Call or Fold? - What's he Got?

[Junior Senior]

but he moved the lot in and i didn't know what to do so i took the safe route of tournament survival as an option (so weak i could cry sometimes)

He who turns and runs away lives to fight another day...........

i was still sat in 4th after this hand and thought i could re-build. - on reflection though i really wish i had called. - i think he had AAA after running it over again in my head but i am still really not sure.

in a live tournament it would depend on who the player was but i would probably play it the same as a rule without information on a player or their style

Hindsight is a wonderful thing, however there is no point in beating yourself up over the decision - just because he wrote "AA" in the chat doesnt mean thats what he had, i never believe what people write when they have the option to actually show the cards! If you make the call and he turns over KQ hearts you then beat yourself up over making such a bad call - you are putting yourself in a lose lose situation where you end up beating yourself up either way. Once you have passed forget about it and move on to the next hand, like you say you are still 4th in chips so its not like you are short stacked!

To be honest you have to ask yourself "Why did i call the bet on the flop?" - answer: because you had a flush draw. So then when you hit the hand you are calling on the to hit you should have the courage of your convictions in seeing the hand through - otherwise why are you calling? I agree with the check raise on the turn putting the pressure back on your opponent, if he has a big hand like AAA then chances are he will go all in but now you are pot commited and you have to hope the board doesnt pair but if he has a hand like AK you are seriously putting him to the test - even if he has the K hearts.

Would you have played the hand differently had this been in a live tournament?

[Junior Senior]

btw, if he did have AA, he played this hand like a moron.

why would you move all in for a zillion chips when only a flush will call, and therefore beat you, and yet, so many other hands would call a smaller bet and lose but not call your all in.

that all in with AA was about as bad a play as there can be.

so, I assume he didn't have AA unless he just didn't notice the flush.

He probably therefore had a full house or biggerflush but even if he did you still should have called

he didnt have a FH as the board wasnt paired - this is what made it even harder to fold.  I came 14th in the end for a few extra peanuts than the entry fee.

[clayftknight]

sorry guys, no full house, I had too many threads up .

So yes, only higher flush to fear, this is not even worth thinking about, you lose 2 card flush over 2 card flush so rarely you can almost ignore the possibilty in multis.

But still, that play with AAA in my opinion is so damn ugly.......

[thetank]

I totally call here btw Junior. I think you may have been guilty of over-thinking the hand a little. Or is this a joke post so we all label you tight weak and bluff our chips into you too often? 

I think he assumes you would have lumped your chips in had you been able to beat him.

A lot of folks click on Muck Losing Hand in the options tab of Stars, so don't get a chance to show their cards on the odd occasion when they decide to.

I'd wager that he was telling the truth about having AA.

I never fold a 2 card flush to the possibility of a higher flush

Does this include multi-way pots clay? Say theres a bet, raise and a re-raise on the river. Are you paying off there?

Not trying to be pedantic, genuinely curious.

[Junior Senior]

its no joke tank-  i really am that easy to bully.

i shudda called i know - weak on my part

[clayftknight]

Mr Tank, yes there will be the odd exception I guess but I'd say it's a pretty damn good general rule to not fold a 2 card flush, and certainly in this situation call........thing is, more often than not, the times your flush is beat are the times the pot doesn't get silly big because they want you to pay them off .


I like over simplifying things though, I also think 95% of poker players would be more successful if they never ever bluffed, so a good general rule would be, don't bluff, full stop.

you honestly think he had AAA?  you think he just didn't see the flush?  or you think he expects a 2 pair to call there ?

[thetank]

Obviously folk lie about what they have, I just don't see why they'd say they had a near nut hand when they actually had a nut hand.
If he was lying, he probably had a worse hand than AAA. I'd wager 10 pound to win one that Juniors flush would have been good here.

The rest of the hand, the call UTG, the bet on the flop and turn could all have been AA.

Not quite understanding the all-in on river right enough. Only called if he's beat, not much value in it at all (except there was, he got a better hand to fold, but that's beside point).

All I can say is overplaying a set on a suited board is common when the 3rd of the suit is also the trip card. With only two outs to hit, when they turn a set, their thoughts go to $$$$$, and not to playing defensive tournament poker.