UK to start taxing poker winnings? :(

[redarmi]

It isn't taxed at source.
[/quote]

No but it is inescapable.  If you cash in any tourney they are going to want to see id and issue you with a 1099 for it.

[treefella]

Don't get you guys at all that wanna pay tax on your poker .honourable maybe, but come on seriously, why would you wanna donate to the revenue ?
as if we are not taxed enough in this country already ! lol
if you feel that strongly about it Camel why dont you put aside 25% of your earnings to be donated to Africa, Japan, British Heart Foundation or some other worthwhile cause . im sure they would appreciate it .  
At least then you could justify your profession as a worthy one to all the school mums and dads who think gambling, poker is for degenerates : )  

 

[SuuPRlim]

Just get a good accountant and you will be able to dodge most of it imo

[vegaslover]

It isn't taxed at source.

No but it is inescapable.  If you cash in any tourney they are going to want to see id and issue you with a 1099 for it.
[/quote]
Isn't it for cashes over 10k only though?
In vegas i've never been asked for id when cashing, or been issued with a 1099. Never cashed for morethan 10k though, sigh

[AndrewT]

5k last time I was there.

[Royal Flush]

In tournaments yeah but in cash games it's not, that is my point.

[ScottMGee]

Gambling between individuals is just a transfer of capital that has already been taxed when it was earned. 

Poor point, this is exactly the same as a a cabbie earning £25, gets £20 after basic rate income tax.

Cabble spends £20 on a hair cut and the hairdresser pays £4 income tax and has £16 left.

She then gets a £16 cab into town and the cabbie pays £3.20 income tax and is left with just £12.80, AND SO ON.

Increasing tax just sucks money out of the private economy faster and reduces GDP.

[redarmi]

In tournaments yeah but in cash games it's not, that is my point.

This is true to a degree but US residents that play poker for a living are not going to get away with not paying taxes.  Even criminals here pay their income tax!!!!!!

[The Camel]

In tournaments yeah but in cash games it's not, that is my point.

This is true to a degree but US residents that play poker for a living are not going to get away with not paying taxes.  Even criminals here pay their income tax!!!!!!

Someone told me that the IRS have been known to visit peoples houses and add up the value of their property to see if they might be earning more than they are declaring

True or urban myth?

[redarmi]

I can believe it.  To give you an idea of the level of fear that the IRS here have over people,  the guy that I used to work for that owned the sportsbook in Antigua had been indicted by the US and was effectively on the run and unable to return to the United States without a lengthy period inside yet every year he faithfully paid the IRS on his income from that business despite the fact he was basically resigned to the fact that he would never return 'home'.  Last time I spoke to him he was looking into surrendering his US passport so that he was no longer a legal US citizen and didn't have to pay their taxes but whilst he retained a US passport he wasn't taking the chance.

[Jon MW]

In tournaments yeah but in cash games it's not, that is my point.

This is true to a degree but US residents that play poker for a living are not going to get away with not paying taxes.  Even criminals here pay their income tax!!!!!!

Which pretty much gets to the point of why it's unlikely that the UK will tax poker winnings, it just wouldn't be worth it. It would effectively only really end up applying to the full time professionals, they would be able to write off any losses against their liability - so in the end the government would raise peanuts in extra tax revenue.

I always assumed that they could do it in the USA because of the bigger scale of the IRS and the larger population of professional players - but IIRC poker players pay tax as income because of a legal precedent which was to avoid paying tax on poker classed as a more general gambling win; it's entirely possible that the tax revenue raised from taxing poker in the US isn't really worth the cost either but because of the way it arrived, and the monstrous federal bureaucracy, it just wouldn't be worth their while to change it.

[AlexMartin]

Taxing gambling would merely force gambling/poker etc underground.

Taxing things doesnt force them underground.

Gambling between individuals is just a transfer of capital that has already been taxed when it was earned.  Camel keeps moaning about not paying tax but never does anything about it.

Not sure what I've done to piss you off, but you seem to have a had a problem with a few of my posts recently.

What do you want me to do about the situation?

What you said is clearly nonsense though.

Money always gets taxed over and over again.

You earn money as an internet policeman and get taxed, you go to the park on a hot day and fancy an ice cream and the ice cream salesman gets taxed on what he earns from you. Mr ice cream salesman's tv blows up and gets it repaired and pays the repairman who pays pays tax on what he earns.

etc etc etc and indeed etc

I'm not going to get much into this other than to say that the courts have ruled that winning at gambling doesn't constitute the same kind of activity as your examples.


(sorry bout how it came across, but you do always enthusiastically demand that you should be taxed in these threads and never write to the Times or Guardian about it)

please never ever do this keith, some of us are on the breadline!!!!!!

[doubleup]

Poor point, this is exactly the same as a a cabbie earning £25, gets £20 after basic rate income tax.

Cabble spends £20 on a hair cut and the hairdresser pays £4 income tax and has £16 left.

She then gets a £16 cab into town and the cabbie pays £3.20 income tax and is left with just £12.80, AND SO ON.

Increasing tax just sucks money out of the private economy faster and reduces GDP.

yeah the govt just puts the money in a box and doesn't employ ppl who get cabs and have haircuts.

[doubleup]

I always assumed that they could do it in the USA because of the bigger scale of the IRS and the larger population of professional players - but IIRC poker players pay tax as income because of a legal precedent which was to avoid paying tax on poker classed as a more general gambling win; it's entirely possible that the tax revenue raised from taxing poker in the US isn't really worth the cost either but because of the way it arrived, and the monstrous federal bureaucracy, it just wouldn't be worth their while to change it.

Any gambling win is taxable in the US (in most states gambling losses can be offset, but not other earnings).  In the UK a wise judge decided that an individual playing cards or betting on horses is not a trade profession or vocation, so it is not income for tax purposes.