blonde poker forum

Its sometimes a fine line as a moderator, not all decisions are clear cut.

One such example is jokes...what one person may find funny another may be offended by and it can be difficult to judge what is acceptable and what isn't.

I'm posting because I've deleted a series of "new" Mills/McCartney jokes that seem to have sprung up.

I chose to delete because I take the opinion, and i know tikay and the rest of the mods will agree with this, that jokes that make fun out of disability or are racist or sexist in tone are unacceptable on blonde.

I recognise that the Original posters are not out to offend and no offence has been taken by me as the moderator who happened to be online at the relevant time to deal with it.

Please use some discretion when considering posting jokes that are unlikely to be acceptable on here.


Thanks!

I agree with Tighty 100%.

From time to time, blonde Forum suffer personal attacks, usually on me, sometimes on the other Mods too, & invariably these include allegations that we are "wet", "soft", "goody two shoes", la de da de da.

Maybe we are. So what.

My thoughts & deeds, throughout my life, have been far from pure, & I have never been angelic by any standards. I've probably gambled more than any of you, had more relationships with females than most (I've always been single), done a little petty crime in my younger days, & done plenty of things I'm ashamed to admit.

But when we set blonde up, we decided we wanted it to be a "nice" place ("nice" - I can almost hear the smart-arses laughing already), where one & all could have a little fun, without seeing offensive stuff.

As a result, we have attracted a bunch of decent Members. Peeps who wish Members a Happy Birthday, congratulate someone who has cashed in a $5 tourney, Post pics of their kids.

And that's the way it's always gonna be on this site. Those who don't like it, well, you can please yourself. We ain't changing our position.

(Just out of bed here, & well grumpy, can you tell?).

xx

I, the Stallyon, am fully aware of the damage humour can cause a person who find it an insult rather than as a joke....i've had quite a few posts that have been marked as close to the bone and subsequently deleted but can safely say...I have seen the error of my ways...long gone has the stallyon you once read about and abhorred.....long live the new Stallyon  8)

stop trying to be funny it doesnt suit you ;D

that wasnt me being funny...i was being serious  >:(

I think ironside was trying to be funny, he is trying, very  8)

Blonde has alot of members. Every week more join.  The forum must be doing something right.  When people join, they stay.  It is great that the forum is a growing community.  In some ways it is like an Ant colony.  We all congratulate each other, offer support and want each other to do well.  Long may it continue.  Being a goody goody isn't so bad.  It is better than being an arrogant prat.

I think the chances of Stallyon not saying something thats a bit to close to the line within the next 24hrs is next to nil.

Lets face it though, he is bloody genious, lol. I laugh out loud 5 times a day at your posts m8, especially the ones on P4C!

well i dont think it was very funny at all...I have been told brashly that some of my comments are very shocking and downright offensive and so i publicly out my self as trying to change only to get someone knock me back. it just isnt fair

now i am confused....genious or just rude....is it time for a poll?

No polls!


Thanks for trying Stallyon....

Robert....been along time since I gave you one..










 Here ...have 9 XXXXXXXXX

I think we need more mods, a lot of stuff is getting in under the radar and there is only Tighty, Robertfish and Red these days it seems.
Snoppy is busy, ditto anTikay, Heid seems to have disappeared and Kev is a fish.

I nominate IFM!

LOL @ Flushy seconding mfi ....talk about the blind leading the blind :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D

I nominate IFM and Tank as new mods.

Someone start a poll ::)

excuse me

The Mods are all present & correct, though some of them keep a lower profile than others, but do a lot of behind the scenes work.

Additional or replacement Mods may well be needed at some point, & they have been identified already, though I have not approached them at this stage.

Oops sorry boss, no offense :D

Boss? Boss? Since when has Iron been Boss? He's Scottish.

Sorry boss, i meant bass (it's a fish mostly found in scotland) :D

Nicely dug out of trub Ian......

i think the current mods do a fantastic job......the only way to improve things is to make me a mod....after all, you'd hire a ex-burglar to see if your home is secure   :D

I second that..

I agree Maureen and i wasn't having a pop at them (it's been a while since i have :D)
I was just pointing out that overall it has become a much bigger job and with snoppy getting extra duties and a few spending less time online, coupled with the place being very busy (and getting more so) they can miss stuff or not be around when stuff is posted.
They do a good job, apart from Kev the fish.

About the only thing I don't like about Blonde is the large amount of homophpobic posts which go undeleted by moderators.

I wish they were as zealous about getting rid of genuinely offensive posts as they are about deleting posts with harmless swear words in.

Maybe if one of the mods was openly homosexual, they would be more sensitive to the issue.

lets out Kev

Fair point Camel, I shall endeveour to just call Flushy a fish from now on, rather than also suggesting he likes to be romantically involved with men.

Although not a homophobe, I recognize that it doesn't matter much as it's about how comments are percieved.

I wasn't aware that Flushy was gay.   You learn something new about people every day.  I always thought he and Ginger were an item, I didn't realise they were just good friends.   As long as we respect others decisions then there shouldn't be any problems.  Blonde always seemed like a fair place. I hadn't noticed any anti-gay comments before.  It would have just been in good humour I am sure if there were any.  I guess that explains Flushy's love for Jack Bauer then  :D

Just as a wheelchair user might be offended by jokes about disability, a homosexual might be offended by calling someone who is obviously straight "gay" or a "poof" as though it's an insult.

IFM's post is immediate evidence of such a post, which appear almost daily.

Gay bashing is not acceptable. And I am very surprised it is deemed acceptable on blondepoker.

Its not acceptable. I am genuinely surprised you think you see it on here daily.

If you say you do, I'll for one will be more alert in future.

I am not sure if Camel is being serious here, or he is joking & it has whooshed me, but I will rise to the bait, because it's very, very, important to me.

We remove any and all homophobic stuff - regularly. We always have, & always will. It's discriminatory & flaming if it's said in an offensive way. But we do allow all sorts of "laddish" comments about other guys who, in jest, are accused of being gay. It's often said of, for example, Flushy, but everyone, especially him, know it's just in fun, & it's not really intended.

There has been no single instance in blonde's history where we have allowed a serious homophobic comment to stand, AFAIK.

If anyone want to Post homophobic, racist, or any other discriminatory stuff, there are plenty of other unmoderated Poker Fora where they can go, because they are not welcome here.

I have just seen Camel's "folow-up" Post, & I will comment on that shortly.

I totally agree Camel.  But I don't think anyone on the forum would delibretly want to cause offence to the gay community.  Even the title " Gay Community" sets gay and straight people apart.  Everyone at the end of the day is a "person". We are all the same regardless of our sexual preference. 

I know you aren't gay Flushy. I was just carrying on Tanks joke. If I caused offence Camel or Flushy, I apologize.

2 quick points, firstly i don't consider that an insult, merely banter.
Secondly i think you'll find i don't call people puffs or gay, even flushy!!

As a follow-on from my Previous Post, I must confess, Camel has got me thinking here.

Taking his point about disability, for example. We often joke with Iron about the problems he meets from time to time, but it's intended, & taken, in the intended spirit. He even does it himself.

But Camel may be right when he says lads calling other lads "gay" is in fact an insult to gays. Jeez, what a fine line we tread!

I will mull this over with the Mods, & we will decide by Monday how to deal with it - clearly, to my mind, Camel has a point.

I'd say it's 90% certain that we will "outlaw" such comments in future, with a decision within 24 hours from now. One things for sure though - the "blonde is wet" crew, so violent in their attacks on blonde from the safety of their unmoderated Forums, will have a field day at our expense. But to be truthful, I don't give a hoot what they say - we must, & will, do the right thing here.

A poker player joins blondepoker.

He has heard it is fun place to talk about and discuss poker and loads of other stuff.

He also happens to be homosexual.

He stumbles upon a thread where a straight poker player is labelled a poof or gay as though that is banter.

I think he would be extremely offended. Don't you?

Just thought of something - can we ban ageist remarks?

Keith - I hear you. You have come up with an angle we had not considered previously. But just give us 24 hours, probably less, to define our position on this.

So am i str8 or gay now? This is too confusing

There is now much activity, even at this late hour, in what Sark describes as the Mods "secret room"....

yeah and while we are at it, lets ban "Fat people" jibes, "Cross eyed people" jibes, Hell lets even stop calling people "Fish" Im sure someone who has a goldfish might take exception to other people being called a name that mocks their favourite pet.

Deleting threads in preparation for new mods LOL

 :dontask: If you don't know by now, I'm doing something seriously wrong!!

Personally, I have no problem cessating all such homo-banter on blonde and would not feel unreasonable stifled if that were blondes position.

I've always been against the use of the word gay in a general derrogatory capacity, but thought it ok to allude to Flushy liking men from time to time.

I don't mind if i have to stop, there's plenty of other stuff to mock Flushy for.  :D

(Not that to call someone gay is in itself mocking them, its all about context and perception)

 :-* :-* :-* :-* :-* :-* :-* :-* :-* :-*

M, I'd love to give you one

more than you gave me

I play under a mans name online and have often been accused of playing like a girl.......is this an insult or just a good read?  :blonde:

Food for thought perhaps, before the PC police take over the word.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertainment/5049566.stm   ;goodvevil;

It is there, I tell you.  I saw it by accident. One night before I was about to go to bed, I was clicking around between threads as usual. Right before my eyes it flashed.  I panicked and remembered back to the movie "WarGames" starring Mathew Broderick.  I expected the Mods to exert their power and have me incarcerated in a hidden jail in the desert which they use for such an occurrence.  All this because I saw their secret room.   The images still haunts my mind. Tikay with his train set, Kev with his box of pies and the rest all sitting around drinking tea and eating custard creams.   It was a lavishly decorated room with a gold finish on all the furniture in case you were wondering. 

 

we do try and keep the homophobic posts off the board infact a certain blondite and a big bugger at that threaten to beat me up when i removed certain posts off his about another certain blondite

if you see any post that you think might cause someone offence please click the report to moderator button and we will try and solve the issue as soon as we can but it would be impossible for us to modertate post before they are put up but we try and get any offensive posts off ASAP

Are you sure you are allowed to say Bugger ?  ;goodvevil;

i think your allowed to say bugger if it were as an outburst e.g. oh bugger

i even think your allowed to say the word bugger to tell someone to go away e.g. bugger off

i dont think though your allowed to use it as a verb e.g. flushy buggered tank senselessly

i could be wrong though and can see this post getting deleted

I think that illustration is perfect


In a fit of weakness, I will even not delete one of Stallyon's posts containing such language as it makes the point on what is or isn't allowed perfectly IMO

though if it's just banter?

OMG, i think i need to go lay down somewhere  :D

I know, its difficult isn't it?

I though Stallyon got it spot on. You might disagree. Not easy.

Can I just say one thing on this subject-
If we cant call flushy queer,Tikay and old fart, Kev bog eyed, me a fat fish or threaten to let ironsides tyres down then how on earth are we going to have fun on here. Banter between mates is just that. Please don't make blonde too PC. Flushy has always been mocked for being the other way- its probably what most members know him for (even though its allegedly not true). If Flushy took real offence I can understand but he plays along with it. To say the homosexual community would be offended to have flushy counted as one of them is ridiculous imo. And before anyone says it I am not a homophobe.
Juvenile fun maybe, offensive surely not.

well i never !!!!   I agree with every word Ariston has written ..... i must be ill  8)

I truly believe this forum was built on the humour of it's frequenters, if you intend to police the hell out of everyone it becomes less fun and therefore less interesting.
It's one thing to call a new member names and another entirely to have a pop at flushy or i, we know it's banter and everyone who looks can see plainly that it is too.
There are many more established fora out there with far fewer regular posters, this place has grown incredibly and continues to do so, why fix it if it isn't broken?
Much better to police it on an individual post basis rather than blanket banning certain words.
Just my opinion, feel free to give me grief i can take it.

Good post Ariston!!

i think that most posts are taken in the ligh-heartedness that they were meant...if, though, a post does get a bit cutting and a bit below the belt then, it is in these rare circumstances that the forum police should then step in and deal with accordingly

Ive only just noticed how much you look like rob "the monkster" yong in your avatar stallyon (except you have more hair obviously). Quite an uncanny resemblence.

Are we still allowed to take the mick er I mean piss errrr are we still allowed to be funny about the frogs French?

Isn't the point that by taking the mick out of flushy and calling him gay you implying that it is a bad thing and thus implicitly slurring all homosexuals?

you say it all in that post Bongo ... as you put it "taking the mick" is absolutely what it is ....  its banter , its juvenile,  but at the end of the day its not an insult. 

I think it is a sad day when the censorship extends as far as the jokes and banter.  This place is in danger of becoming a sanitised, anodyne, politically correct environment.

We should never forget though that a site like this is not in any way a democratic forum. The site is owned by the persons pictured at the top of the page and exists for their commercial benefit. So I suppose understandably they will manage the site in what ever way they think best suits that purpose.

 Ac

I'm pulling a terrible hat-trick here - but I agree with Ariston, Stallyon & Colchester Kev (and will be in the shower for at least an hour tonight to wash the uncleanliness off me ;) )

If one Scotsman was to make a stand and complain about the Jock posts on here would they have to be stopped? The outcry against it would be mainly from north of the border. There's one or 2 that ruffle various feathers - but then you'd get that in the boozer as well.

I've a pal who 'came out' and got pissed off because every 'Have a drink ya big poof' comment meant an intake of breath and everybody looking to see if he was offended. He didn't want treated any different - and a bit of slagging because someone drinks a Smirnoff Ice is not homophobic.... He also knows any serious abuse to someone who is homosexual & we'd be dealing with the abuser.

Sorry Camel - I think this step is going too far.

just red completly through this thread and hers my tuppence worth for what its worth.....

seems like some people want this site to become just like how society in general is becoming to politically correct!

i worked for many years for the royal shakespeare company where i was in contact with many people who were openly gay and can assure you that the majority of gay people have no problem with gay jokes and banter. in fact on many occasions i was ridiculed for being straight and made to feel uncomfortable by a gay remark made by a homosexual colleague. this was all done in a lightheaerted banter sort of way which although made me feel uncomfortable was never said or taken to being malicious in any way.

The same goes in my eyes for diabilities, race, religeon, age or looks.as long as they are comments made lightheartedly by "friends" in the context of humour and banter i see no problem.

please "blonde" lets not get to politically correct or over sensitive. my motto has always been "if you dont laugh you cry"

Can we make jokes about wives such as:

John was driving home from one of his business trips in Northern Arizona when he saw an elderly Navajo Indian walking on the side of the road. As the trip was a long and quiet one, he stopped the car and asked the Navajo Indian if he would like a ride.  With a silent nod of thanks, the old man got into the car. Resuming the
journey, John tried in vain to make a bit of small talk with the Navajo Indian. The old man just sat silently, looking intently at everything in the car, studying every little detail, until he noticed a brown bag on the seat next to John.

"What in bag?" asked the old man.

John looked down at the brown bag and said, "It's a bottle of wine. I got it for my wife."

The Navajo Indian was silent for another moment. Then speaking with the quiet wisdom of an elder, he said, "Good trade".  :D  ;scarymoment;

Yep - I'm Rubbish & ITB hurt my feelings at BB2!!!  :( :tikay:






:kiv:

nothing wrong with that rod i was just stating a fact  ;D

Great debate this, keep it coming please.

But many of you are missing Camel's point. If (poor Flushy!) calling Flushy "a poof" is, in effect, a term of endearment, gently pee-taking - which we all know it is - the fact is, there is a jokey suggestion inherent in that which suggests being Gay is a bad thing. THAT is Camel's point.

Me? I can see, & understand, precisely & clearly, both extremes of the argument.

This Forum intends to reflect the wishes of it's members, but we want the Members to keep this place as intended - a civil & decent place where we all have a laugh.

It's not easy, &, with hindsight, I was wrong to suggest yesterday that we will reach a clear cut decision today.

I'd like this thread to continue a while longer, so we can better gauge reaction.

I'd also appreciate more input from Camel.

The Mod's views? Plenty, & varied! They can all see both sides of it. I'd say, at present, they are 50/50, roughly, between saying "yes, it's wrong, lets stop it", & "ffs, this is PC gone mad".

We will see what you guys say before arriving at a decision.

All I can say, for 100% certain is that if some Posts a genuinely homophobic comment, or flame, we will warn them, or ban them. That has always been the case, & always will be.

It really is quite interesting how many different views folks have. Swearing, for instance. Many are offended by it, many don't give a hoot. At one time we intended to ban it, but then we said, after listening to the Members, "hey, OK, swearing is OK in moderation, but please use it sparingly & in a non-offensive way" &, largely speaking, it works. But it's MUCH more difficult to Moderate when there is not a clear-cut "yes or no" Policy.

My view? I hope we can continue to keep this a fun place, but as place where nobody is discriminated against. Even the Scots & Welsh.

But it frightened the hell out of me, the suggestion that maybe Ariston has made a good Post at last. Whatever next - Ariston winning a Last-Longer? Ariston, Spammer Supreme (Retired), accusing blonde of spamming too much? Oops, I forgot, he already did......

xx

I've posted my say on the mod's board but I'll just say my 2p's worth here.

I actually think Camel has a point.

If we were to call Flushy say a "frog" (which he also isn't - and has also been used in this thread in jest) I'm pretty sure the French would take offence at their collective being used as an insult - whether it was between mates or not.

Being fairly new to contributing on blonde but having read the comments on the forum for a while there is a fine line between offensive and banter. The mods do an outstanding job on a very busy site.

Speaking from the female perspective its totally not offensive to me to call some one a 'girl' etc when playing badly but to some i guess its seen as derogatory and is used as an insult in this situation. The calls for norkage during updates dont offend me either - but the line is finely walked on occasion and other new comers esp of the female persuasion may disagree!

Each situation and post surely must be taken in context and judged as such? Out and out abuse is obviously not to be tolerated but a little common sense goes a long way.    :)

Could I suggest a few paragraphs as you join - my attempt - please get someone who can express themselves better to edit it....


PLEASE NOTE discussions (and some articles/blogs) in Blonde Poker can & will tend to be like conversations in the bar of a nice pub.

 i.e you will get some slight innuendo, various flirtations and general bloke/bird stuff. THERE IS NO INSULT INTENDED. Be you asexual bisexual or trisexual - there is no intended put-down. Anyone feeling offense please pm the mods/admin, or stand up for yourself without flaming, you'll probably get an appology as soon as the poster reads your complaint.

This attitude applies to friendly insults between Blondeites who have got to be good friends. If Tank calls Rod Paradise a Fat B@st@rd - it's a friendly dig and anyone gravitationally challenged is asked to respect that and not get all het up. Likewise digs about Kev's eye are not blanket insults on skelly folk.

Also note that just because some of the lookers on the site (ie Chilli, Mrs C, Djinn, et al ) get complimentary comments, we do not discriminate against mingers - again, Rod Paradise & Colchester Kev are well known on this site (and have been allowed to post pictures of themselves).


Likewise there will be nationally directed insults towards various countries, including all found in the Animaniacs song http://www.thatvideosite.com/view/2694.html (http://www.thatvideosite.com/view/2694.html) and more... these are allowed unless they don't offend good taste decency and are meant in humour - not to be racist and don't upset people. Please complain if they upset you, but bear all the above in mind. Note that most are met with smug "I know we're better than those XXXish b@st@rds anyway" attitudes from the YYYish people being slagged.

Finally - NO serious insult to another Blondeite or Non-Blondeite  is justifyable.
 
Please, if you are insulted,

• step back
• think of the above
• cool down
• think again

, still hurt? Then post calmly explaining that & pm the Mods. Remember it's easy to read the worst into a post and the worst intentions into a post.

So is flushy bisexual then?

Wow, what a corking Post.

Those opposed, better start Posting now, because that Post, above all others, gets it spot on for me. And what a relief that Ariston's Post is no longer the best one on this Thread - phew!

Thanks Rod. Those opposed better get their act together!

When I was about 12 or 13 I was, like many kids of that age unsure of my sexuality. I knew I liked unusal bands for a kid of my age like Soft Cell and Culture Club and I also knew I had no strong attraction for girls.

I then made a huge gamble and confided in a lad who I considered my closest friend that I thought I might be gay.

13 year old's being what they are he told everyone.

The next 3 years of my life were misery. I was bullied mercilessly. I spent break times and lunch hours locked in a toilet cubicle to save the physical and mental abuse I suffered. It was the prelude to a serious case of depression which I suffered until my late 20's.

I was called "queer", "bent", "a shirtlifter" and every other possible form of abuse a homosexual can suffer.

As it turned out I am not a homosexual. I was just a late devolper and had no real interest in girls until my late teens. I was more interested in gambling and QPR than the opposite sex. But my abuse taught me a very sobering lesson.

To label someone as a gay, even in jest is not funny. It is a clear implication that being gay is different, even wrong. And that is just not acceptable in the 21st century. The reason so many homosexuals suffer a life of misery is their inability to come out because there is a life of torment waiting for them even from their close friends and family when they do come out.

The fact no footballer has ever declared their homosexuality is a sad indictment on Britsih society because any gay footballer would know what fate awaits them when they do come out.

Every time I see someone on blonde call someone else a poof a shiver runs down my spine. Noone would ever ridicule another for being disabled or whatever.

Being a homosexual is not something wrong. It is a just a fact. Can't we leave junevile and immature behaviour for the other poker fora?

For the record. I agree entirely with ifm, Bongo, and Ariston (God help me).

Political correctness gone mad if you ask me.

Ok I admit that someone, somewhere, COULD be offended if he saw a post in which Kev refers to flushy as a big poof, but ffs, lets get real here.

What if anorexics get upset when we say Snoop is too thin, or scientists are offended by the phrase 'clever clogs’?

We will be scared of calling someone a fish soon, in case we alienate a haddock.

 

 I thought Justin Fashanu did?

I don't think he did, but everyone knew anyway. Hence his death.

i thoroughly concur. I wasnt bullied when i was younger for my sexuality but for my weight. when i was 14 I was 16 stone. 2 solid years of bullying ended up with me fully aware that everything and anything i ate was the result of my size. i developed an eating disorder and dropped to just over 8 stone by the time i was 16. i was very unhealthy and looked very ashen. It wasnt until a couple of close friends took me to one side and pushed me back onto the right track. I am now very much stocky but still keep a picture in my wallet of myself when i was waif like as a constant reminder that it isnt healthy to be thin.

Another breathtaking Post. This IS difficult, truly.

I mean, Camel ADMITS - openly, & honestly, bravely some would say - to being a QPR Supporter.

But to be serious, you have to admit, he has a point. It really is a "where do we draw the line" connundrum.

This is likely to end up as a "let's use our common-sense" jobbie, I suspect.

I once called matt a guerilla by mistake.  My knowledge of primates is better now though

Keith-we do mock ironsides disabillity in a friendly way, not just because its online- when he came to blackpool I threatened to let his tyres down after he beat me in a pot. We mock mates keith, thats what we do. There is no malice in it. If people didn't take the mickey of me in some way or another then I would be worried, I would take it as not existing/mattering. When I first called mr nowab chubbs he hated it- now everyone knows him as chubbs. When I pointed out at walsall last week how Rob was going a little "friar" on top I got a reaction and found  a soft spot. Now whenever he is giving me stick for rerereresteals etc I will remind him about the baboons arse on the back of his head. Am I going to be stopped for being "baldist"?
Earlier on someone questioned if flushy was bisexual- does that mean if he wants sex he has to buy it?  :D

One good thing though, whatever your opinion. On here you can debate it in a friendly manner, and that's what blonde is all about.

:goodpost:

I see Keith's point, i dont personally agree with it but thankfully its not my job to come to a judgement!

All i will say is if people cant call me gay does that mean that i cant refer to passive play as "playing like a girl?" Everyone knows i mean nothing by that but it makes 50% of the worlds population part of a joke.....far more than the gay population.

The problem with Rod's idea is that not everyone who reads is signed up, so they may never see it...

Wow, Camel - I've never met you, but you've got my respect for having the courage to post that.

You've also got my sympathy for the hard time you took at school.

But, after reading it and thinking on it, I still disgree with you. I feel you're castigating the very people who would stand up against anything being truly derogatory towards homosexuality.

The way I think of it is this, if I go into a long lecture about how to cook the best Christmas dinner (which by the way I am the best at), in my local, I'll get told to stop being a big woman, or to stop being a poof. That's by my mates, which includes Alan the quite obviously gay air-steward. I don't consider either a major insult. If someone was to be vindictive to Alan and call him a poof, there'd be a queue to smack the offender & rag-doll him out of the pub.

The posters on here are hopefully like your mates in a pub.... I think your post will stop the comments, but I worry that next we'll not be allowed to slag Ironsides, Tikay, or even me. If Stallyon is upset by me or Kev being slated for being heavy, then I'm sure as his mates we'd avoid it, but I'd hope he'd understand, just as we'd avoid using that to slag him because he carries scars from being picked on. If anyone is offended by anything I say I hope they'd point it out & we'll sort it.

It's a difficult subject, especially when someone has got bad experiences, but I am scared of going too PC.

Ironside won a pot? I find that very difficult to believe.

I find it very difficult to express in words why calling someone a poof in a derogatory way is so wrong.

It is probably the casual homophobia which cuts the deepest because it is such a bad reflection of the society we live in. There will always be extremist nutters and religious zealots who decree homosexuality and they are easy to deal with. But, when calling someone a poof as a casual put down is acceptable it is clear evidence that the person making the comment believs being a homosexul is something to be ashamed about. If it isn't, why make the comment in the first place?

It is very very easy to label what I think polital correctness. It is also extremely lazy. It is like calling someone a spaz or a nigger. Just not acceptable in my opinion.

Humour is nearly all based of mockery or ridicule of some aspect of humanity. There's a broad spectrum of tone across this range of course, from gentle chiding to full-blown hostility but examine any joke closely and you will nearly always find some facet of our complex behaviour is being poked fun of to some degree.

That's life! It's the world we live in and the people that we are. I would hate a world devoid of jokes, humour and mockery. How empty and colourless that world would be.

It would be very easy to find fault with almost every post made, every sentence said and every joke made if you looked hard enough.

For instance Camel, in your post, (which by the way was a very good , impressively honest one) you refer to the tone of others as "juvenile." Implicit in this is the suggestion that juveniles' behaviour is reprehensible. I know quite a few intelligent young men and women who would disagree strongly with that.

But, in reality, we all know what you meant.

And that for me cuts to the heart of the matter. What is most important is the intention behind words. If someone is looking to deliberately hurt or cause offence with what they write or say then, yes this should be addressed and curtailed.  But if people are engaging in friendly "banter" or making jokes in a sole attempt to add a little fun to others' lives, then let it lie.

Sometimes the line between acceptable and unacceptable is thinly trod. Therein debate, not censure should be the weapon of choice.

Who is using Aristons user ID, It cant be him, these posts are making sense  ;goodvevil;

I aggree with Tikay, common sense is the key to moderating the posts that may fall in to the category of " could be offensive to someone"

On blonde we have a great community spirit, there is a good balance of common sense, "banter", and intellectual posts which keep the flow of the forum going, I would dislike for Blonde to become the place where people are made to feel unwelcome, or segregated if you will.

Now imagine this, every Mod is as strict as Tighty!!, we have a hard time sneaking the cheeky stuff on to the boards as it is, poor old stallyon would be banned onthe first day, Ariston would be banned for his nonsensical posts, and i would be hung out for saying Tikay is old, Whats more no one could call Flushy any names at all!

Lets leave Blonde as it is, The mods do a good job ( even Tighty ) and long may it continue, If someone takes exception to a remark, thats what the report to mod button is for.

ok time to dismount,

BTW please excuse all spelling mistakes ( i'm just to lazy to correct them all )

I think it has to be a judgement call by the mods on each case individually. I can see your point keith and it has certainly brought a good debate into the open but I think a lot of it is harmless juvenile fun. How can I get away with calling anyone fat or bald for instance? pot and kettle comes to mind. I know of at least one blondite who is homosexual (and I don't mean Flushy) and he has never as far as I am aware been offended by any of the childish humour on here.

All I can say is I am extremely offended every time anyone calls someone else a poof.

And have been for as long as I've been a member of blondepoker.

If that makes me PC so be it.

Would you be offended if someone called a black poker player a "lucky nigger"?

I know a blonde homosexual who doesn't like it. He's just "used to it" though. I doubt he'll post on here about it as he's a lurker primarily but his veiw is very much that some gay people will take it A LOT more sensitively than others when they really shouldn't have to.

That last comment is un-necessary.

If you have read all the points and still consider it an insult then I guess it'll have to be stopped (as I've said I doubt many people will use it after you explained what upset you about it.

I just find it a shame that something has bothered you to this extent.

I believe the "lucky Nigger" remark would be completely different, I have a few friends of African heritage and they use the term " nigger" in a banter fashion the way we would use the term "Poof" if someone was being a bit girly when making decisions.

Now I would never consider allowing the word "nigger" pass my lips, when conversing with my friends, likewise the use of "paki" or "Chinky" yet within some cultures these are used as friendly banter.

Keith, I understand that the "poof" remarks can seem like a segregation of sorts, yet thats not the intent and i believe the intent is the important point here.

If someone is intent on causing ill feeling, then there is a problem to deal with.

Incidently this has been another great thread for debate.

Firstly "nigga" and "nigger" are two words with entirely different concepts.

Secondly when people use this kind of banter it is generally at each other of the same group. When aimed at someone who is NOT black/Asian/Chinese it is used to take the mick and is therefore derogatory - as in the Flushy case. If he was gay it would be banter - as he is not it is derogatory.

I have perhaps, stumbled upon the main point of what I'm trying to say.

It is casual homophobia, as well as casual discrimination of any sort which is the most offensive in my opinion.

Making a joke out of something offensive just serves to make it worse, not better.

Secondly when people use this kind of banter it is generally at each other of the same group. When aimed at someone who is NOT black/Asian/Chinese it is used to take the mick and is therefore derogatory - as in the Flushy case. If he was gay it would be banter - as he is not it is derogatory.
[/quote]

BINGO! WE HAVE A WINNER!

Aaron has described in one paragraph what I have been trying to say in 100 posts.

I should stick to poker and leave the debating to those better qualified!

How many members of Blonde have been banned since the forum started? 

I'm of german/jewish origin (imagine the stick i got at school) and would certainly take offence if someone was refered to as being jewish for being perceived to be tight.
Thus i have to agree with the camel's point of view although i have certainly smiled when flushy has been the subject of harmlessly intended abuse. I think flushy should hence just be called a girl.

BINGO! WE HAVE A WINNER!

Aaron has described in one paragraph what I have been trying to say in 100 posts.

I should stick to poker and leave the debating to those better qualified!
[/quote]

Ah, but if he had 'gay qualities' would it be back to banter. ;goodvevil;

I'm still the skinny kid with long hair that I was at 19 in my head - but I keep getting slagged for being bald and fat......

I am not in the least homophobic, and yet I would call soneone a big poof in a jokey fashion, where does that leave me?

Would it offend you if I called someone a big girl, or a crackpot, if not, why not?

Ultimatly it's up to the mods, yes?

They discern which posts are deemed to be fit for general veiwing and which ones have to be edited/deleted.

Of course it's correct for people to articulate their concerns over posts if they find them offensive but this should'nt precipitate prospective changes in blonde rules.

when action man raised his concerns over the increasing spam content on blonde the posts by snoopy and other mods at the top of the main page were moved for a time.

The sites run very well and i think that on a public forum all you can do, in keeping with spirit of blonde, is make the place as receptive as possible to the diverese array of users that you have, so by doing allowing the majority of members to continue posting in the spirit in which blonde was intended.

My point being is that its healthy to review issues of political correctness, but if your going to impliment restrictions and regulations as a result of the extremely persuasive and credulous arguments of a single member then you aleinate the majority.

I think that what the camel says is correct in that he should be able to take offence at particular posts, but i feel that the emotion that different threads provoke is part of the blonde forum ethos, varied and abundent in its panapleee of content.

I never picked up on the jokes about Flushy until yesterday. To be honest, I always had him down as a tough nut.  :D.   I am not sure why, it's just the image I had in my mind  :D.  I guess I was completely wrong again 

By saying you would call someone a big poof you are admiting you are latently homophobic. Why would you call someone a poof if you didn't subconciously think it a weakness to be a poof?

 rotflmfao

the term 'tough nut' used in all seriousness, brilliant.

LMAO!

Would you mind answering the rest of my question before I reply?

Well, there you have your case, in a nutshell.

A blonde says he is grossly offended every time someone, even in jest, is called "gay".

So, do you think we should take his concerns on board, or continue to allow him to be offended almost daily?

The rights & wrongs are almost irrelevant, in a way. Do you want that a blonde - maybe many, as Baron alludes to another - should continue to be offended, so that we can continue to make homophobic jibes? Or should we, perhaps, try & be more inventive or creative with our well-intended pee-taking?

Congratulations. The first ridiculous post of the thread.

So, if the majority think something is ok, then it is ok?

That's why racism, homophobia, sexism and all other forms of discrimination are so rife throughout the world.

The strong majority picking upon a weak minority.

That's really fair, isn't it?

Yes, you were DEFINITELY wrong there Sark!

Congratulations to you, the first hint of flaming in an otherwise friendly debate

For some reason I'd avoided this thread until now but it kept bouncing to the top until I could ignore it no more!

My view:

This forum pretty much thrives as it is.  Every now and again something appears which causes a minor problem but they are generally sorted pretty quickly by the mods/Tikay and we all move on again without too much fuss.

Many people on here speak frankly and that is part of the reason why debates are generally argued well and politely on the whole.  I dread to think what would happen if we started to over-police everything.  For a start the Mods jobs would become much harder - they'd have to delete/edit more often and would no doubt get more stick for doing that.  I also think the content of the forum would deteriorate if people were being policed too much.  Some might not bother posting at all and it would be a shame to lose any of the people who contribute so much to this site.

At the bottom of every post there is a 'Report To Moderator' button where people can report a problem to a mod privately.  I'm not sure how many people are aware of this but its something that everyone on the site should feel comfortable using.  Personally, I think we should deal with problem posts as and when they are identified as such (i.e. when someone sees something they don't like and complains about it) rather than trying to pre-empt what might be a problem.  This also allows the mods to take appropriate action, including contacting the poster if something problematic has been said and asking them not to repeat it.  If problems persist from that user then they may have to take stronger action but, hopefully, it would not reach that stage.

The problem with trying to over-censor a site is that, beyond the obvious comments which are generally offensive to all, there are a whole host of words/phrases/sentiments that are a grey area.  Some people don't mind them, others see the same thing and are offended.  Ultimately, if you extend the arm of censorship to a particular area then a whole host of others will get dragged in and ultimately someone has to decide where to draw the line.  Personally, I'd hate to have to rename myself Sheriff Somewhat-more-rotund-than-most-Man in the name of political correctness (a trivialisation maybe, but I hope you see the point).

Please don't change what isn't broken.  99% of the time this place works great.  Surely we can deal with the other 1% without making drastic changes.

Sheriff

I have no idea what a "crackpot" is.

Am I offended by you calling someone a big girl? I'm not sure. Is being a "big girl" a term of degradation? If it is, then I guess I'm offended by it. But, I don't exactly think being a girl is a something anyone could consider an insult.

But by your definition, the very fact that said it makes it an insult "or why woud I use it?"


"Why would you call someone a poof if you didn't subconciously think it a weakness to be a poof?"

I think you're over-reacting to a well worded post from Bolt Camel.

He's said you have a right to be offended, but that a blanket ban might not be the right thing to do. I think he has a point and am a bit disappointed that the good intentions and meanings from some very up-front & decent posters are not being taken into account by you.

I'm ducking out of this - if there's a ban then fair enough - I don't want to see another blondeite offended.

My vote - ask for some sensitivity and some attempt to see the other peoples point of view - from all sides, and lets see how we get on.

The Camel's post was revelatory, and bringing in childhood experiences helps to put things in perspective.

When I was at primary school, a common insult to hurl at each other was being 'a jew'. Being 'a jew' or 'jewish' was used as a comparative with any display of cheapness or stinginess, playing on the stereotype of Jews and money ("Aw, c'mon, lend me 20p - don't be a Jew" etc) . Now neither I, nor anyone else at school was Jewish, or even knew a Jew. It was just a word which was bandied about as a synonym for tightness. As we viewed it, not only were we not doing ay harm, but it wouldn't have ever crossed our minds that we were doing anything wrong.

However, imagine if a Jewish kid then joined our class, and was on the receiving end of the 'banter'. It would not be harmless to him. We may have no malice, and not mean any harm, but our words would have a negative effect on him. It might make him feel an outcast, different from others and ultimately hurt him. This would obviously be wrong.

Why were we calling each other Jews anyway? Because the term had passed into common parlance. We'd picked it up from adults and used it, without being aware of the effect it had on some people. But an effect it would have.

It's easy to substitute 'gay' for 'Jew' in the above example and draw parallels. We may use the term with no malice. Our children may use it with no malice. But the confused teenager struggling to find their place in the world discovers they're gay, a word they hear being used with negative connotations in society. How are they supposed to feel anything other than an outcast?

It is a very difficult issue in knowing where to draw the line. Draw it in one place and you have kids crying themselves to sleep at night. Draw it somewhere else and you have councils banning the nursery rhyme Ba Ba Black Sheep. It's not a problem I have a solution to.

I know you have a problem with me personally Tom. And I have no idea why.

Anything I post or say seems to upset you.

Bolt's post was beyond ridiculous. My response was considerably tamer than it could have been to keep the debate civilised.

Its a public forum and if the majority of the people think they are engaging in  friendly banter then what should the mods do?

delete every post? you see how many of the posts consist of some sort of racist, ageist, sexist, remark, that are all intened in the corrct spirit and then delete them, they'll be hardly any left.

How can you not cator to the vast majority on a public forum?

Its not just about homophobia, restricting people thus would set a precedent for every type of peice of banter that is prevelent amongst the members of blonde.

I think that if these kind of jokes are taken in the spirit in which the majority of blondes intend them to be then offence is wrongly infered.


Your talking about the world and racism, i'm talking about banter on a forum, everyones on here to have a laugh.

I'm not talking about resurecting the ideology of nazi germany or world wide opression but having a laugh on a public forum where a lot of the peopel know eachother.
 

Dunno Sark, we don't keep records.

Considering the number of Members we have, & the amount of Posts we get, (it averages some 800 a day in "normal" times) not very many at all.

Those that get banned fall into a few categories.

Professional Spammers. These sign up & instantly make a "get % rakeback on my site" sorta Posts. There are the majority, & we Ban several a week, probably half a dozen each week.

Troublemakers. Those whose SOLE purpose for joining blonde is to sabotage the place. I think we only ever had one of those though he was more than enough!

Malicious Posters. We had a few evil peeps, "skeleton in cupboard" rakers, who Post links with the sole intention of embarrassing a blonde. We have had probably two of these.

Flamers. Very few, VERY few, less than 5 I'd say, of these have been banned. We try & persuade them to Post in the blonde spirit, & they generally come round to our way of thinking pretty quickly. We try & give a "Final Warning" in these cases, & I think we have maybe 3 or 4 at that stage.

Considering almost a quarter of a million Posts have been made on blonde in less than 18 months, I think that's nothing short of miracolous, especially as we are (or maybe because we are?) so tightly moderated.

It clearly reflects the quality of the blonde Membership, also the great job the Mods do.

As does this thread - a very difficult subject indeed, yet it's been conducted without any flaming whatsoever. I can honestly say I'm extremely proud of this place. And it explains why Camel's Post exercises us so much. It's extremely important to get these things "just so".

You note, by the way, how many different Members have contributed positively, because it matters to THEM, too.

Your making an assumtion that is untrue Keith, I have no problem with you at all, and nothing you say upsets me.

I do however, disagree with you.

I am now 10 minutes from Kings Cross and I'm happy to report my new wireless laptop works perfectly!

I will be happy to continue this debate over a beer at the Vic tonight after my J4 gets cruelly outdrawn by AA as long as tonight's comp isn't sold out!

I think if you ban us from having a luagh then you also have to stop taking the mickey out of
kev- no more ocular comments
tikay- he is young really
flushy- he is really masculine honestly
me- i am a good player and will one day win a last longer bet
dewi- baaaaaaaa
chubby nowab- he is just big boned
reddog- tomsellick alike?
claire from blackpool- puppies arent for just for christmas
ifm- of course scotland are good at football and socs are not at all tight
etc
etc
etc
where is the line drawn?

I don't believe the "if the majority are happy, then it's OK" arguments holds water.

If the majority were happy with, say, racist comments, we would still ban them, even if it decimated the Member base. Some things are far more important than the health of the blonde forum.

But I've made my mind up how I will approach this, personally, in future, & will explain shortly.

how far are we going to take this?

if people werent so sensitive and learnt to take things in the light heartedness it was meant then everything would be fine.

i have a big nose, im fat and im rubbish but anyone calling anyone else any of these on blonde doesnt offend me.

the itb have a member whose ginger who we all call ginger freak.
we have an asian member we call "gandhi" or we refer to him as our token asian.
we have a member whose fat who we call fatboy.
we have a bald person we call baldie
and me personally for having a big nose am often called jewboy.

not one of us is offended by this and in a way we are having a go at the politically correct brigade for not allowing us to do and say what we like.

what it proves is that we are a close bunch of friends who are not offended by harmless jokes n banter.

I can see a couple of those being taken in offence to be honest.

As to how blonde resolves this, I still don't know. The Mods, including me, still have to come to a decision.

But whatever decision they come to, I will still do my own thing.

I don't THINK I've ever, in jest or otherwise called someone gay, but I sure never will from here on in. In jest, or otherwise.

I shall continue to berate Couch Kev for having dodgy mince-pies, Iron & the Scottish Department of blonde for being Scots, Dewi & Co for being nanny-goat-ish, Robert for being an Estate Agent, Ariston & Flushy for being hopeless.

And I shall encourage others, by example, to do the same.

But that's not to pre-judge the "official" outcome.  I shall simply do my own thing here, & I am sure most of you, now realising the impact their words can have, will do likewise.

My "if the majority's happy" contention doesn't include the pernicious, mallicious, posts that serve only to degrade and humiliate sections of the worlds population.

I would've thought that was a given but i find myself clarifying my argument so as not to come across as a racist of any sort.

sighhhhhh  

This is fine, but blonde has over 3000 members an not everyone will see this in the same way you do. Some people reading posts will be offended even when jibes aren't aimed at them.

It's not because "they don't have a sense of humour", it's beause to some people the things said above are offensive.

my post states that none of the people are offended.

ok then ace so why only a couple and not all of them?
are some discriminations in your eyes worse than others?

If you were jewish and had a big nose would you be happy about being called Jewboy?

Keith, whilst you make a good point, I am not sold that when people use the term "poof" as descriptive banter, they are also aligning themselves to being homophobic, In my life I have been called many names, "poof" was one of them, even by openly gay people and here is when i find slaw in the argument, why is it ok for one group to use the term when its not ok or inappopriate for another.

When i have been called a "poof" albeit by friends or collegues, it has been at times of acting a bit girly ( flushy like ), for example i may have thrown chips in to a pot with a limp wrist or my voice may have jumpt an octave, giving me an effeminate image.

Now whether its liked or not homosexuality and effimininity are often linked and likened its part of the growing culture that we are.

On another level, banter or ribbing is often making childish remarks about people, saying they are something, that in fact they are not. Therein lies the funny part.

I see no fault, or wrong in someones sexual preference, so why make mountains out of molehills, I appreciate the point of view that Keith has, this came through a harrowing peronal experience, Yet not everyone acts the same way at 25 - 35 -105 ( if you are tikay ) when they were 13 or 14, thats where the growing up and broadening of your mind comes in to things.

A tough decision for the mods regardless of the outcome, I have given my point on the subject.

so tikay are you saying that it is worse to call someone gay than insult someone for there race or for there size?
or is it just that it was a blonde who was offended by the gay jibes that took offence?

They are all offensive to certain people, you just can't get away from that. Most people won't be offended but the odd peron will be and that is simply unavoidable. I have a ginger friend who spent most of his youth knocking lumps out of people who referred to him in any sort of derrogatory manner, i also have ginger friends who enjoys the ginger abuse. You just can't win.

for all you know i might be jewish and no i wouldnt and am not offended by this

The thing about juvenile humour between friends is that nothing is too insulting. We have many asian players at blackpool who quite often get called taliban etc over the table by certain players. When I first heard it I thought it was offensive to them but one of them just threatened to blow up his house if he carried on. Humour between friends should not be interfeared with imo. If you bad one form of discrimination (even in a jovial way) you have to stop all forms of discrimination. How many people in wales were prosecuted for beatiality on sheep? Apart from dewi probably none yet we all mock them for it. Generalisation isn't a good thing but we are aldults on here and should be able to see the difference between humour and any malicious intent.

ive got the answer....................


why doesnt everyone stop posting then we cant upset anyone!!!!! ;goodvevil;

The point is that other Jews might be.

I think this statement offers an insight into the way you react to the things people say Keith. You perceive malice where none is intended and where most people would not.

For the record, I have always admired you, I consider you to be a friend, and have (until now) felt comfortable when offering an opposing point of view.

and so might some fatties,gingers,asians and baldies.

so why highlight the jew part of the post??

none are worse than any of the others.

This has been an interesting thread.  I was fortunate at school that I wasn't bullied, I somehow managed to stay on friendly terms with all the different  groups that make up a school class.  However I did see some close friends bullied. This was mainly due to the common things that kids are bullied for, such as being overweight or not having the right fashion.  Silly things really.  I tried to show the bully they were the same by talking to them.  This didn't always work, but sometimes it did.

I can understand Camels concerns.  However as others have already suggested, this is an open forum. As a result it is impossible to police all the members of Blonde. If the mods did this, I feel that many of the members of the forum would be afraid to post on any subject in case they had their wrists slapped as a result.

Insults aren't nice. But they are only words. I remember Claw saying recently that a player had accused her of cheating. She knew she wasn't a cheat, we all know she isn't a cheat. But it still stings when people say things that aren't true.

The only way round this is to try and ignore it.  I know that is easier said than done. But it is the only way. Until I invent my "mass mind control" machine we will continue to have our own individual beliefs, norms and values. That is a great thing about being human.  If we all believed the same, it would be boring. 

( A warning about the "mass mind control" machine.  You will all think the same thoughts as me  :D )

I am not sure what point you are making there, so I can't really answer it.

It's not a case of "worse" or "better" though. It's the case that, in life, I don't like insulting or offending people. It's as simple as that. I dislike a few people, not many, admittedly, but I don't go round insulting them, I just keep my own counsel.

And blonde is, whether we like it or not, effectively something I started, which, in many ways, reflects Dave & my ideals. And most of the blondes seem to think along the same lines, because that's how life works - like-minded folks tend to gather together.

i also was suprised with keith singling you out red amongst all these posts as concieving your post as a personal attack.

maybe there is history or an underlying problem between the two of you if not why would keith react to your post differently to the other 50 odd posts on this thread?

 :goodpost:   and you managed to articulate it withut sounding like the next hitler, something which i seemingliy failed to do.

I plucked it out quickly as the one that stood out to me most. As i said you cannot win in this situation, one mans wine is another mans poison. I'm not having a go at you.

I regularly refer to friends with names that would certainly be offensive to some groups but certainly wouldn't say it in any sort of public forum as it is a private joke and should stay that way.

I get called some very dodgy names referring to my work with kids a lot.  There is a group of people I will accept it from, they are close mates who know that I am not a "kiidy fiddler" as they call me.  

There have in the past been other comments from people who do not know me at all calling me a paedo, or as one woman put it "I'll never let you near my kids you freak".  

Now the first group would not call me these names if they thought it was true, they would also not speak to me if this was the case.  I am not offended by these people.  I consider this banter.  But I think that any blondes who did not know the situation would be offended here.  This siituation does'nt bother me, do people think it should?  

The second group are just ignorant and ignore them anyway.  

I guess the fact that I'm ok with it doesn't mean that other people won't be offended for me.  

sorry tikay. the point im trying to make is that you say you will not be refering to anyone as gay in the future but are happy to berate kev iron and the scottish boys for there disabilities and race.

just wondered why u feel comfortable with that and not comfortable with calling someone like flushy who lets be honest looks and moves a bit camp  "gay"

I agree. I didn't highlight the Jew post, Ace2M did.

If so many can be offended by this type of stuff then it has no place IMO. Just because one group of mates finds it non-offensive, that doesn't mean 3000 blondes will.

exactly the point im trying to make.
but sometimes the private joke is made in public and shouldnt be taken as offensive by anyone over hearing.

All stuff like that should have NWS (Not work safe) tag on it, so people can read it if they want or not as the case may be.

but sometimes the private joke is made in public and shouldnt be taken as offensive by anyone over hearing.

 :goodpost:

please GOD...................................NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

and il think you will find if you check my posts that i have never used any of these remarks in any of them.

ITB, I never said you have but what I am saying is that banter in your home game cannot realistically be expected to be widely accepted on a forum with over 3000 diverse members.

The fact that your mates find it non offensive doesn't mean everyone on here will.

I have trouble agreeing with that, besides which people overhearing something is far different to communicating it via a public medium and asking those who find it distasteful to ignore it.

Ahh, I understand now. You have to spell these things out for me, or use shorter words!

I throw jibes at Iron & Kev & the Scots & Welsh, & Estate Agent Robert & Hopelss flushy & Aristion in general because.....

I KNOW they like it really. Same as when Couch calls me "Pops" or Grandad - really, I see it as a term of endearment, & I know they mean no harm. If it really - REALLY - offended others, by race, or disabilty, or hopeless at pokerish, I would cease to poke fun at the Scots & Welsh & Ironside. If I honestly believe ANYONE was offended by it, I would cease immediately.

When I did my first Poker Night Live, there were numerous complaints from the Scots, who thought I was being serious. I apologised on their forum, & we - those who complained, & me - soon became good friends, & I Post there frequently now, & they don't see me as a bad person any more. But I've never once poked fun at the Scots or Welsh on PNL since, fact. I have used a little creativity in my (attempted) humour on PNL, & I get by with it.

i once worked for a company where this girl from thailand began calling herself the company thai (tie)...before long people joked with her about it and lo and behold, her father found out. forced his daughter to leave the company and tried to sue the company.... she was a good worker and hung around your neck very well  :D

Wow, interesting thread.
I would like to make a few comments on this subject but i have a tourny to get to and to make a proper post on this topic is going to take more than a couple of minutes.
One quick thing, I ran a gaming website with a very busy forum about 4-5 years ago...And this is the hardest thing to get right but i feel Blonde has such a good spirit over moding will never happen.


Jason

Thanks Bongo - that's what I was trying to say.

No offence intended ITB.

hence the reason i dont use that type of banter on here.
but that doesnt mean that if i thought i new someone well enough on here to know that they wouldnt take offence to banter of that nature then i would use it.

as i say i refer to a friend as ginger freak so when im in public your saying i cant call him this?

My best friend is Chinese and I am half Asian. We call each other some quite shocking names. In public however I curb it, as it may cause offence to those around me. I would never dream of repeating any of it on here as it would DEFINATELY cause offence.

 :goodpost:

exactly tikay it all boils down to how sensitive an individual is.

so what im saying is if you feel kev is fat n eats to many pies and you call him tubby why would you consider someone who thinks flushy is camp and acts like a women gay as being offensive?

You are correct bongo.

 :redcard: :redcard:


Seriously though none of these comments offend me, and like Tikay says they are all good fun, i enjoy it because it means i get to dish some back!

However, it clearly does offend someone on here, that someone is a very clever and senible person, we know he is not overly sensative and is friends with a lot of people on here. He is clearly not a drama queen. It then becomes apparent to me that we should try to cut it out.

I think junglecat is coming up with a list of alternative insults for me....

whenever flushy phones me or i phone him, I always answer/start the call in the same way. "Hello Poof" he always replies "hello fat b*st*rd"  ...whenever I phone Ariston or he phones me its "hello Baldy" ... "hello Clarence" (or whatever knew insult he has thought up that day)

  When I go to various venues up and down the country I hear people from all walks of life having banter across poker tables... comments ranging from "My god look at that shirt, how can you wear that in public" to "Pink shirt , you look like a poof"  and many many quips and put downs that would lead to a punch up if said to a complete stranger.  However these are NOT said to complete strangers, they are contained among a group of people that are friends and associates, and therein lies the basis of my feelings on this matter.... When I call Flushy a poof, shirt lifter, big girls blouse etc. I am saying it to HIM only. If other people get upset by me calling HIM a poof, then that isnt my problem. My comments are aimed directly at him, no one else.

Maybe I should be the one taking offence at jibes, I call flushy a poof (which he Isnt...allegedly) he calls me a fat b*st*rd (which I am)  so he is DIRECTLY making a derogatory comment about my size ... Do you see where all this ends up ?

sticks and stones may break your bones but names will never hurt you !!

Amen.

I don't think it IS offensive - but if I did, I would not say it. By the way, I have never referred to Kev (on the Forum, but I do in private) as fat, because many people (me included) are, & that's a sensitive area for many.

And I really don't think that suggesting Flushy is gay or camp offends a soul - or I did not before this thread. I have never called him that, ever, but now I've seen that it offends some OTHERS, I never will, for sure.

This is extraordinary. A thread that contains good Posts by both Ariston & Flushy. That's a first.

What is this place coming to?

Kev i agree with you 100% there, the problem is a forum is a place you will be overheard!

So if i were to call Flushy a big girls blouse, would big girls be offended, we all know that I would really be meaning to call him a poof, but because I didnt actually use that word that would be ok ?

Confused from Colchester

There should be some forum rules/guidelines.

One person thinks it is a hilarious joke, where another thinks the same statement is very dis-tasteful.

Kev, I think the difference between the 2 is that poof can be used to mean "effeminate" and "homosexual", whereas big girls blouse doesn't have any homosexual connotation to it?



(nicked from dictionary.com http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=poof)

flushy u knew i was joking and i was hopeing you would pick up on it  :D

and you reacted in just the way i expected u to fair play! :D

Could panth hurry up with the list of approved insults for flushie cause I'm struggling to find ones funny but inoffensive.

Sincerely tho flushie, I for one, have never been in doubt about your sexuality..... not that there's anything wrong with your choice.

Now lets all shake hands and get a sauna !

I still follow the rules taught to me years ago.  I still walk on the left in corridors.

Wow - so do I!

And open doors for Ladies.

And give up my seat on trains & buses to people older than me.

And give up my seat on trains & buses to people older than me.


[/quote]


cant be many left around tikay ;D

Exactly the point here i feel, its not the subject of the joke that is offended it is the people "overhearing" it.

P.S. Kev you are a fat bastard!

cant be many left around tikay ;D
[/quote]

It's worse than that. An elderly Lady got up & offered me HER seat last week!

Oh please ... so its just the word poof thats offensive then, big girls blouse(although it means exactly the same) is acceptable ?

This is where the politically correct brigades case falls apart, simply by substituting one word for another you get the same result, then they want to ban that word... then they use another word and that gets banned ..and so on and so on and so on ...

At school we used to have Black boards (called this because they were black... amazingly enough) then they were not allowed to be called that, so they renamed them Chalk boards....  Imagine my amazement when talking to my Kids and going to school open evenings etc. that they now have White boards !!!  Why is Black board offensive to Black people, and why is it ok to call them White boards .... isnt that offensive to white people ?

Political correctness...my arse.

Kev i agree with you 100%, its just in this case surely we can avoid making these jokes (which lets face it are hardly integral to out survival) because Keith would rather we didnt.....

And we're back where we started

Hehe.

But I do wish Flushy would stop making sensible Posts. It's very disconcerting. Kinda like seeing Couch Kev play a poker hand well - you know it won't happen again.

mohammed ali was a veerment opponent of  words that were prefixed with the word "black" and were generally held as having a negative connatation such as
black magic and black sheep of the family.

I dont know the derivation of these terms but am interested to know if the term blackboard was genuinly changed so as to conform with modern day political correctness.

If so, just laughable

It only means the same in the context in which you use it, which is what creates the problem.

If you use the other word you can still make the same joke but not offend anyone.

Unless I'm wrong about the meaning of "big girls blouse"

Don't worry i will go back to trouble making later.

No you wont!!

I reckon I am with the majority here when I say leave things as they are and use common sense and tact when posting.

IMO its nonsense to say that by poking fun at someone by calling them gay is degradation.  Its life, get on with it.

Where do you draw the line?  I reckon as long as their is no malice meant with anything and its taken in the spirit it is meant then its acceptable.

I mean we could be here all day imagine the posts that where to be pulled.

You couldn't call a Scotsman a Jock, and Irishman a Paddy, No jokes about Welsh activities with Sheep.  Can't call flushy a jessy, can't poke fun at TK for being the oldest living man in the world. 

If people are offended by this banter then they really need to lighten up.

I tell you just now I would hate to be part of a forum that was so far up its @rse with all the PC stuff.

I agreee with Kev 100% to

FFS youc ant even sing Bah Bah Blacksheep anymore its wooly sheep!!

"There will always be extremist nutters and religious zealots who decree homosexuality and they are easy to deal with".

This was something Camel said and it illustrates how perfectly impossible it is to please everyone and for the most PC person to be PC all the time.

Harking back to some childhood memories, teaching of values / morals tended to be inextricably linked with religion. I'm not a religious person and very far from perfect but some kind of code, social responsibility is at the back of my mind all the time.

Anyway, the point is the linking of a 'set of values' for want of a better expression ( as opposed to the anarchy of complete self gratification/hedonism ) to 'religion' has probably stayed with me.

As a result, and I mean this genuinely, I have always found blasphemy offensive. Some would say there is no such concept as blasphemy but to me there is and it offends me. Not to the point of screaming it from the rooftops but it never sits well when I hear it.

Now Camel's remarks get nowhere near blasphemy but other peoples views don't line up with his and so he finds it acceptable to use the phrase "extremist nutters & religious zealots" about people who think differently. I am sure there are many Christians. Muslims et al who would find this offensive - to be sure they are unlikely to be the natural constituency of a poker forum but I am sure there are some people of faith here who would prefer not to be described as a nutter or zealot for their personal faith and choices.

Well i certainly dont want to fall out with Keith, I dont want to fall out with anyone.

But it worries me that ONE voice can make us all change the way we talk to each other on the forum... and it also concerns me that this will lead to a spate of complaints from people about every exchange between mates... Look at the cincins threads for example, those boys rip each other to shreds , but still remain mates and share a table together most nights.

I guess I just find it strange that in this day and age people take offence in certain things... this is a poker forum, poker is gambling... therefor it is played by over 18,s.  

I shall refrain from using the word poof in future... NOT because i think it is insulting or derogatory, and Not because it upsets Keith ... I shall not use it again cos i cant be arsed to argue the toss anymore... chalk another one up for the Liberals !!!

The drinks are on Charles Kennedy

I heard recently about Chris Moyles not getting into much trouble when using the word gay on air. He claimed he was using it in the sense of gay = bad, not homosexual and that he should not be reprimanded over its use because it was now such a widely used derogatory word. The meaning of a word can be culturally transformed when it is overused out of context by a large enough group of people for a long enough period of time. A bad defence is u ask me, but he got away with it. ;)

I asked Race and Ethnicity tutors at work - what is PC nowadays  "coloured" or "black"?


Answer:    Black is PC ,  coloured is not!!

Yet I feel bad using the word black, and more comfortable saying coloured!!


Flushy - to me you will always be   "OI FISH"   lol   xxxx

I've woken up in the afternoon, have read the thread, and it is now early evening.

Here are my thoughts.

Banter is important to blonde, but so is the community spirit.

One of our blondite brothers has spoken out, saying that a particular word offends him. I say fair enough, can't we, as a community, stop using that word as he has articulately explained as to why it makes him cringe.

Perhaps because Camel has alluded to everyone using that word being homophobic, it made us all draw battle lines across the sand, when instead we should be working together positively to reach a compromise. The majority of posters on this thread feel their rights to free banter are being attacked.

In the knowledge that the words "poof," "gay," "big cream puff," or "shirt lifter" etc offend a fellow blondite, I, for one, have no problem to stop using them on this board.

I can enjoy the same banter by instead alluding to someone being "camp," "effiminate," or "a big jessie"

After all, being camp is not the same as being gay.
I have known gay people who are not the least bit effiminate, and straight people who are as camp as a row of tents.

If I can make essentially the same jokes that were made before, and just change the language a little so as not to offend a fellow blondite/blondites. Is that such a bad thing? Is your blonde experience going to be affected that much is you call someone effiminate, when you mean effiminate, and steer clear of alluding to their bedroom habits and sexual preferences.

Not politically correctness gone mad, just respect for other peoples feelings who have been brave and made a stand, making their opinions known.

What's the worse of two evils, changing the words you use in a few posts every now and then, or marginalising one of our members. Remember, as Baron says, there may be many more who are afraid to speak out.

When posting something, the manner in which it was written and the sentiment behind it is all very well....BUT.....the manner in which it can be percieved is all that matters. If you have offended someone by no intent of your own, there is still a need to apologise and perhaps modify your choice of language in future.

when will the PC stop....

Do I avoid people hole covers in the street, do I know support Peoplechester United, for stag do's do i go to Colouredpool, do I know go on holiday to the Isle of People?

Ba-ba-black sheep CANNOT be sung as a nursery rhyme in school.

It has changed to ba-ba-rainbow sheep.

The term blackboard was changed to chalkboard. But they have since introduced felt tip pen boards, guess what they have called these boards? White boards.

Well trace, black people like being called Black and not coloured.

They hardly look like rainbows, so dont feel bad.

I wont be swung that easy. I am sorry keith has not gotten over a traumatic experience when he was a child but The voice of one should not mean all of us have to change. As a child i spent several months in a wheelchair and then several more on crutches and in calipers- I was called all sorts of names- will this stop me having some banter with ironside? not a sniff. If you cannot get over things that happened when you where younger keith i suggest it may be something you need to look at, not something we should all have to change our behaviour because of. We are all adults on here and I will not think every time I type a post to make sure I don't upset someone. I say it as I see it and I don't mean any harm by it. I am never offensive deliberately but for me the first time I camr across flushy was him having the mickey taken out of him. This has actually worked out quite well for him as he is one of the most well known forumites. I can guarantee if you did a poll to all forumites with "use one word to descibe flushy" that puff would be right up there at the top with fish.

and you get those that say they are of ethnic-origin....ffs just come out and say it...i dont care what colour your skin is, what colour your hair is, what colour your eyes are and whether or not you bend over for it....at the end of the day your blood is red and your tears are salty...and thats all that matters

Have you watched any of the really old fools and horses?

the stuff they got away with!!  but it's very funny and non mallicious so am i a bad person for finding it funny?

if you think Derrick Trotter was a bit non-PC just think of how PC Alf Garnett was

Little Britain? ? ?  ? ?

That was quality though, alf garnett, legend

I find the politically correctness gone mad arguments a little trumped up.

Let's say I was in a pub with a group of friends, one of whom had long hair. Say we all called him a hippy.

If he politley asked us not to call him a hippy and explained why it offended him, we'd stop calling him a hippy, end of. Plenty other mays to mock them, we'll call them Teresa instead. No-one would harp on about person hole covers.

Blonde may be a wider community than a few folk in a pub, but at the moment I see no danger of politically correctness "going mad"

Can we not just respect one of our members requests?

In fact, I see no need for censorship or administrative legislation here, just politely ask everyone to have some consideration, and go from there.

I got called a " gay ..... fag" once by a tramp.  It was the morning of the Scotland vs England football match at Hampden. I was suppose to be working as part of the security team on the gate, but was running abit late.  I had been to an early morning karate class that finished at 10am and decided to just leave my karate suit on rather than waste time getting changed before my train left Kilmarnock. 

I was carrying a rucksack with my change of clothes, a ladies handbag, and a bouquet of flowers.  After arriving at the railway station, I was leaning against a post listening to a copy of " Snowhite and the seven Dwarfs" on my CD Walkman. I heard a large yelp and looked over to see a dirty looking guy kicking a dog. He was obviously drunk and was swaying all over the place.  He had a friend who was slouched on the adjacent bench. 

A moment or so later he kicked the dog again. I ran over to him and told him not to touch the dog and if he didn't want him, then I would take him to a shelter . The tramp took offence to this and lunged at me with a bottle. My CD was still playing at this time and as I tried to turn it off, it only became louder. To be honest, I have always had a phobia of germs and dirt and was abit afraid to hit him. So I thought my best option would be to just dodge the swings he was taking at me rather than touch him. All I could here in the background was my CD playing  " Mirror, mirror upon the wall, Who is the loveliest in the land ". This went on for a minute or so before I saw a bunch of guys running in my direction.  They were plain clothes police who were there because of the football match.  The tramp and his friend got taken away by them, and they promised to take care of the dog. 

He shouted at me " F.....  ,  I will kill you, you gay.......fag" as he was being dragged away. It took me awhile to figure out why he had called me gay. It then dawned on me, I was the only guy on the platform holding flowers and a handbag.


I was returning the handbag  to a friends mum and the flowers were also for her.

 

;iagree; ;iagree; ;iagree; ;iagree; ;iagree;

I for one am truly appalled at the use of the phrase 'political correctness gone mad'. I suspect mad people are not too keen on it either...

Youi could not make this stuff up, you just could not.......

A fag is something that is smoked - Tribecca piss me off completely for having this word censored as it means something else in the USA.   Crap is also censored - God knows why!

Whatever happened to Gay meaning Happy?


I wonder what Enid Blyton would make of all this - she so loved the word spunk in her books!  And I'm sure Dick and Julian were gay every now and then.

fair enough. what about if you were in the pub and u called your mate a hippy and someone on the other side of the bar said- do you mind I used to have long hair and I'm offended by that comment. would you say "ok then sorry about that "and never call your mate a hippy again? Or is it more likely you would just say it quieter?

the basis of your argument throughout your posts tank seems to be that by changing the wording you remove the implied intent of your comment.

This cant be the case can it?

the underlying meaning trancends the wording and therfore has the potential to offend not only the recipiant but a third and independant party that translates the sentiment, eroneously or not, as being of a derogatory nature.

There has been a succession of posts that have tried to prove the point one way or another with individual examples of symantic manipulation.

Fatuous if you ask me, if you intend to question someones sexuality for the purposes of provoking laughter then irrespective of the wording it is open to
misinterpretation.

 

That - most especially the final Para - probably sums it up, & is almost certainly the way we will go.

Tikay - what did the word sissy refer to back in your day?

I was a famous five fan, I had a crush on George.

I wanted to be George - so full of spunk -  allegedly.

I assume the same as in your day Trace - there is, what, 5 years between us?

Tracy, yr incredibly rude last line made me laugh like a hyena !!

Yes it can.

1. Flushy is a big cream puff

2. Flushy is as camp as a boy scout jambouree.

Both mean the same to me, both mean the same to Royal Flush.

A third party could use the argument that I'm implying as to Royal Flush's sexuality in a derrogotory way in the first, but not really the second.

Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha 

omg  someone call an ambulance - i think im about to have a laughing-hysterically-need-some-emergency-help type fit here!!!

I'm only 13 FFS Tikay!

I didn't mean that to read as an ageist thing Tikay, more of a different generation type thing!   ok I may as well stop back peddling - my laughing has done enough damage I guess.

Nirv dahlingggggggggggg - you know I aim to please!  <wink>

xxxxx
Loves ya

how are you posting on trace t's account flushy?

I'm hurting now, Trace.

Well I ain't kissing it better - it'd be like incest.

 ;tk;

I'd say it quiter, outwith their earshot.

In the context of a public forum such as this, that means not posting it, or pm-ing it.

Trigger 10-15 PM's to Flushie calling him a cream cake....

Just what I thought you would say. We cant say anything quieter on a forum, its meant to be fun on here. In a pub scenario I would be just as likely to say" do you mind we are having fun between ourselves here, if you don't like it then lump it" (or words to that effect)

Are these euphemistic terms still implying homosexuality as the recipiant would understand it?

Never have i been called gay so much in 1 day!

And i once Ballet danced on telly......

That's a choice thing, and I guess I'll just have to repsect that.

On blonde I'd like to think we'll all loosely connected and in some way friends.

It's not the guy behind the bar that's asked, it's one of our friends.

Call me a lilly livered liberal if you will.  ;scarymoment;

I'd like to think not.

Puff alludes to poof which is a slang word for a homosexual.

Camp alludes to, well being camp, which is not the same thing at all IMO.

You poof ::) ::) ::)

Then thats something completely different from whats being debated.

 :respect:

James, you must have tremendous balance for a big fella !

For the choreography or the costumes?

And heres me thinking it was a magic dragon that lived by the sea!

I thought it was rude to look!!!!!

Talking of people being offended, you should see Kev go off on one when I tell him I love him......

What a pair of stones on nem, Superb, I nearly fell off my seat.

He has stones?  Where did his balls go then?

Didnt anyone like/noticed my colchester Kev belly danced post?

I did - decided it was virtual slander, but didn't want to encourage you!   lmfao

I've got 6 more pages to read but I've got to reply to this now... WHY DIDN'T YOU CALL US? As a jock mate of yours (I hope) you should get us involved in that case.

I really don't envy you trying to find a line on this one - after all, terms that maybe taken as an insult varry from person to person depending on thier own securities and believes...

If someone called me a Geordie Ba****d (which I got a great chant of from about 20 of my boro mates just before the Uefa cup final in a packed pub in Leeds) would I be offended? No way - because I am proud of my roots and where I am from, I don't take offence - I think the vast majority of percieved insults would be taken in the same way by the possible groups to who they are connected.

To complete the example some of my boro mates may be offended at being called a Geordie  - would it offend me that they are offended - no, for the same reasons as above

I have never belly danced on telly, points of view couldnt cope with the complaints letters !!

rotflmfao

even after the 9pm watershed!!!

Yup, you're a Top Mate Rod, even though you are a Scot, you know that.

But we soon got it sorted, & now it's cool. Even the Producer said they'd lost a viewer or two because of me - but no surprise there........

The geezer that had a pop at me, we had quite a lengthy exchange on the PNL Forum, & now we plan to have babies. But he's gotta be the Mum.

Thanks Tank - well said.

Still polishing up my roast for the HOF thread ;)

After reading all posts Im off to watch

Love Thy Neighbour

Ive been thinking about this one. Today I have been called gay several times on the chat box of my cash tables. Am I offended by this? no. Why not? Because it isnt offensive in my eyes. I dont think somone who is homosexual is any less of a person than me and I just dont find it offensive (humourous maybe given the dog that I am). Someone a few months ago called me a peado. was I offended? I found his address and was on my way to his house before I got stopped by someone else. why did I find this so offensive? Because kiddy fiddlers etc are people who is the scum of the earth and deserve shooting never mind locking up. It turned out 2 weeks later the person insulting me was put inside for the offence of solicitoring a minor (and similar offences). I dont mind if someone calls be a puff etc as I dont think theres anything wrong with homosexuals- just because I am not one doesn't mean I think any less of someone who is. the 2 witnesses at my last wedding were a stereotypically homosexual couple (one big and butch /one very skinny, even had handlebar moustaches etc you couldnt meet 2 guys who looked like they were out of VIZ). I am not a homophobe and I will still call flushy ginger.

What a great thread, and to think it was started by bad cop tighty, wonders never cease :D

I think the overwhelming majority (common sense) should prevail here.

WTF is this spellcheck thingy button??
Now that IS taking the piss!!

Why is it taking the piss, IFM?

Because it is saying that people should be spelling correctly, if you want a spellcheck use word and paste it.

I think generally, people do want to spell correctly.

Or you can just press this button and save yourself sometime.

If you don't want a spell check you can ignore the button, it's not like it is compulsory!

There you go IFM, some sense!

Which is why i won't use it, there was a general consensus on here about spelling and grammar a while back.
That was sense!

I use the Google spell checker all the time. Nemesis pointed me in the direction of it a few months back.  It is a lot of use

You give me a tenner for everytime someone tells someone to use the spellcheck button ok?

huh?

If I tell you to use the Spell-Checker ifm, can we split the £10 50/50? That's like, £4 to you, & £6 to me.

We really ain't fussed if Posts are spelt correctly or not, or if Members use the Spell-Checker. But if you recall - & I'm sure you do - there were many requests for us to install it. So we did. Eventuallly.

I may be wide of the mark here, but I think ifm is using the spell checker as a vehicle to make a different point

I actually don't recall Tikay.
I think it will give people an excuse to have a pop at others though.

That was an attempt at a slightly obscure joke :D

lol

I repeat for you Nem

No.

Well you have proved that some people don't need much excuse to have a pop

This deserves another outing, total fruit and nut :D

You seem very defensive of late Red.

It's a Pavlovian response.

Ding dong

Gonna have to look that up now!

You are right though ifm, I have been under a bit of pressure lately and may have been a bit snotty from time to time.

To anyone I may have offended, I appologise.

 rotflmfao rotflmfao rotflmfao

You gotta love these boys. Slinging manly insults at each other, but honest enough to say "oops, I need to look that up".

Ever wonder why we've all got 5,000+ posts.

It's 2am on a Tuesday morning in June and we're all talking pisch about nothing.

As an example of "banter" there are 4 left in a STT, Robert, Suzanne and Limpet (Clydescott).
Kev and i are "railing" as we were both knocked out.
This hand Robert went allin called by chippy (an outsider) Robert has A8 the other chap A4, this is from the chatbox :D

players.
Ellie-Anne: lol
Kev-Colch: roberts forever on the bubble .....
Kev-Colch: 4
Kev-Colch: 4
Kev-Colch: 4
Ellie-Anne: 4
Kev-Colch: 4
Ellie-Anne: 4
Ellie-Anne: 4
Kev-Colch: 4
Ellie-Anne: 4
Ellie-Anne: 44
Kev-Colch: 4
Ellie-Anne: 4
Ellie-Anne: 4
Kev-Colch: 4
Ellie-Anne: 4
Kev-Colch: 4
Ellie-Anne: 4
Ellie-Anne: 4
Ellie-Anne: 44
Ellie-Anne: 4
Ellie-Anne: 4
Ellie-Anne: 4
Ellie-Anne: 4
D: BriefBL wins 1,740 with Two Pair: Aces and 10s
Ellie-Anne: 44
Ellie-Anne: 4
Ellie-Anne: lol
BriefBL: thats what friends are for
D: Game [45] started with 4 players.
Kev-Colch: BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOoo
ClydeScott: lol
Ellie-Anne: LMAO
Ellie-Anne: pmsl

You should have seen the banter from Kev, tikay, and 'at it' Bradley in the Laddies 1k added.

I'm just glad there were no Artiodactyls there!

Well, no more pisch (whatever that is) from me tonight. I've had a long day, I ache like an aching thing, & I gotta meeting in London Tuesday afternoon, I'm due on the Noon train from Derby, so I need to get some zzz's.

Been another great day, actually.

xx

I was SO upset about that!

I was playing a Laddies Comp, may have been in the Money or nearly so if I recall correctly, & this geezer - "Shellfish" kept giving it "are you the tikay off the telly?" stuff. "The REAL tikay?" he asks, "the famous one? "& so on.

I'm loving it, "Hear that Kev, HEAR THAT Kev?" I'm merrily typing in the Chat-Box. It turns out that it's bloody At-It Bradley, & Couch Kev knew all along.

So I busted Shellfish, aka At-It, aka Gamblor, aka Vidal. That'll teach him. Don't mess with tikay, or he'll whop you. Proper whop, that is.

Nothing like having your friends on your side, eh robert  :D