I had a similar situation at Notts earlier this year. I mucked and after the river card was dealt a player reached into the muck and exposed my cards. With the player who did it, I was pretty sure it was a genuine error as he carried on fishing until he found his cards which made a straight

If you think the guy on your table was trying to get cheap info I'd call the floorman over as its normally a 15 minute penalty offence. If it was a probable error just gently remind him. Being a regular affords no privileges in my view.

Finally, I think chucking A9 in the scenario you described is an OK move.