Branching Out....

[BlueWolf]

Hi guys n dolls.


Just posting and wondering if anyone knew the legal standings of setting up a poker joint in the mould of the gutshot and a few others in London.

It is my understanding that as they are not casinos as such licensing issues are not an issue although i know that the Gutshot has had troubles from the gaming board in the past.

maybe robert HM could be of help here with my research or any other help would be greatly appreciated

[Robert HM]

Licencing is not my area of law but I don't mind educating myself. I also know a chap who has a passing experience in the field and, by chance, is getting into poker as well. Give me a chance to bend his ear then call me, I'll pm my numbers.

[snoopy1239]

I get the feeling that the future will see a flurry of gutshot-esque set-ups.

[ifm]

aren't they under investigation?
it may be worth while to wait and see what happens before spending any cash

[AdamM]

last I heard it was still pretty much illegal. but no-one was persuing it. I recently tried to amalgamate my home games into a 4 table multi in a hotel function room or village hall. I spoke to everyone from Magistrates to Police  Licensing officers to Gaming board to Dept for sport and culture. While it took me a fortnight to get anyone to commit to an answer it was basically made clear to me that organising poker tourneys outside of a casino was impossible under current legislation (exept in private residence obviously) hopefuly Gutshot will start the ball rolling towards revision of this outdated set of laws.

[stewart]

i have a interesting story for you here,   in manchester we created our own *private club*

we hired a railway arch, got the chips, decked it out 7-8 tables,  friendly cash games 24 hours a day, nice small tourneyment on a satruday 50 rebuy, which only attracked 20+ players but still pulled in 1k for the winner

however 4 weeks ago, we was raided full riot gear the lot, we had appiled for the licence but as you can open while you are applying we did so,  this was a big no-no apparently so i suggest you find your premises, but as soon as you sign your lease hold, you apply for your licence and do not open until you get one,

we are hopeing to re-open in the next 4 weeks, on another note


another private game in blackpool?!? i doubt u will get very many players

stu

[BlueWolf]

cheers guys, just evaluating my options at moment the only issue i know of from a gaming point of view is the "rake" issue but there are clever ways around that hehehe.


Robert i'll try and get in touch but got a busy week planned so no promises but post up anything you find helpful but please dont put yourslef out for this mate as its just a bit of research at present

[Pontecarlo]

i would be interested in some advice on this as well- i have had little snippets off a few but nothing concrete
i beleive/hope i have found some sort of way to circumnavigate the rules
we have the use of a side room in a private club - not CIU affiliated or brewery owned , its owned by the members - once a fortnight we have that room for a "meeting" where we discuss poker issues? and of course pay a "membership fee" we then have a "friendly" game of poker with chips, away from prying eyes
i dont beleive that anyone would be fooled by that tripe for one minute but what are we actually doing wrong?- i have figured that if we do ge some sort of legal intervention the worse that would happen is a warning and told not to do it again - does anyone disagree?
with the explosion of poker , similar places will be shooting up all over - hopefully something legal will be written in stone in the near future
had to smile at the riot cops coming in to the game at one of the earlier posters - overkill or what ?
sooner or later these games are going to be brought to the attention of the law i agree but getting the lazy sods out to a burglary call is hard enough where i live
which brings me nicely to a tale/urban myth/joke

guy phones 999 and informs them that his garage was being broken into and the suspects were still there - could they send someone round urgently, the operator says that it will take an hour as they are busy
2 mins later he phones back up and says dont bother sending anybody , i`ve shot them both
within a minute 3 cars with armed officers have turned up, and are  battering his door down - he tells the officers that they are both in the garage, the old bill enter the garage and catch them both red handed filling their hold alls
"thought you said you had shot them" asked the police
"thought you said you were busy" replied the guy

[Robert HM]

Robert i'll try and get in touch but got a busy week planned so no promises but post up anything you find helpful but please dont put yourslef out for this mate as its just a bit of research at present

No hurry, busy myself with eveybody on holiday it seems. I want to have a look for my own interest, so don't worry.. the meter's not running 

[stewart]

cheers guys, just evaluating my options at moment the only issue i know of from a gaming point of view is the "rake" issue but there are clever ways around that hehehe.

simple way around it is to require a membership fee, and a charge for *renting the table*

be aware though it is illegal to tip dealers to my knowledge

[tikay]

The law, and the Gaming Commission's angle, is so "grey", that many clubs are opening now. Gutshot, Tomz Poker Room, a new one in East London I wrote about a month or so ago, The Western, must be others I dont know about.

Derek Kelly, of Gutshot, knows this area inside out, & I chatted to him at length about it. He believes it is NOT illegal. The Police told him it was. The Gaming Comission told him it was. So he said "right, put your money where your mouth is, put up or shut up. I am here. I am opening Gutshot. Come and get me". That was 18 months ago. He's built a terrific club, a huge membership, made a bit of money, since. And he's still open.

He's shown the way, & in years to come, the poker community may well recognize the debt we owe him.

Remember the crucial part of this tale. The Police & the GC BOTH said "you cannot do it". He said "Oh yes I can", & he went and did it. The advice from the Police & GC will always be tanted by "let's be safe, it's easy to say no, no risk to us from playing safe". But Derek has big balls & called their bluff.