Martin O Neil

[aaron1867]

Fan base is clearly a good measure, not the measure but a good one.

and Celtic are clearly a massive club, you only need to look at any home Champions League match to see that.

But this is pretty pointed at all clubs, no? Anyone can have a better atmosphere on a CL match.

What you forget to mention is when there support is pretty poor, apparently they got 15k in a cup match at the weeken? Would these massive clubs ever get 15k in any sort of match?

Man U, Liverpool, Arsenal, Chelsea, Barca, Madrid, Bayern, Ajax, Juve, Milan, Inter & others, do they ever get 15k?

The fact is that Celtic are not cared about anywhere other than Scotland.

I don't know why I'm bothering but here goes

The atmosphere generated by the fans in Celtic’s stadium for our visit was the most impressive I’ve ever witnessed. The grounds of Liverpool and Manchester United are good and the hostile feeling of playing against Real Madrid in the Bernabeu is also excellent, but the atmosphere against Celtic was the best.
Xavi (Barcelona) (Sep 2004)

"Every professional footballer should seek to play at least one game at Celtic Park. I have never felt anything like it"
Paolo Maldini (AC Milan & Italy legend)

"Celtic fans are some of the greatest supporters I know," he said.
AC Milan midfielder Clarence Seedorf (Oct 2007)

"The Celtic fans are incredible. It is always great to play there."
Cristiano Ronaldo, Man U (2008)

"When I was at Porto my team also played in the UEFA Cup final against a Scottish side - but it was Celtic. I've never seen such emotional people. It was unbelievable!"
Jose Mourinho (ex-Porto Manager) looking back on thae UEFA cup final 2003 (May 2008)

"It is absolutely spectacular to see the fans like that "
Alberto Gilardino (Italian footballer)

"The Celtic fans are very special and the club and players can be very proud of them. They are the best I have ever heard"
Andres Iniesta (Barcelona Player, Oct 2012) before Celtic 2-1 Barcelona

"I have played many games for Spain/Barca but I've never heard fans like Celtic, they were amazing, not quiet for a single second!"
Andres Iniesta (Barcelona Player, Oct 2012) after Celtic 2-1 Barcelona


Aaron it's fine to have different opinions but you seem to revel in going against the grain on pretty much everything. When you are presented with evidence that contradicts your assertions you don't seem to able to take it on board at all. When you do this repeatedly people just don't respect that opinion.

You seem to be missing the point - A great atmosphere makes you a massive club? we are discussin whether Celtic are a big club and you have replied with "atmosphere was great"

what you forget to mention that you apparently massive club got 15k (might not be accurate 100%), but you don't give us that example.

Big club? Perhaps, maybe, not not even close on the "massive" scale.

PS - Not just me saying this.

This is hard work, I was answering the specific point about anyone having a better atmosphere at a CL game.

Yes there 15000 at the Arbroath game last week, I'm not sure what your point is there. The average attendance over the last 10 years or so since the stadium was reconstructed is in the mid 50000s. I could dig the actual stats out but I think I would be wasting more of my time.

Is this an attention thing with you btw?

But for a massive club, is it not poor to ever get a 15k attendance at any point, regardless of competition?

Not attention - I just don't agree, this is after all a forum. People moan this forum is dying, then don't like it when people don't agree with each other.

Big club discussion for me is interesting, but is all a matter of viewpoint. People go on different kinds of things, had people tell me Birmingham are a bigger club than Wednesday, then I would say we are bigger or not much smaller than Man City, but they are about to blow us out of the water with success they are getting now.

But you can disagree with me all you want, but the ridic comment here is saying Celtic would be top 5 in a better league?!

[The Baron]

So your only arguement is a crowd of 15k in a Cup match against Arbroath which a lot of fans were Boycotting??

No you're forgetting if you ask a random bloke in Europe....

[RickBFA]

"All you keep doing is giving me links to how many fans you have."


That's the point Aaron. It's a decent measure of how big a club is. Celtic can't control which league they play in, or the strength of those they play in that league but the global supporter base is so big....

A point you don't seem to be willing to accept despite many links of evidence being shown to you

A club that has loads of fans that makes it massive?

If we go by that example, then we are not far behind them.

A lot more than fans make a club 'big or 'massive' - My point is that there are plenty of bigger clubs than Celtic, they are not massive.

Come on Aaron, comparing Wednesday to Celtic is just daft and I'm a Wednesday fan.

Historically Wednesday were a top ten English club. By comparison historically Celtic won the European Cup.

Have a look at their season ticket base and ours.

Honestly mate, I'd stop digging.

[aaron1867]

"All you keep doing is giving me links to how many fans you have."


That's the point Aaron. It's a decent measure of how big a club is. Celtic can't control which league they play in, or the strength of those they play in that league but the global supporter base is so big....

A point you don't seem to be willing to accept despite many links of evidence being shown to you

A club that has loads of fans that makes it massive?

If we go by that example, then we are not far behind them.

A lot more than fans make a club 'big or 'massive' - My point is that there are plenty of bigger clubs than Celtic, they are not massive.

Come on Aaron, comparing Wednesday to Celtic is just daft and I'm a Wednesday fan.

Historically Wednesday were a top ten English club. By comparison historically Celtic won the European Cup.

Have a look at their season ticket base and ours.

Honestly mate, I'd stop digging.

I wasn't being serious.

[Snowball]

So your only arguement is a crowd of 15k in a Cup match against Arbroath which a lot of fans were Boycotting??

No you're forgetting if you ask a random bloke in Europe....

I forgot about that, the ones I bump into in Europe are usually trying to get the same briefs that I am chasing Slovaks, Pole's, Germans, Croats etc
One of the best receptions we have ever had was actually at your place after the UEFA Cup Quarter Final (under O'Neill funny enough), proper fans.

[Teacake]

Fan base is clearly a good measure, not the measure but a good one.

and Celtic are clearly a massive club, you only need to look at any home Champions League match to see that.

But this is pretty pointed at all clubs, no? Anyone can have a better atmosphere on a CL match.

What you forget to mention is when there support is pretty poor, apparently they got 15k in a cup match at the weeken? Would these massive clubs ever get 15k in any sort of match?

Man U, Liverpool, Arsenal, Chelsea, Barca, Madrid, Bayern, Ajax, Juve, Milan, Inter & others, do they ever get 15k?

The fact is that Celtic are not cared about anywhere other than Scotland.

I don't know why I'm bothering but here goes

The atmosphere generated by the fans in Celtic’s stadium for our visit was the most impressive I’ve ever witnessed. The grounds of Liverpool and Manchester United are good and the hostile feeling of playing against Real Madrid in the Bernabeu is also excellent, but the atmosphere against Celtic was the best.
Xavi (Barcelona) (Sep 2004)

"Every professional footballer should seek to play at least one game at Celtic Park. I have never felt anything like it"
Paolo Maldini (AC Milan & Italy legend)

"Celtic fans are some of the greatest supporters I know," he said.
AC Milan midfielder Clarence Seedorf (Oct 2007)

"The Celtic fans are incredible. It is always great to play there."
Cristiano Ronaldo, Man U (2008)

"When I was at Porto my team also played in the UEFA Cup final against a Scottish side - but it was Celtic. I've never seen such emotional people. It was unbelievable!"
Jose Mourinho (ex-Porto Manager) looking back on thae UEFA cup final 2003 (May 2008)

"It is absolutely spectacular to see the fans like that "
Alberto Gilardino (Italian footballer)

"The Celtic fans are very special and the club and players can be very proud of them. They are the best I have ever heard"
Andres Iniesta (Barcelona Player, Oct 2012) before Celtic 2-1 Barcelona

"I have played many games for Spain/Barca but I've never heard fans like Celtic, they were amazing, not quiet for a single second!"
Andres Iniesta (Barcelona Player, Oct 2012) after Celtic 2-1 Barcelona


Aaron it's fine to have different opinions but you seem to revel in going against the grain on pretty much everything. When you are presented with evidence that contradicts your assertions you don't seem to able to take it on board at all. When you do this repeatedly people just don't respect that opinion.

You seem to be missing the point - A great atmosphere makes you a massive club? we are discussin whether Celtic are a big club and you have replied with "atmosphere was great"

what you forget to mention that you apparently massive club got 15k (might not be accurate 100%), but you don't give us that example.

Big club? Perhaps, maybe, not not even close on the "massive" scale.

PS - Not just me saying this.

This is hard work, I was answering the specific point about anyone having a better atmosphere at a CL game.

Yes there 15000 at the Arbroath game last week, I'm not sure what your point is there. The average attendance over the last 10 years or so since the stadium was reconstructed is in the mid 50000s. I could dig the actual stats out but I think I would be wasting more of my time.

Is this an attention thing with you btw?

But for a massive club, is it not poor to ever get a 15k attendance at any point, regardless of competition?

Not attention - I just don't agree, this is after all a forum. People moan this forum is dying, then don't like it when people don't agree with each other.

Big club discussion for me is interesting, but is all a matter of viewpoint. People go on different kinds of things, had people tell me Birmingham are a bigger club than Wednesday, then I would say we are bigger or not much smaller than Man City, but they are about to blow us out of the water with success they are getting now.

But you can disagree with me all you want, but the ridic comment here is saying Celtic would be top 5 in a better league?!

I've given you a 10 year average but you concentrate on a 15000 against lower league opposition in a cup tie. The top 5 quote wasn't mine it's not one I agree with. I said a few pages back if there was a 20 team Euro League Celtic would be in it.

The attention question was because you remind me very much of Scottish Daves posting style and I know he was doing it for attention

[aaron1867]

I'm not really focusing on the 15k, I am using it as an example to show that the massive clubs do not get these sort of crowds.

With your point about a 20 team league, what would you class it on? Would you put Man City in?

Valencia, Roma, At Madrid, Newcastle, Werder Bremen, Bayern Lev, are they bigger than Celtic?

[Rod Paradise]

Aaron keeps going on about 15k at a match v Div 2 opposition just before a vital CL group match. I'm amazed he knew about it, since he'd not be interested in a small club from Scotland.....

[Snowball]

Aaron keeps going on about 15k at a match v Div 2 opposition just before a vital CL group match. I'm amazed he knew about it, since he'd not be interested in a small club from Scotland.....

Just the Man.Looking for Ticket for Hibs away for a Family friend over from Ireland if you come across any spare:)

[Rod Paradise]

Aaron keeps going on about 15k at a match v Div 2 opposition just before a vital CL group match. I'm amazed he knew about it, since he'd not be interested in a small club from Scotland.....

Just the Man.Looking for Ticket for Hibs away for a Family friend over from Ireland if you come across any spare:)

We didn't get any - but if I hear of a single one I'll pick it up for you.

[rfgqqabc]

I was just wondering Aaron :-) Of course you can say your opinions but when its so left field I scratch my head and wonder if you are looking for a rise.

I'm not implying lots of clubs won't have great CL atmospheres, so don't twist it

Just genuinely shocked (in a what does it matter anyway kind of way) that you think they aren't a big club! Same goes for Messrs Picken and Langley who think the same.

It depends on the definition. If we use historical data or fan base they are a big prefer some sort of relative ranking of power/success, which means Celtic aren't exactly the biggest about. Mentioning fan base earlier Celtic having support in America was obvious but I'd had ignored. Do they really get support in Asia? I saw man u Chelsea Liverpool Madrid Barcelona arsenal but never Celtic

[rfgqqabc]

I was just wondering Aaron :-) Of course you can say your opinions but when its so left field I scratch my head and wonder if you are looking for a rise.

I'm not implying lots of clubs won't have great CL atmospheres, so don't twist it

Just genuinely shocked (in a what does it matter anyway kind of way) that you think they aren't a big club! Same goes for Messrs Picken and Langley who think the same.

It depends on the definition. If we use historical data or fan base they are a big prefer some sort of relative ranking of power/success, which means Celtic aren't exactly the biggest about. Mentioning fan base earlier Celtic having support in America was obvious but I'd had ignored. Do they really get support in Asia? I saw man u Chelsea Liverpool Madrid Barcelona arsenal but never Celtic

Furthermore the idea of the number of bars dictating the size of the club is just ridiculous. I mean if get a 100 rovers fans to go and make themed bars will you listen to my arguments that Doncaster is a big club. Celtic have a number of bars because they have had success as a theme, not because the club is big.

Are Leeds/Wednesday and more importantly forest big clubs because of historical performance? Would you agree Porto are a big club? Especially as I imagine they get some interest from south America etc. Benefica as big a club as Celtic? Less bars for sure!

[buzzharvey22]

as a Sunderland fan i hope we dont get rid of him, the squad he has is still the complete dross that Steve Bruce managed to bring in

that said i think the team selections have been terrible this season. Adam John needs to play down the left, we need (i dont know who, maybe conor whickham) playing upfront alongside fletcher, and sessagnon playing deeper so we can actually get some supplies to the strikers. the counter attacking strategy that worked for 10 game last season just isnt working, especially when we decide to concede after 10 minutes in every game.

[Snowball]

I was just wondering Aaron :-) Of course you can say your opinions but when its so left field I scratch my head and wonder if you are looking for a rise.

I'm not implying lots of clubs won't have great CL atmospheres, so don't twist it

Just genuinely shocked (in a what does it matter anyway kind of way) that you think they aren't a big club! Same goes for Messrs Picken and Langley who think the same.

It depends on the definition. If we use historical data or fan base they are a big prefer some sort of relative ranking of power/success, which means Celtic aren't exactly the biggest about. Mentioning fan base earlier Celtic having support in America was obvious but I'd had ignored. Do they really get support in Asia? I saw man u Chelsea Liverpool Madrid Barcelona arsenal but never Celtic

Furthermore the idea of the number of bars dictating the size of the club is just ridiculous. I mean if get a 100 rovers fans to go and make themed bars will you listen to my arguments that Doncaster is a big club. Celtic have a number of bars because they have had success as a theme, not because the club is big.

Are Leeds/Wednesday and more importantly forest big clubs because of historical performance? Would you agree Porto are a big club? Especially as I imagine they get some interest from south America etc. Benefica as big a club as Celtic? Less bars for sure!

As i pointed out to Aaron when he couldn't be arsed reading the front page it was more to do with the amount of Worldwide Supporters Clubs.

[rfgqqabc]

I was just wondering Aaron :-) Of course you can say your opinions but when its so left field I scratch my head and wonder if you are looking for a rise.

I'm not implying lots of clubs won't have great CL atmospheres, so don't twist it

Just genuinely shocked (in a what does it matter anyway kind of way) that you think they aren't a big club! Same goes for Messrs Picken and Langley who think the same.

It depends on the definition. If we use historical data or fan base they are a big prefer some sort of relative ranking of power/success, which means Celtic aren't exactly the biggest about. Mentioning fan base earlier Celtic having support in America was obvious but I'd had ignored. Do they really get support in Asia? I saw man u Chelsea Liverpool Madrid Barcelona arsenal but never Celtic

Furthermore the idea of the number of bars dictating the size of the club is just ridiculous. I mean if get a 100 rovers fans to go and make themed bars will you listen to my arguments that Doncaster is a big club. Celtic have a number of bars because they have had success as a theme, not because the club is big.

Are Leeds/Wednesday and more importantly forest big clubs because of historical performance? Would you agree Porto are a big club? Especially as I imagine they get some interest from south America etc. Benefica as big a club as Celtic? Less bars for sure!

As i pointed out to Aaron when he couldn't be arsed reading the front page it was more to do with the amount of Worldwide Supporters Clubs.

Will concede that point, posting from my phone. That's my excuse and I'm sticking to it!