Television match officials and football

[Archer]

So IFAB are going to have a 2 year trial period before deciding whether to go ahead?
Can't be that simple can it?

Also it is the referee who decides to use replays, so no 'video ref' which is what most people propose. No 'challenge flag' which people on here say is easily done!

Its so easy to do - yet so many different views and no firm protocol from anyone


Generally no one is saying it is easy to do are they? The fact that a major league is running live with a system from next season is major progress  and from that starting point it will continually evolve.

[lee h]

In the Bundesliga, they are going to have 4 video refs. With a technician showing them replays 'within a few seconds'
Really (have they seena Rugby match with replays!!

Also reason 2 for example 'where the referee unjusifiably awards a penalt ir nit'

Where the ref awards a penalty- who the hell decides if its 'unjustified'. If course there will ve idd times when the ref us blatantly wrong but the vast majority of times its a matter of opinion.

What about when the ref does not award a penalty. Same thing - who decides that there should have been one? When do they stop the play? Do they review the footage if the incident? If they do and the on field ref says no penalty bit the vid ref says penalty - who has the say?

What if they are looking at that incident (say from a corner) they spot another incident which they had not seen before - do they look at that incident? Does that take preference over the other incident?

So many questions , scenarios and details.

The Bundesliga protocol is so woolly ( compared to RL or Union protocols)

[lee h]

Look at 3. 'for offences that should have lead to a red card'

Whi decides. The majority if red card decisions are a matter if opinion. Are they saying that if the on field ref gives a yellow card but the vid refs 'think' it should be red then they tell ref to send him off? I mean whos opinion is the more valuable or valid?

its simply moving one mans opinion to another's imo

[lee h]

Bundesliga 4

Mistaken identity.

Why doesnt the real culprit own up. No need fir any replays at all

[Archer]

From what I can glean the German system will be based on clear-cut decisions only in the 4 categories listed earlier in the thread. My interpretation of "clear-cut" is that they mean matters of fact rather than matters of opinion. Additionally, the final decision is with the ref on the pitch (not the video referee) who will have the final say. He will do this by having access to a pitch side monitor and obviously be able to communicate with the video ref. 

Will it delay the game? Yes, but based on the experiment over 144 games there would have been just 33 interventions - so 1 per c4.4 games - and no doubt many of these are directly after a goal has been scored and there is no interruption to the flow of the game. Presumably offsides using a Hawkeye system will be a big part of this.

I really like the sound of this and it would be really interesting to see the 33 examples of when they conclude it should be used.

[BorntoBubble]

Lee H, not sure if you are playing devils advocate or just one of the most negative people in the world.

These are all points that get tested, and ironed out.

In Cricket when technology first came in it was not perfect, they have tried loads of things, sniko, hot spot, ball tracking (2 different softwares probably more) etc. They are always tweaking but the answer is, video technology will not be perfect, but it will be better than just the naked eye.

Rugby is the same, often the on field referees sees a replay (not always an option i admit) and makes his own decision and does not use the video ref. Now in top level rugby the ref does not even stop play in some instances, he asks for an off the ball incident to be checked and within seconds he has an answer in his ear as to weather play should be stopped or not. Exactly the same could happen in football, tackle goes in, ref is not sure, allows play to continue and asks the TV ref to take a look, within 5-10seconds the TV ref says foul or no foul. Rapid, no stop in play no issue. This to me is way down the line in football though, start with goals, reds, penalties,mistaken identity etc and work up to this level.

There is going to be teething issues of course, but soon (within 5 years) it will be common place and we wont remember what it was like before!

While they are at it, shove a mic on the ref, only captains can speak to the ref. Any swearing caught at the referee is an instant 1 game ban. They is a huge issue at lower leagues with assaults, violence etc to referees, in order to stop this the top level HAVE to set a better examples.

[lee h]

Bubble, are you sure this is what happens in Rugby.

In RL vid replays are only used for two (I think) issues.

Confirmation of a try. (back to previous tackle only)

40/20 Kicks.

Never for fouls/offsides/red cards/ forward passes ior anything else!

Even with this limited use play is often stopped for 2, 3 4 minutes at a time!

Do you watch the Rugby?

[muckthenuts]

Wouldn't mind technology for offsides actually. While the celebrations are going on a tv referee could simply check if the goal is legitimate which wouldn't interrupt the flow of the game and actually add a little sweat/drama to proceedings.

[lee h]

What sbout the occasions when a player is through on goal, the ass ref flags for  offside, the player shoots and scores. Do you look at replays ( and if hes not offside - what do you do) Or do you allow this blatant error to stand?

[TheDazzler]

What sbout the occasions when a player is through on goal, the ass ref flags for  offside, the player shoots and scores. Do you look at replays ( and if hes not offside - what do you do) Or do you allow this blatant error to stand?

That's an interesting one actually. You play to the whistle obviously but the ref presumably won't whistle as it'll stop play.
So everytime a player is through on goal, even if he's almost surely offside, you'lll have to play on and then look at it on tv. And what if it's the 93rd minute and the offside player (whose team is 1-0 up) collects it and runs it into the corner. When do you blow? A useful time wasting exercise

Wouldn't mind technology for offsides actually. While the celebrations are going on a tv referee could simply check if the goal is legitimate which wouldn't interrupt the flow of the game and actually add a little sweat/drama to proceedings.

What % of given goals should have been ruled out for offside, do you think?
My flatmate asked me this a few months ago and I said maybe <10%? He said he thought it was 25%+! We checked that weekend and he was much closer. Just 1 weekend I know but I wonder are those stats available anywhere? Possiby not as the rule is open to interpretation.