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ManuelsMum
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« Reply #105 on: October 17, 2011, 09:01:48 PM » |
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Maybe antitheist (as proposed by Mr Hitchens) is a better term than atheist? It doesn't carry the same 'baggage'.
That seems like more of a social crusade than participation in a philosophical debate. But it's perfectly worthwhile, I've seen pragmatic theism in all its forms, and it suck suck sucks. |
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When I was 5 years old, my mother always told me that happiness was the key to life. When I went to school, they asked me what I wanted to be when I grew up. I wrote down 'happy'. They told me i didn't understand the assignment, and I told them they didn't understand life.
J Lennon
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SirPerceval
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« Reply #106 on: October 17, 2011, 10:13:31 PM » |
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so who do I put my money on for the next pope?
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thetank
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« Reply #107 on: October 17, 2011, 10:21:43 PM » |
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I'd lay Cardinal Peter Turkson.
Then I'd bet against him.
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For super fun to exist, well defined parameters must exist for the super fun to exist within.
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boldie
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« Reply #108 on: October 18, 2011, 10:33:10 AM » |
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BTW, @ thinking that "once science explains the origin of the Universe then that's pretty does it." would silence the theists.
It honestly wouldn't, they would just say "Yeah, but god did that"..and the discussion would go on.
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Give a man a gun and he can rob a bank, give a man a bank and he can rob the world.
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Newportlad
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« Reply #109 on: October 18, 2011, 11:07:34 PM » |
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Is he unwell?
I dont think he will be too happy after reading this thread... |
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redarmi
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« Reply #110 on: October 19, 2011, 02:32:02 AM » |
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Maybe antitheist (as proposed by Mr Hitchens) is a better term than atheist? It doesn't carry the same 'baggage'.
Must admit i don't like the negativity of antitheist and that is part of my problem or uncomfortableness (is this even a word?) with my atheism in general. It just isn't very positive or comforting. A bit like saying at someones funeral or to your grandmother - "Nothing after this...just getting eaten by worms". In gambling terms it has often occurred to me that non believing is like the ultimate -EV bet. There is basically no upside to it at all. If there is even a 0.00001% chance of God existing presumably by not believing in it I have made it difficult for myself and there isn't much to be gained from not believing. If I am right then I just become dirt. unfortunately there is nothing in my brain logically that can think anything else although Buddism appeals on a couple of levels. |
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bhoywonder
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« Reply #111 on: October 19, 2011, 03:38:27 AM » |
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Maybe antitheist (as proposed by Mr Hitchens) is a better term than atheist? It doesn't carry the same 'baggage'.
Must admit i don't like the negativity of antitheist and that is part of my problem or uncomfortableness (is this even a word?) with my atheism in general. It just isn't very positive or comforting. A bit like saying at someones funeral or to your grandmother - "Nothing after this...just getting eaten by worms". In gambling terms it has often occurred to me that non believing is like the ultimate -EV bet. There is basically no upside to it at all. If there is even a 0.00001% chance of God existing presumably by not believing in it I have made it difficult for myself and there isn't much to be gained from not believing. If I am right then I just become dirt. unfortunately there is nothing in my brain logically that can think anything else although Buddism appeals on a couple of levels. Good post...... Hitchens has wrote sometimes believing in something,anything has many psychological advantages.....as in we have a purpose.....there is a point to this life thing....and you will be rewarded......but you have to remain in a state of delusion or fervour to not question your faith...... Was reading about the Mormon religion there......its very new and researchable......and in my humble opinion and hitchens an utter load of claptrap originated from a convicted fraudster and plagurist.....now if this religion could be so easily picked apart for what it is....a nonsense....and if the same could be applied for other ancient religions(much more difficult).....then there isn't much left to debate... Oh shit....I think the swing has swung for me....tbc |
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may your god go with you
Scottish Open Apat online gold medal winner 2008
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Rod
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« Reply #112 on: October 19, 2011, 07:13:26 AM » |
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Maybe antitheist (as proposed by Mr Hitchens) is a better term than atheist? It doesn't carry the same 'baggage'.
Must admit i don't like the negativity of antitheist and that is part of my problem or uncomfortableness (is this even a word?) with my atheism in general. It just isn't very positive or comforting. A bit like saying at someones funeral or to your grandmother - "Nothing after this...just getting eaten by worms". In gambling terms it has often occurred to me that non believing is like the ultimate -EV bet. There is basically no upside to it at all. If there is even a 0.00001% chance of God existing presumably by not believing in it I have made it difficult for myself and there isn't much to be gained from not believing. If I am right then I just become dirt. unfortunately there is nothing in my brain logically that can think anything else although Buddism appeals on a couple of levels. What's the upside or positive to believing in a god, what do you gain? I can think of things that you gain by not believing - although you obviously have to define that belief. I don't see why one side is more positive than the other. |
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kukushkin88
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« Reply #113 on: October 19, 2011, 07:48:34 AM » |
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Maybe antitheist (as proposed by Mr Hitchens) is a better term than atheist? It doesn't carry the same 'baggage'.
Must admit i don't like the negativity of antitheist and that is part of my problem or uncomfortableness (is this even a word?) with my atheism in general. It just isn't very positive or comforting. A bit like saying at someones funeral or to your grandmother - "Nothing after this...just getting eaten by worms". In gambling terms it has often occurred to me that non believing is like the ultimate -EV bet. There is basically no upside to it at all. If there is even a 0.00001% chance of God existing presumably by not believing in it I have made it difficult for myself and there isn't much to be gained from not believing. If I am right then I just become dirt. unfortunately there is nothing in my brain logically that can think anything else although Buddism appeals on a couple of levels. What's the upside or positive to believing in a god, what do you gain? I can think of things that you gain by not believing - although you obviously have to define that belief. I don't see why one side is more positive than the other. It´s Pascal´s wager: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pascal's_WagerDawkin´s would say something like what you gain by not believing in God is the knowledge that it´s really important to make the very most of this life as it´s all there is, he put adverts on the side of London buses saying basically this. |
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kinboshi
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« Reply #114 on: October 19, 2011, 07:49:52 AM » |
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Believing in Father Christmas is nice. Remember being disappointed as a child when I learnt he didn't exist.
Maybe if I believe in him enough he will exist, and that'll make me happy.
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'The meme for blind faith secures its own perpetuation by the simple unconscious expedient of discouraging rational inquiry.'
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SirPerceval
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« Reply #115 on: October 19, 2011, 08:59:17 AM » |
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Believing in Father Christmas is nice. Remember being disappointed as a child when I learnt he didn't exist.
Maybe if I believe in him enough he will exist, and that'll make me happy.
This post should have had a health warning with it! I should have known....  Wait a minute, if Father Christmas doesn't exist then who's going to get my kids presents this year? He does exist dammit. I've bloody well seen him at the garden center. |
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StuartHopkin
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« Reply #116 on: October 19, 2011, 09:30:13 AM » |
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You need to believe in things that aren't true. How else can they become?
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kinboshi
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« Reply #117 on: October 19, 2011, 09:44:34 AM » |
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Believing in Father Christmas is nice. Remember being disappointed as a child when I learnt he didn't exist.
Maybe if I believe in him enough he will exist, and that'll make me happy.
This post should have had a health warning with it! I should have known.... Wait a minute, if Father Christmas doesn't exist then who's going to get my kids presents this year? He does exist dammit. I've bloody well seen him at the garden center. Sorry - should have posted a spoiler warning. Or maybe a Santa clause...? |
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'The meme for blind faith secures its own perpetuation by the simple unconscious expedient of discouraging rational inquiry.'
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redarmi
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« Reply #118 on: October 19, 2011, 10:39:38 AM » |
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What's the upside or positive to believing in a god, what do you gain? I can think of things that you gain by not believing - although you obviously have to define that belief. I don't see why one side is more positive than the other.
I am not an expert on theism by any stretch but depending upon the religion The belief in eternal life and salvation must be pretty comforting and the promise of 47 virgins must be soemthing to, ahem, look forward to. On a slightly more facetious level I could do with eternal life to overcome to variance associated with low stakes MTT's on Stars. |
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thetank
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« Reply #119 on: October 19, 2011, 04:01:55 PM » |
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Pascal originally advocated spending time with religious people Maybe antitheist (as proposed by Mr Hitchens) is a better term than atheist? It doesn't carry the same 'baggage'.
Must admit i don't like the negativity of antitheist and that is part of my problem or uncomfortableness (is this even a word?) with my atheism in general. It just isn't very positive or comforting. A bit like saying at someones funeral or to your grandmother - "Nothing after this...just getting eaten by worms". In gambling terms it has often occurred to me that non believing is like the ultimate -EV bet. There is basically no upside to it at all. If there is even a 0.00001% chance of God existing presumably by not believing in it I have made it difficult for myself and there isn't much to be gained from not believing. If I am right then I just become dirt. unfortunately there is nothing in my brain logically that can think anything else although Buddism appeals on a couple of levels. What's the upside or positive to believing in a god, what do you gain? I can think of things that you gain by not believing - although you obviously have to define that belief. I don't see why one side is more positive than the other. It´s Pascal´s wager: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pascal's_WagerDawkin´s would say something like what you gain by not believing in God is the knowledge that it´s really important to make the very most of this life as it´s all there is, he put adverts on the side of London buses saying basically this. The very reason I think he should concentrate more on the Biology. His call though obv, just like everyone else he's free to crack on with whatever takes his fancy. |
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For super fun to exist, well defined parameters must exist for the super fun to exist within.
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