1/2 nlh

[Q8Holds]

PokerStars Hand #107755224630:  Hold'em No Limit ($1/$2 USD) - 2013/11/29 13:47:43 WET [2013/11/29 8:47:43 ET]
Table 'Adalberta III' 6-max Seat #6 is the button
Seat 1: patriot424 ($211.47 in chips)
Seat 2: MiiFuxU ($231.95 in chips)
Seat 3: TooOAAaAsssT ($332.18 in chips)
Seat 4: Q8Holds ($217.42 in chips)
Seat 5: piscogay ($200 in chips)
Seat 6: SlavaSVK ($200 in chips)
patriot424: posts small blind $1
MiiFuxU: posts big blind $2
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Q8Holds [ ]
TooOAAaAsssT: raises $4 to $6
Q8Holds: calls $6
piscogay: calls $6
SlavaSVK: calls $6
patriot424: folds
MiiFuxU: folds
*** FLOP *** [ ]
TooOAAaAsssT: bets $20
Q8Holds: calls $20
piscogay: folds
SlavaSVK: raises $68 to $88
TooOAAaAsssT: folds

only note "3b frm sb with q10cc cbet 22j checked 7 turn bet pot 9  river"

[Jono3131]

what are you asking?

[Q8Holds]

facing his bet what do we think? using on screen keyboard why its not very descriptive

[Rexas]

I just fold here, I know we have some sexy backdoor draws, but we aren't deep enough to flat here and see another card imo. I just assume he has it until I've played enough with him to know otherwise :p I probably also three bet pre, I'd rather not see a multi-way pot with this hand.

[Q8Holds]

I normally 3bet but in this game everyone was folding to 3betd and there was a lot of squeezing.

What can he have on the flop?
Kk,1010,ak he 3bets pre

Kq un likely and would he play this way?

Flush draws -he's getting a good price so why raise

I think his range is k10,44,maybe kj,a10 occasionally ajcc and then his bluff range is clubs and hands like aj q9 j9 10j


Sorry this is typed out bad like I said before using an onscreen keyboard lol!

Would be interesting to run through poker stove and see equity if I shove vs his range

[Jono3131]

Would be interesting to run through poker stove and see equity if I shove vs his range

if you get called, not a very good one

[Rexas]

How much have we played with this guy? To assume he has these hands as bluffs, and there are a fair few that you're highlighting for him to bluff with here, then we would need to have significant experience with this player. Knowing that he three bet Q10cc OOP and bombed the river as a bluff doesn't really tell you a great deal about his tendencies to bluff with gutshots etc. This raise also represents a little under half our stack, so it's unlikely that the guy is folding and imo decreases the possibility that he's purely airballing. Feels like flatting would be kinda bad in this spot, although if we think he is purely bluffing this is probably what we should do.

There is also a chance he has 10/10, more and more people seem to be moving towards flatting this hand. I would calculate his value range here as k/10, 44, 10/10 and very occasionally K4 ss, plus all the combo draws (AJ cc, J9 cc, 45/46/34 cc etc). All of which we are not in the best of shape against, although we do block the gutshot, I still wouldn't really like to see any of these hands. Give me a few hours to get back to the computer and I'll run some numbers and get back with our equity vs various ranges for him.

Basically I feel like his range pretty much crushes us equity wise, and if we do decide to shove here, we're basically bluffing with no real blockers, no real reads, and an underpair. Effectively readless, I can't see how this can be a long term profitable shove/call.

[Doobs]

This is 2013 on Stars 6 max and everyone is folding to 3 bets?  

If everyone folds to your 3 bet, you get $9.  Can't see an issue.

Now, I'd just kick myself and think +$9 > -$26.  Maybe I'm terrible.   It seems you had a plan, it went wrong and you are struggling to recognise it.  

Guess you must win somehow or it wouldn't be here.  

[Rexas]

Kinda agree with Doobs about 3bing pre too, if everyone is folding to them, I'd be three betting more, not less, including value hands and more bluffs. They can't all be folding to 3bets too, else we wouldn't know about the Q10 hand

[Q8Holds]

This table I feel it was by far optimum to flat with qq I agree with 3 betting and i alyways would but not on this one table....


Flatting is puke in this spot

I'm either shoving or folding I just thought it was a interesting spot ...obv not


Cheers rexas thought that was a really good post

[Rexas]

This table I feel it was by far optimum to flat with qq I agree with 3 betting and i alyways would but not on this one table....


Flatting is puke in this spot

I'm either shoving or folding I just thought it was a interesting spot ...obv not


Cheers rexas thought that was a really good post

Np, it's always worth sticking it up on the PHA if you aren't 100% about something, I learn from it as much as anyone else!

[Doobs]

You must block a lot of his funky draws with your hand, as you hold 2 queens including the queen of clubs.  So that makes QJ, AQ less likely and a lot of his club hands should include that .  Admittedly he also has KQ less often too, but that seems to not balance out the smaller number of possible draws.  He is also raising in to a big Cbet and a call, and unless you come across as a right fish, then I don't think he can be doing it that light.

I am sure I have been called by QQ in a similar spot before.  

Think Rexas has made a good post.

What does Pleno think?  

[TL900]

What does Pleno think?  

trivial ldo

[Rexas]

What does Pleno think?  

[The Squid]

This is near the bottom of your range equity-wise for calling on flop so you can safely fold. Also as pointed out we block a lot of draws.