Jimmy Saville

[TightEnd]

I would hate to think what people think of our nation when our top stories are all about the sexual abuse of children, then and now.

It reflects well on our society, now against then, and against other countries where offences remain covered up, that such potential offences are investigated and enquiries far more likely to be brought to a conclusion

Much better for the victims too, who we know have lived with the offences of Hall and possibly others for many many years 

[horseplayer]

how many other tv "stars" that are now long gone have gone to the grave without being found out?

[aaron1867]

how many other tv "stars" that are now long gone have gone to the grave without being found out?

We will never find out, imo.

They definitely will not want to show up the failures of the past even more. So many names in windows and it just angers you that it starts to come out now.

Saville
Roache
Hall

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Davidson
Jason
Harris

[Tal]

general question

will they send an 84 year old man away to "hard" prison?

Always to start with..they are then categorised may take a week then prob ship him to Cat D holiday camp..but he will be sectioned probably

Don't think sectioning is likely unless his condition deteriorates. He has pleaded guilty and must be of sound mind to do so.

He isn't likely to be a threat to anyone wherever he is sent and sticking him in an A or BCat for a few years would be more trouble than it is worth, as they would likely have to put him in some form of protection. Plenty of kids trying to make a name for themselves or folk who don't take too kindly to people who offend against children. He'd be on constant watch in a Segregation unit, I imagine.

Only the judge can determine sentence and it is then for the authorities to decide where he is sent, after his initial stint. CPS don't "cut deals" on prison categories.

Abhorrent crime and punishment must follow. Justice will be both done and seen to be done, as best as the law allows.

[DungBeetle]

"So many names in windows and it just angers you that it starts to come out now."

This post seems to illustrate the problem.  You've lumped Saville and a guy who has pleaded guilty in the same boat as a man who has yet to proven guilty in the same boat as 3 guys who haven't even been charged yet.

[TommyD]

I 've been reading the sentencing guidelines (been a while since I had to do that).  We might well be jumping the gun implying he's going to get a long jail term.  It could easily be weeks and months rather than years.  It depends on the more specific details of what he did and in what way he assaulted these girls.  While Tal is quite right that the CPS in this country can't cut deals as to which sort of jail an offender can go to, unofficial deals are done.  Remember, they've put the rape case and another serious allegation 'on file.'  Which means they won't be actively pursuing it (however they reserve the right to go back to it, particularly if some clearer evidence comes up).  He's pleaded guilty to these offences, the much harder to prove in court rape case goes on the back burner.

From the guidelines, guilty pleas and from what I have read of the offences from the BBC reporting, I wouldn't be surprised if he's in and out in under two years.

[DungBeetle]

How does it work?  Did he plead guilty on the proviso of the more serious (but hard to prove) charge being dropped?  That seems odd that an accused can negotiate that?  Or are they treated completely seperate?

[TommyD]

How does it work?  Did he plead guilty on the proviso of the more serious (but hard to prove) charge being dropped?  That seems odd that an accused can negotiate that?  Or are they treated completely seperate?

I very much doubt the accused led the negotiations.  It'll also be nothing like L.A. Law or CIS or anything like that when the police/lawyers shout deals at people in handcuffs in dingy rooms.  Most of the stuff that goes on is unofficial, lawyers on one side let lawyers on the other side know the ways a the thing could go, lawyer's inform clients of the likely outcome of each of their actions.

[Dubai]

If he spent 2 actual years in jail id be completely astonished. Guilty pleas instantly reduces sentence by 1/3, no-one does more than half their time. For him to do 2 actual years in jail its the equivalent to a 6 year+ sentence if went to trial, which just aint happening imo

Most likely outcome is he has pled guilty to lesser chargers to avoid a trial for harder stuff. Probably get 2 years, do 9 months in jail

[kinboshi]

If he spent 2 actual years in jail id be completely astonished. Guilty pleas instantly reduces sentence by 1/3, no-one does more than half their time. For him to do 2 actual years in jail its the equivalent to a 6 year+ sentence if went to trial, which just aint happening imo

Most likely outcome is he has pled guilty to lesser chargers to avoid a trial for harder stuff. Probably get 2 years, do 9 months in jail

For 14 sexual assaults spanning 30-years, on girls aged 9-17 years?  We don't have details of what the 'sexual assualts' are, but I'd assume they're pretty serious (I don't think we're talking the odd grope), and if that's the case he'll get more than 9 months.

[TommyD]

If he spent 2 actual years in jail id be completely astonished. Guilty pleas instantly reduces sentence by 1/3, no-one does more than half their time. For him to do 2 actual years in jail its the equivalent to a 6 year+ sentence if went to trial, which just aint happening imo

Most likely outcome is he has pled guilty to lesser chargers to avoid a trial for harder stuff. Probably get 2 years, do 9 months in jail

Pretty much agree, but everything hangs one of the cases.  Sorry to be blunt, but concerning the assault of hand up a nine year old girl's skirt, how far that hand went, what he touched and how he touched could literally change his sentence by years.  The evidence on that charge is key to how long his prison term will be.

[RED-DOG]

How many common or garden, non famous people are guilty?

Banging up a few celebs is like removing a dog turd from the steps of Buckingham Palace. It looks like you're doing a good job, but there are thousands more in the bushes.

[TommyD]

How many common or garden, non famous people are guilty?

Banging up a few celebs is like removing a dog turd from the steps of Buckingham Palace. It looks like you're doing a good job, but there are thousands more in the bushes.

You're completely right.  However what I hope this'll do is renew the public's faith that sexual offenders and rapists can and will be caught, can and will be prosecuted.  The amount of rape and sexual offences reported compared to committed is shocking, one of the main reasons is that victims think they'll never get justice so why put themselves through more pain and harassment to only be called wrong or a liar at the end of it.  There needs to be public cases like this to encourage victims to report these crimes.

[kinboshi]

How many common or garden, non famous people are guilty?

Banging up a few celebs is like removing a dog turd from the steps of Buckingham Palace. It looks like you're doing a good job, but there are thousands more in the bushes.

Operation Yewtree is covering more than just famous names.

But you're right of course, most sexual assault is carried out by family members.  The positive thing from Yewtree and getting these high-profile abusers is that it highlights that it's wrong, that the victims shouldn't have suffered the abuse, the perpetrators should have been investigated a long time ago, and the police should investigate such allegations correctly.

If it means more victims of sexual abuse come forward and report these crimes it might lead to the sick men being caught earlier and others escaping the same abuse in the future.

Edit: TommyD beat me to it

[Dubai]

If he spent 2 actual years in jail id be completely astonished. Guilty pleas instantly reduces sentence by 1/3, no-one does more than half their time. For him to do 2 actual years in jail its the equivalent to a 6 year+ sentence if went to trial, which just aint happening imo

Most likely outcome is he has pled guilty to lesser chargers to avoid a trial for harder stuff. Probably get 2 years, do 9 months in jail

For 14 sexual assaults spanning 30-years, on girls aged 9-17 years?  We don't have details of what the 'sexual assualts' are, but I'd assume they're pretty serious (I don't think we're talking the odd grope), and if that's the case he'll get more than 9 months.

Getting 2 years= 9 months in jail. Which given he has pleaded guilty is a 3 year sentence at a trial. Not saying its right, just seems to be about what he will get imo