Blowing your bankroll

[ACE2M]

I've thrashed my bankroll countless times, but fortunately i don't rely on it for anything. Drives me nuts when i do it.

Dropping down levels is horribly boring and i sympathize with your plight. I've played 1k stt's and 100/200 nl one week and been on £2 mtts the next and it's very demoralizing.

I found the best way to keep my interest in these lower stakes is by winning sats to bigger events from the profits, this really brings back the excitement of a big mtt and you can look forward to it coming around. You also play better when it comes around as you are not flippant with the cash and you have had to work to get there.

[Heid]

Fantastic postings here guys...

I am in a position where I have a biggish amount as bankroll (for me anyway) on several sites.

This is the first time in a long time that I haven't had to reload anywhere. I play above my 'roll, but very carefully, make a small profit at cash and move out, and then back in. I play above my roll, because I get the play there. If I was to play at my bankroll level then the fish would jump and draw me out on the river etc. They still do sometiomes, but it's less apparent this end of the river..

It's a bit of a gamble, but that's part of the attraction, so I can understand where it is coming from.

We've all got into a pickle with bankroll before.

The more you have, the more of a poisoned chalice it can be.

Really enjoying this thread

Heid
xx

[Royal Flush]

Dropping down levels is horribly boring and i sympathize with your plight. I've played 1k stt's and 100/200 nl one week and been on £2 mtts the next and it's very demoralizing.

wow, this thread is turning into a real eye opener!

[scoobleydoobley]

Good post by Riverdave and the tank.
Bankroll management is very important.I learnt my lesson playing 1/2 no limit on a 1 k bankroll and almost going broke.
I currently 4 table  50c/$1 nl (6 max) and i wont move up untill i have a 20 k bank roll. The usual guide for no limit i 20 buy ins. Although this is a little more , 20k would alow me to play my A game.This may seem consevative , but i really dont see a rush in moving up, as taking your time will give you more tme to learn, Also building a roll is a good guide as to if you are ready to move up.I am pretty sure i can beat the 1/2 nl  game...why risk going broke when i am currently crushing the 100nl and building a proper roll?

tom

http://chipandaprayer.blogspot.com

[TightEnd]

What a wonderful thread.

I am a compulsive addictive type and I used to have a big problem on the gee-gees. This was about 15 years ago, in my early twenties, no ties, in a high powered job and with a natural interest, but no aptitude, in racing I got through over £100,000. I would run massive overdrafts and then clear it once a year if I was fortunate enough to recieve a bonus.

I went to gamblers anonymous first. I was deeply embarrassed but met people in a far worse position than me. I have not had a bet on the horses for over a decade now. I simply cannot control myself if I do. I love the sport and it kills me to see all the tips on the betting tips section here, so I don't post on the horse threads.

Partly this abstinence started because I did not want to lie to my new wife and then kids came along...responsibilities changed

Then, after the marriage broke up I discovered poker. It is completely strange. I do not think I have once tilted and have infinite patience. I keep scrupulous records and control over a bankroll. I don't have the game of some I suppose but I study it a lot. What poker does for me though is feed my need for an analytical pursuit and provides new challenges

My advice to Trivial would be a) you've made a great first step in posting such a searingly honest post somewhere like here. b) if that isn't enough then somewhere like gamblers anonymous will help you identify some of the underlying issues behind your gambling mindset.

I suppose I better admit: i even went to psychotherapy with my addiction...discovered the root causes which will remain private to me and now it's not part of my life at all. Sure I lose, and sometimes I win, but it is CONTROLLED...seperate bankroll for poker and seperate bankroll for US sports betting only. If that cash goes, I wouldn't reload into the sports book. Can't say the same for poker though!

[Wardonkey]

Great thread Trivial,

I, like others who have posted on this thread, have had my problems with gambling. Nearly all of us had an interest in gambling before we started playing poker and most people with an interest in gambling have had problems at one time or another.

It does us all good to remind ourselves of the dark side every so often. It is the stark truth that most people lose at this game and many of those people will, to some degree, have problems with controlling their gambling.

[Big Gus]

Have to admit to being a lurker rather than a poster, but........just wanted to applaud a searingly honest initial post that has led to some fascinating follow-ups. Particularly from Tightend and Riverdave.

Terrific advice from the Tank too. Keeps this forum up there as the best.

Good luck with your dilemma, Trivial.

Jim.

[AndrewT]

I seem to remember a thread a while back which concerned the ethics of poker - how did people feel about winning money from players who were down to the felt, reloading with the last of the housekeeping or mortgage money for instance - people who obviously had problems with controlling their urge to gamble.

It's got me thinking. We all aspire to be profitable players and, of course, to have some winning players means there must be very many losing players. When faced with a post of such searing honesty from Trivial, we have all given heartfelt advice on the best course of action for him - advice which will hopefully means he avoids going broke in the future.

However, what if we managed to convince everyone with gambling problems on how best to avoid losing money - where would our profits come from? By playing poker with people who lose lots of money, how complicit are we in their downfall? Are we akin to the, no doubt well-meaning, people who would buy George Best a drink in a pub, as that's what George wanted, even though it was killing him?

Is there an inherent hypocrisy in giving with our forum posts, but taking away when we're hidden in the anonymity of the online poker room?

I'm quite a hard-edged, unemotional kind of guy, who takes a very black-and-white view of people's ability to control their urges, simply because I don't have an addictive personality. I don't know how hard it is for gamblers to stay away from the bookies, or for smokers to resist the cancersticks. I remember trying to get my mum to stop smoking when I was a kid, and would say very naive things like 'Just don't buy any more, then you can't smoke them', and she would say 'Oh Andrew, it's not as easy as that', which would completely mystify me as, to me, it was as easy as that.

The posts from Tightend and Riverdave have been enlightening insights for me to understand what goes on in other people's heads. What if I understand and empathise too much though, and feel guilty about taking other people's money from them? That will negatively impact my game, which I obviously don't want to do.

Profitability and empathy - how do people 'with hearts' reconcile these two facets of the game?

[EvilSteve]

My next installment of my student loan comes through shortly, every single time I find myself with a student loan it gets blown on Poker and Gambling. Hopefully this time will be different!

[TightEnd]

I seem to remember a thread a while back which concerned the ethics of poker - how did people feel about winning money from players who were down to the felt, reloading with the last of the housekeeping or mortgage money for instance - people who obviously had problems with controlling their urge to gamble.

It's got me thinking. We all aspire to be profitable players and, of course, to have some winning players means there must be very many losing players. When faced with a post of such searing honesty from Trivial, we have all given heartfelt advice on the best course of action for him - advice which will hopefully means he avoids going broke in the future.

However, what if we managed to convince everyone with gambling problems on how best to avoid losing money - where would our profits come from? By playing poker with people who lose lots of money, how complicit are we in their downfall? Are we akin to the, no doubt well-meaning, people who would buy George Best a drink in a pub, as that's what George wanted, even though it was killing him?

Is there an inherent hypocrisy in giving with our forum posts, but taking away when we're hidden in the anonymity of the online poker room?

I'm quite a hard-edged, unemotional kind of guy, who takes a very black-and-white view of people's ability to control their urges, simply because I don't have an addictive personality. I don't know how hard it is for gamblers to stay away from the bookies, or for smokers to resist the cancersticks. I remember trying to get my mum to stop smoking when I was a kid, and would say very naive things like 'Just don't buy any more, then you can't smoke them', and she would say 'Oh Andrew, it's not as easy as that', which would completely mystify me as, to me, it was as easy as that.

The posts from Tightend and Riverdave have been enlightening insights for me to understand what goes on in other people's heads. What if I understand and empathise too much though, and feel guilty about taking other people's money from them? That will negatively impact my game, which I obviously don't want to do.

Profitability and empathy - how do people 'with hearts' reconcile these two facets of the game?

fantastic. An all time great post.

[matt674]

I seem to remember a thread a while back which concerned the ethics of poker - how did people feel about winning money from players who were down to the felt, reloading with the last of the housekeeping or mortgage money for instance - people who obviously had problems with controlling their urge to gamble.

It's got me thinking. We all aspire to be profitable players and, of course, to have some winning players means there must be very many losing players. When faced with a post of such searing honesty from Trivial, we have all given heartfelt advice on the best course of action for him - advice which will hopefully means he avoids going broke in the future.

However, what if we managed to convince everyone with gambling problems on how best to avoid losing money - where would our profits come from? By playing poker with people who lose lots of money, how complicit are we in their downfall? Are we akin to the, no doubt well-meaning, people who would buy George Best a drink in a pub, as that's what George wanted, even though it was killing him?

Is there an inherent hypocrisy in giving with our forum posts, but taking away when we're hidden in the anonymity of the online poker room?

I'm quite a hard-edged, unemotional kind of guy, who takes a very black-and-white view of people's ability to control their urges, simply because I don't have an addictive personality. I don't know how hard it is for gamblers to stay away from the bookies, or for smokers to resist the cancersticks. I remember trying to get my mum to stop smoking when I was a kid, and would say very naive things like 'Just don't buy any more, then you can't smoke them', and she would say 'Oh Andrew, it's not as easy as that', which would completely mystify me as, to me, it was as easy as that.

The posts from Tightend and Riverdave have been enlightening insights for me to understand what goes on in other people's heads. What if I understand and empathise too much though, and feel guilty about taking other people's money from them? That will negatively impact my game, which I obviously don't want to do.

Profitability and empathy - how do people 'with hearts' reconcile these two facets of the game?

Good question - which is one reason why i dont ever offer my opinions on people's own bankroll management. I dont mind giving my thoughts on certain aspects of play - or which game to choose - or what to do in any given situation but i'll never give my thoughts on bankroll management. as far as i'm concerned thats something the individual has to figure out for themselves.

Yes it may make me appear to be heartless but in my opinion emotions have no place at the poker table, when i'm there i'm playing to win at all costs (within the rules though of course). as far as i'm concerned if you can pay the entry fee into a tournament then i have the opportunity to take your money (just as you have the opportunity to take mine), whether its your last dollar or just a small piece of your million dollar bankroll.

I too was a gambler, started on fruit machines, then horses dogs and football but since i discovered poker i've never bother with any other form of gambling as i know i can make a profit playing poker and my destiny is in my own hands as much as possible. When i was younger i learned bankroll management the hard way (must admit working in a betting shop and seeing it from the "other side" helped) and when i started playing poker i knew that i had to be disciplined with my bankroll. My golden rule was "Dont gamble with money you cant afford to lose" and whilst it is hard to resist the temptation (i've been there myself many years ago) i have no sympathy for those who tell stories of going broke with money they couldnt afford to lose.

[TightEnd]

i have no sympathy for those who tell stories of going broke with money they couldnt afford to lose.

not even with those who are "ill" for whatever reason and unable to help themselves?

[matt674]

i have no sympathy for those who tell stories of going broke with money they couldnt afford to lose.

not even with those who are "ill" for whatever reason and unable to help themselves?

you would have to be a bit more specific than that but unless you are talking about someone with a genetic disorder of which they have no control over then yes i have no sympathy for them. As with any form of addiction, be it drugs, alcohol, cigarettes or gambling there are ways of controlling it - most of it is down to the willpower of the individual. but if outside help is required then it is always available.

I am a reformed alcoholic, i have been tee-total for just over 10 years. I am an ex-smoker, i have not had a cigarette since 6.00pm on the 27th of April 2001. I have stopped all forms of gambling - apart from poker. And while all were difficult, they were not impossible.

[RED-DOG]

What a fantastic thread

Kudos to all the contributors, mention in despatches for Tighty  

[TightEnd]

Matt, I did much as you with my addictive gambling...I sought help, got it, controlled it, moved on

What I am talking about is those who have an addiction but some life event has caused it...so in effect it is a huge displacement activity. This is what happened to me. A very significant family controversy completely pushed me off the rails, though I didn't realise it at the time.

 Some people might over eat, some people might under eat, some people turn to drink, some gamble, some turn to drugs. Whatever it is if they are out of control or don't have a support mechanism around them to turn them towards help, then surely some sympathy is in order.