Italy toll charge problem.

[RED-DOG]

These are the facts with as little waffle as possible. 

During our recent motorcycle tour we avoided motorways and toll roads where ever possible, but in Genoa Italy, we accidental went on to a toll road while looking for a way around tunnel which was closed for repairs.

We arrived at a row of unmanned multi-lane barriers and tried to work out how to pay. As we were looking around the barrier opened and we rode through.

A mile further on we came to another row of barriers, this time with manned toll booths. we approached one and the operator, who spoke no English motioned to us to give give him a ticket. We, (who spoke no Italian) signed that we had no ticket. He said "No problemo" and printed one for each of us.

A mile further on, we left the toll road and pulled into a lay-by.

I examined my ticket and was surprised to find that the ticked he had given us was an unpaid toll charge of €79.20. I later found out that in the absence of a ticket he had charged us for the longest journey he possibly could.

Somewhat annoyed, I rode in a circle back to the place where we first entered the toll road to talk to him about it. This time, when I arrived at the first line of barriers I was careful to take a ticket.

I proceeded on to the second line of barriers but the man who gave me the most expensive ticket he could was no longer there. I showed the paperwork to a new guy and he threw his hands up in the air and said in very broken English that it was a crazy fine and should not have been issued. He then took it from me and typed the details into a computer and made an x sign across it, meaning, I assumed, that he had cancelled it.

When I pressed him he tried his best to explain that it wasn't cancelled, but that he had entered the details into the computer and that I must now go to an admin office in Genoa called Punt Blu and quote my registration number to finalise the process.

I went back to Genoa but couldn't find Punt Blu, so I found a tourist information office but they had no knowledge of it. I then went to a police station and drew a blank there also. Luckily on the street outside I found an Italian police officer who spoke English, he told me where the Punt Blu offices were but reminded me that it was a Sunday and that they would be closed.

Defeated for the day I continued my journey to Nice (Yes, I used the toll road) and resolved to contact Punt Blu the following day. As it turned out, the next day was a bank holiday so they were still closed.

I searched Italy toll fines on google and found their website. On there is a page where you enter the serial number from your penalty ticket, complete a declaration form explaining where you actually did enter the toll road, they check the cameras and bill you for the correct amount. Great!

Actually, no.

At this point I realised that second toll booth guy, who had tried to help, had retained the penalty ticket with the information on, so now I can't enter it in to the website. there is no provision for entering my vehicle registration number.

There is a telephone number with a recorded Italian message

I do know that the penalty notice had the usual warning that unpaid fees would increase by a substantial amount after 15 days and would include court and recovery costs.


Summary:

I used the toll road 3 times.

The first time I went approx 1 mile and was given a €79.20 penalty notice

The second time I went approx 1 mile and had my penalty notice taken away along with the (unpaid) ticked for the current journey.

The third time I wend approx 100 miles and paid €19.50

Now it seems that I will eventually receive a fine for the unpaid €79.20 plus late payment charges plus costs, or I might even receive two fines considering the fact that I used the road 3 times and only paid once, toll booth guy #2 didn't charge me anything even though I presented him with a ticket saying where I got on.

Any advice on how to proceed would be greatly appreciated.

[George2Loose]

Swallow it up and pay it would be my advice not based on any legal advice just my experience of these things dragging on (see Alex's thread on parking fines)

[Doobs]

Sorry on phone so can't do a link.   Do not pay.  You can appeal.  There is a trip advisor thread with links.  Will put it up in a bit. 

[RED-DOG]

Swallow it up and pay it would be my advice not based on any legal advice just my experience of these things dragging on (see Alex's thread on parking fines)

Yes. I agree. How do I pay?

[doubleup]

Sorry on phone so can't do a link.   Do not pay.  You can appeal.  There is a trip advisor thread with links.  Will put it up in a bit. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Trial



The attorney tells him that he can prepare a brief for K., but since the charge is unknown and the rules are unknown, it is difficult work...............K. visits the lawyer several times. The lawyer tells him incessantly how dire his situation is and tells many stories of other hopeless clients and of his behind-the-scenes efforts on behalf of these clients, and brags about his many connections. The brief is never complete. K.'s work at the bank deteriorates as he is consumed with worry about his case.

[Doobs]

Sorry on phone so can't do a link.   Do not pay.  You can appeal.  There is a trip advisor thread with links.  Will put it up in a bit. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Trial



The attorney tells him that he can prepare a brief for K., but since the charge is unknown and the rules are unknown, it is difficult work...............K. visits the lawyer several times. The lawyer tells him incessantly how dire his situation is and tells many stories of other hopeless clients and of his behind-the-scenes efforts on behalf of these clients, and brags about his many connections. The brief is never complete. K.'s work at the bank deteriorates as he is consumed with worry about his case.

What is wrong with you?  I wouldn't say hold off if it seamed hopeless. 

[Doobs]

https://www.tripadvisor.co.uk/ShowTopic-g187768-i20-k6532594-Help_with_Unpaid_Autostrade_Toll_Ticket-Italy.html

As you haven't got the ticket number you can't do relpy 8 and as you have left italy you can't do 2.

All is not lost, as you can just email them (see 17 and 18) and it seems they are sympathetic.

good luck

[RED-DOG]

https://www.tripadvisor.co.uk/ShowTopic-g187768-i20-k6532594-Help_with_Unpaid_Autostrade_Toll_Ticket-Italy.html

As you haven't got the ticket number you can't do relpy 8 and as you have left italy you can't do 2.

All is not lost, as you can just email them (see 17 and 18) and it seems they are sympathetic.

good luck

Yes that certainly looks like it will be worth a try thanks.

I'll let you know how I get on.

[doubleup]

Sorry on phone so can't do a link.   Do not pay.  You can appeal.  There is a trip advisor thread with links.  Will put it up in a bit. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Trial



The attorney tells him that he can prepare a brief for K., but since the charge is unknown and the rules are unknown, it is difficult work...............K. visits the lawyer several times. The lawyer tells him incessantly how dire his situation is and tells many stories of other hopeless clients and of his behind-the-scenes efforts on behalf of these clients, and brags about his many connections. The brief is never complete. K.'s work at the bank deteriorates as he is consumed with worry about his case.

What is wrong with you?  I wouldn't say hold off if it seamed hopeless. 

f..k forgot the smiley again.

[Doobs]

Sorry on phone so can't do a link.   Do not pay.  You can appeal.  There is a trip advisor thread with links.  Will put it up in a bit. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Trial



The attorney tells him that he can prepare a brief for K., but since the charge is unknown and the rules are unknown, it is difficult work...............K. visits the lawyer several times. The lawyer tells him incessantly how dire his situation is and tells many stories of other hopeless clients and of his behind-the-scenes efforts on behalf of these clients, and brags about his many connections. The brief is never complete. K.'s work at the bank deteriorates as he is consumed with worry about his case.

What is wrong with you?  I wouldn't say hold off if it seamed hopeless. 

f..k forgot the smiley again.

Sorry, my bad, just had a grouchy daughter wind me up and then I saw your post.  Took it way too personally

[RED-DOG]

https://www.tripadvisor.co.uk/ShowTopic-g187768-i20-k6532594-Help_with_Unpaid_Autostrade_Toll_Ticket-Italy.html

As you haven't got the ticket number you can't do relpy 8 and as you have left italy you can't do 2.

All is not lost, as you can just email them (see 17 and 18) and it seems they are sympathetic.

good luck

Well I've sent them an email nut as of yet had no reply.

I found the number of the unpaid toll ticket and completed the declaration form which comes as a PDF which then has to be faxed to them The trouble is, it won't send.


http://www.autostrade.it/documents/10279/29901/ModAutoCertifi_del_casello_autostradale_con_privacy_26.06.14_English.pdf

[ruud]

Had exactly the same thing happen to us in a car in Tuscany in 2013.

My mate who was driving emailed true relevant authority and they waived the fine.

We just said we didn't understand any of the signage etc, which to be fair is pretty tricky to understand anyway!!!

[bookiebasher]

These are the facts with as little waffle as possible. 

During our recent motorcycle tour we avoided motorways and toll roads where ever possible, but in Genoa Italy, we accidental went on to a toll road while looking for a way around tunnel which was closed for repairs.

We arrived at a row of unmanned multi-lane barriers and tried to work out how to pay. As we were looking around the barrier opened and we rode through.

A mile further on we came to another row of barriers, this time with manned toll booths. we approached one and the operator, who spoke no English motioned to us to give give him a ticket. We, (who spoke no Italian) signed that we had no ticket. He said "No problemo" and printed one for each of us.

A mile further on, we left the toll road and pulled into a lay-by.

I examined my ticket and was surprised to find that the ticked he had given us was an unpaid toll charge of €79.20. I later found out that in the absence of a ticket he had charged us for the longest journey he possibly could.

Somewhat annoyed, I rode in a circle back to the place where we first entered the toll road to talk to him about it. This time, when I arrived at the first line of barriers I was careful to take a ticket.

I proceeded on to the second line of barriers but the man who gave me the most expensive ticket he could was no longer there. I showed the paperwork to a new guy and he threw his hands up in the air and said in very broken English that it was a crazy fine and should not have been issued. He then took it from me and typed the details into a computer and made an x sign across it, meaning, I assumed, that he had cancelled it.

When I pressed him he tried his best to explain that it wasn't cancelled, but that he had entered the details into the computer and that I must now go to an admin office in Genoa called Punt Blu and quote my registration number to finalise the process.

I went back to Genoa but couldn't find Punt Blu, so I found a tourist information office but they had no knowledge of it. I then went to a police station and drew a blank there also. Luckily on the street outside I found an Italian police officer who spoke English, he told me where the Punt Blu offices were but reminded me that it was a Sunday and that they would be closed.

Defeated for the day I continued my journey to Nice (Yes, I used the toll road) and resolved to contact Punt Blu the following day. As it turned out, the next day was a bank holiday so they were still closed.

I searched Italy toll fines on google and found their website. On there is a page where you enter the serial number from your penalty ticket, complete a declaration form explaining where you actually did enter the toll road, they check the cameras and bill you for the correct amount. Great!

Actually, no.

At this point I realised that second toll booth guy, who had tried to help, had retained the penalty ticket with the information on, so now I can't enter it in to the website. there is no provision for entering my vehicle registration number.

There is a telephone number with a recorded Italian message

I do know that the penalty notice had the usual warning that unpaid fees would increase by a substantial amount after 15 days and would include court and recovery costs.


Summary:

I used the toll road 3 times.

The first time I went approx 1 mile and was given a €79.20 penalty notice

The second time I went approx 1 mile and had my penalty notice taken away along with the (unpaid) ticked for the current journey.

The third time I wend approx 100 miles and paid €19.50

Now it seems that I will eventually receive a fine for the unpaid €79.20 plus late payment charges plus costs, or I might even receive two fines considering the fact that I used the road 3 times and only paid once, toll booth guy #2 didn't charge me anything even though I presented him with a ticket saying where I got on.

Any advice on how to proceed would be greatly appreciated.

Put €26 on 35 ; €26 on 17 ; €27.20 on 5.

No need to thank me.

[booder]

These are the facts with as little waffle as possible. 

During our recent motorcycle tour we avoided motorways and toll roads where ever possible, but in Genoa Italy, we accidental went on to a toll road while looking for a way around tunnel which was closed for repairs.

We arrived at a row of unmanned multi-lane barriers and tried to work out how to pay. As we were looking around the barrier opened and we rode through.

A mile further on we came to another row of barriers, this time with manned toll booths. we approached one and the operator, who spoke no English motioned to us to give give him a ticket. We, (who spoke no Italian) signed that we had no ticket. He said "No problemo" and printed one for each of us.

A mile further on, we left the toll road and pulled into a lay-by.

I examined my ticket and was surprised to find that the ticked he had given us was an unpaid toll charge of €79.20. I later found out that in the absence of a ticket he had charged us for the longest journey he possibly could.

Somewhat annoyed, I rode in a circle back to the place where we first entered the toll road to talk to him about it. This time, when I arrived at the first line of barriers I was careful to take a ticket.

I proceeded on to the second line of barriers but the man who gave me the most expensive ticket he could was no longer there. I showed the paperwork to a new guy and he threw his hands up in the air and said in very broken English that it was a crazy fine and should not have been issued. He then took it from me and typed the details into a computer and made an x sign across it, meaning, I assumed, that he had cancelled it.

When I pressed him he tried his best to explain that it wasn't cancelled, but that he had entered the details into the computer and that I must now go to an admin office in Genoa called Punt Blu and quote my registration number to finalise the process.

I went back to Genoa but couldn't find Punt Blu, so I found a tourist information office but they had no knowledge of it. I then went to a police station and drew a blank there also. Luckily on the street outside I found an Italian police officer who spoke English, he told me where the Punt Blu offices were but reminded me that it was a Sunday and that they would be closed.

Defeated for the day I continued my journey to Nice (Yes, I used the toll road) and resolved to contact Punt Blu the following day. As it turned out, the next day was a bank holiday so they were still closed.

I searched Italy toll fines on google and found their website. On there is a page where you enter the serial number from your penalty ticket, complete a declaration form explaining where you actually did enter the toll road, they check the cameras and bill you for the correct amount. Great!

Actually, no.

At this point I realised that second toll booth guy, who had tried to help, had retained the penalty ticket with the information on, so now I can't enter it in to the website. there is no provision for entering my vehicle registration number.

There is a telephone number with a recorded Italian message

I do know that the penalty notice had the usual warning that unpaid fees would increase by a substantial amount after 15 days and would include court and recovery costs.


Summary:

I used the toll road 3 times.

The first time I went approx 1 mile and was given a €79.20 penalty notice

The second time I went approx 1 mile and had my penalty notice taken away along with the (unpaid) ticked for the current journey.

The third time I wend approx 100 miles and paid €19.50

Now it seems that I will eventually receive a fine for the unpaid €79.20 plus late payment charges plus costs, or I might even receive two fines considering the fact that I used the road 3 times and only paid once, toll booth guy #2 didn't charge me anything even though I presented him with a ticket saying where I got on.

Any advice on how to proceed would be greatly appreciated.

Put €26 on 35 ; €26 on 17 ; €27.20 on 5.

No need to thank me.

 

[RED-DOG]

Lol. I had it coming.