"The Online games are not fair anymore"

[George2Loose]

Everyone's an expert and people get very arsey however u still can get tables where u can have a good time.

[Marky147]

Saying that recs should put in more work if they want to keep up is absolute bullshit to be honest. You work at your job and if your job isn't poker why the f**k would you want to work at it? I put in enough f**king work every day earning the money which I then use to fund hobbies, one of which used to be poker.

To be told be professional poker players that I should work a bit harder at my hobby just pisses me right off!! Even if I put in a bit of work it still won't be as much as the pros so all I'm doing is slowing the rate at which they're getting better than me. It's far easier to just select a new hobby that doesn't require any hard work.

Pros and better recs used to take money off me slowly. I'd happily lose a few thousand a year because I enjoyed the game and there was always a punchers chance that I may bink a decent score one day. I've completely given up with online poker as I don't feel I have a chance any more. Whether it be HUDs or whatever doesn't matter, the fun goes out of poker if you think you haven't even got a hope of that lucky bink. I won't be putting in 8 hours a day to get better, I won't be buying HUDs and learning how to use them to try to narrow the gap. I'm just not going to spend any more money at online poker.

Hobbies are supposed to be fun and the way that poker has gone recently both live and online has ripped most of the fun out of poker for me. Even in live comps I now feel like my puncher's chance has been massively reduced because of the multi-entry/re-entry thing that's being debated elsewhere on the forum.

The thing is I'm not stupid, I'm actually quite intelligent. I understand the math behind re-entry and multi-entry, I understand that a HUD won't make much difference against me because you won't play enough hands against me to ever gain any more of an edge than you already have. I understand that my recent losing run might have nothing to do with any of the above, it might just be variance. None of this matters though. I've got to the point where the combination of variance, HUDs, better players, multi entry blah blah blah has just gotten too much.

I know that I can combat most of these problems by putting in more effort or more money but I just don't want to. It seemed far easier to just drastically reduce my £10k a year contribution to the pros weekly food bills and go on a few more holidays instead.

Good luck for the future.......

Yup, just opened this thread, sums it up for me. I even don't find the live game much fun these days either as many people are just way too serious and more interested in boring the arse off me by dissecting every hand in detai after the event. Where's the old games where we could just turn up, have a few beers, a. bIt of banter, gamble a bit and generally have an enjoyable evening?

More wine, Woodsey, more wine!

I can't remember the last time I didn't enjoy a game of live poker, and that was irrespective of who was at the table.

Shots for all normally livens things up a bit

[Jamier-Host]

Everyone's an expert and people get very arsey however u still can get tables where u can have a good time.

True, although harder to find. It is refreshing to find a game you can happily punt about in though and not instantly be the superstar in the game.

Wasn't there a 4 pint+ rule on some tables at a Blonde Bash? Maybe they need to integrate with a breathalyser and have tables where you can only play if blood alcohol level is above a certain level?

[tikay]

They have this available though. Unibet has no hud, no table selection and the ability to change your screename at regular intervals - so that's pretty much everything you want. However as far as i'm aware traffic is still low on that site. In 2015 hardly anyone wins at online cash games lol, it's really not just the HUD's or the scripts, it's the dynamics of the games themselves. There's too many regs lol, and the average rec rocking up and depositing money will lose everything irrespective of whether people are using software or not because they're simply outnumbered. Nobody is going to enjoy that.

In the quarter ending June 2015, poker revenue on Unibet increased 12% compared to the same period in 2014.

No, it's not a big site, but in a market where the going is tough right now, & sites like I-Poker, PKR, Ladbrokes & many others are seeing double digit falls, that is a very encouraging set of numbers, I'd say.

The y-o-y improvement was solely down to Unibet's decision to concentrate on giving the recreationals what they want.

[tikay]

Everyone's an expert and people get very arsey however u still can get tables where u can have a good time.

This.

I found NLH cash & MTT's were getting a bit too tough, & not much fun, so I switched formats & went back to where I started Online in the late 90's - SNG's. I now play most nights, 6 tabling without any third party software, make a small profit, & have never enjoyed my poker as much.

It really is tough to win in NLH these days, but there are other games which are softer, &, some might say, more fun, & make a refreshing change from 2 card stuff. 

[david3103]

14 pages of the same argument put in much the same way by two groups of people with opposing views...

[tikay]

14 pages of the same argument put in much the same way by two groups of people with opposing views...

East is East, & West is West, & never the twain shall meet, as a poet of some repute famously wrote.

I have no idea what a twain is though.

[david3103]

A twain is what Jonathan Ross gets when he goes on holiday.


(Or it's an old-fashioned way of saying two)

[GreekStein]

Blonde posters pretty much all take poker seriously enough that it's natural the enjoyment of the game is lessened for everyone by it being less fruitful.

The Blonde crowd is a pretty savvy one when it comes to poker. There are no huge losers on here (at poker).

I think a part of the disillusionment here is that recs have gone from being able to make a few quid enjoying their hobby to most likely losing and that's always hard to take.

That said, I believe getting rid of HUDS will make that losing a little bit slower and make poker 'poker' again in a more natural sense. People don't have to fear this magic effect they think HUDS have. Therefore I'm all for it.

[RED-DOG]

14 pages of the same argument put in much the same way by two groups of people with opposing views...

East is East, & West is West, & never the twain shall meet, as a poet of some repute famously wrote.

I have no idea what a twain is though.

I have to say though, this debate has been conducted in an exemplary fashion and there have been some excellent points made by both sides. I've learned loads and enjoyed the whole thread.

[AlunB]

Anyone would classify themselves as a recreational player who wants to play headsup any game up to 5/10$ online

Texas Hold’em
Omaha Hold’em
Omaha Hi/Low 8-or-better
Pot Limit Omaha
Pot Limit Omaha 8-or-better
Stud Games
Stud Games
Stud Hi
Razz
Stud Hi/Low 8-or-better
Draw Games
2-7 Triple Draw
NL 2-7 Single Draw
Pot Limit 5 Card Draw
Badeucey
Badacey
Mixed Games
HORSE
Triple Stud
7 Game
8 Game
9 Game
10 Game
12 Game
Dealer’s Choice

I will play you on stream without a HUD. You can have a HUD. Lets go.

Sakes. This is why we can't have nice things.

[AlunB]

They have this available though. Unibet has no hud, no table selection and the ability to change your screename at regular intervals - so that's pretty much everything you want. However as far as i'm aware traffic is still low on that site. In 2015 hardly anyone wins at online cash games lol, it's really not just the HUD's or the scripts, it's the dynamics of the games themselves. There's too many regs lol, and the average rec rocking up and depositing money will lose everything irrespective of whether people are using software or not because they're simply outnumbered. Nobody is going to enjoy that.

In the quarter ending June 2015, poker revenue on Unibet increased 12% compared to the same period in 2014.

No, it's not a big site, but in a market where the going is tough right now, & sites like I-Poker, PKR, Ladbrokes & many others are seeing double digit falls, that is a very encouraging set of numbers, I'd say.

The y-o-y improvement was solely down to Unibet's decision to concentrate on giving the recreationals what they want.

It was also partly down to revenues falling off a cliff the previous year.

[tikay]

They have this available though. Unibet has no hud, no table selection and the ability to change your screename at regular intervals - so that's pretty much everything you want. However as far as i'm aware traffic is still low on that site. In 2015 hardly anyone wins at online cash games lol, it's really not just the HUD's or the scripts, it's the dynamics of the games themselves. There's too many regs lol, and the average rec rocking up and depositing money will lose everything irrespective of whether people are using software or not because they're simply outnumbered. Nobody is going to enjoy that.

In the quarter ending June 2015, poker revenue on Unibet increased 12% compared to the same period in 2014.

No, it's not a big site, but in a market where the going is tough right now, & sites like I-Poker, PKR, Ladbrokes & many others are seeing double digit falls, that is a very encouraging set of numbers, I'd say.

The y-o-y improvement was solely down to Unibet's decision to concentrate on giving the recreationals what they want.

It was also partly down to revenues falling off a cliff the previous year.

I was not aware of that, so fair comment Alun. What did they do to try & change things round?

[AlunB]

They have this available though. Unibet has no hud, no table selection and the ability to change your screename at regular intervals - so that's pretty much everything you want. However as far as i'm aware traffic is still low on that site. In 2015 hardly anyone wins at online cash games lol, it's really not just the HUD's or the scripts, it's the dynamics of the games themselves. There's too many regs lol, and the average rec rocking up and depositing money will lose everything irrespective of whether people are using software or not because they're simply outnumbered. Nobody is going to enjoy that.

In the quarter ending June 2015, poker revenue on Unibet increased 12% compared to the same period in 2014.

No, it's not a big site, but in a market where the going is tough right now, & sites like I-Poker, PKR, Ladbrokes & many others are seeing double digit falls, that is a very encouraging set of numbers, I'd say.

The y-o-y improvement was solely down to Unibet's decision to concentrate on giving the recreationals what they want.

It was also partly down to revenues falling off a cliff the previous year.

I was not aware of that, so fair comment Alun. What did they do to try & change things round?

No I meant Q2 2014 was the first quarter with the new software. As you might expect with such a radical change revenues nosedived at first. They basically halved Y-o-Y. So it's still making up lost ground at the moment. That said, making more money from poker was never really what this was about.

[AlunB]

Man this is a tilting thread....

As always you end up with a load of pros saying "this is how poker is now if you don't like it don't play" and a load of disillusioned recs going "ok, we won't play". Problem solved.

How about pros a) stop telling recs what you think they should think and b) realise that the ENTIRE GAMBLING INDUSTRY is built on making losers happy. That's it. That's the entire game.

Anything else is bullshit and a waste of everyone's time.