Skill progression???

[mikee_j]

I've been playing poker now for about 2 years and i would rate my play maybe 3 or 4 out of 10. I play mainly $2, $5 & $10 STT and MTT. Occasionally i dable in micro limit cash games ($0.10 - $0.20 & $0.25 - $0.50) although i much prefer playing tournies to cash. Usually only play cash when i have bonuses to clear. I have recently graduated from uni and want to start playing poker a lot more seriously and i aim to be making a little money on the side from my poker play. and eventually become semi-pro. My dream would be to become pro but i have to remain realistic and sensible about it all at the moment. i live in guildford where there is not much of a poker scene and all my mates who play don't take it very seriously, they are more the casual players who play maybe once a month along with plenty of beer.

so, my question to the blondes is, what tips can you give me on how to progress from being an ok (win some, lose some) player to a profitbale skillful player?!? I do also very much realise that poker is a game that takes many years to play to a high level, but you gots to start somewhere.

should i pump some more money to my online account and play higher levels? should i be playing more live poker? should i be making friends with people who take the game as seriously as i do? Should i be finding more serious home games around my area?


any help and advice would be appreciated and past experiences from your progression would be enjoyable to read


Thanks...

[LukieD]

I'd suggest concentrating on online poker if you only rate yourself at 3-4/10. It serves as a great way to improve your game for normally less than it would cost to play in B&M places.

With regards to depositing money online that really depends on how profitable you have been in the past. If you are consistantly winning in the long run there is no real need to deposit. With proper bankroll management and being strict about your game you should be able to increase your bankroll. This also serves to give you more experience which will in turn help improve your game. There is however a downside to playing the micro stakes. You will often find that the other players are shockingly bad and make a lot of poor calls which leads to more bad beats. Although in the long run you will end up winning from these players, in the short term it can negatively affect your game.

In my first two years playing for money I never redeposited. I played the lowest stakes and improved my game until I had enough of a bankroll to play higher. If I had played higher straight away by depositing more I think I would have have blown my roll  and taken a lot longer to get to my current level.

[Royal Flush]

so, my question to the blondes is, what tips can you give me on how to progress from being an ok (win some, lose some) player to a profitbale skillful player?!? I do also very much realise that poker is a game that takes many years to play to a high level, but you gots to start somewhere.

should i pump some more money to my online account and play higher levels? should i be playing more live poker? should i be making friends with people who take the game as seriously as i do? Should i be finding more serious home games around my area?

Yes get to know some serious players, home games not really any good for learning the game TBH. The best way to learn is intensive play, i do not know your personal situation but if you want to get better then devote a month to playing for at least a few hours everyday. Think about the game all the time (yes this involves becoming a sad bastard) If you are not playing a game then be reading a book, imerse yourself in the game.

I once read a piece by Dan Negreanu saying the only way you can be a great player is to imerse yourself in the game and sacrafice having a normal life. It's up to you if thats the price you wish to pay.

Now obviously you dont need to go that far, but give it a go for a month and you will be suprised how much better a player you will be.

[bhoywonder]

good advice flushy




read good poker books..the recommended types..play some..read more..play more again....

eventually you will develop a sense of when u r running well or not during a game....you will develop how to read people...

take notes....always take notes


personally through hard effort  ( and yeah flushy...poker is always on my mind ..which is worrying ) you cant not improve,if u get a steady profit at your level then fine, gently notch the limits up a little..dont go steaming in though....

i think u will find stepping up from $10 to $25 a stt you will find your new found skills have a home...well i did...


and errrrr   try live for sure....but dont expect anything major and don't be too disappointed if it seems you are being outplayed constantly because you will...lol

but it is great experience and who knows you may have a natural talent for live  ( personnally again I'm just venturing into the live scene and i find it hard to take my online game onto the live stage )


and ehh dont tilt..ever...this takes time to recognise....when you fell it or sense an attack of tilt go walk the dog or turn of the pc

[NoflopsHomer]

so, my question to the blondes is, what tips can you give me on how to progress from being an ok (win some, lose some) player to a profitbale skillful player?!? I do also very much realise that poker is a game that takes many years to play to a high level, but you gots to start somewhere.

should i pump some more money to my online account and play higher levels? should i be playing more live poker? should i be making friends with people who take the game as seriously as i do? Should i be finding more serious home games around my area?

Yes get to know some serious players, home games not really any good for learning the game TBH. The best way to learn is intensive play, i do not know your personal situation but if you want to get better then devote a month to playing for at least a few hours everyday. Think about the game all the time (yes this involves becoming a sad bastard) If you are not playing a game then be reading a book, imerse yourself in the game.

I once read a piece by Dan Negreanu saying the only way you can be a great player is to imerse yourself in the game and sacrafice having a normal life. It's up to you if thats the price you wish to pay.

Now obviously you dont need to go that far, but give it a go for a month and you will be suprised how much better a player you will be.

Is that an admission that you're a 'sad bastard' flushy?
 
though

[Royal Flush]

so, my question to the blondes is, what tips can you give me on how to progress from being an ok (win some, lose some) player to a profitbale skillful player?!? I do also very much realise that poker is a game that takes many years to play to a high level, but you gots to start somewhere.

should i pump some more money to my online account and play higher levels? should i be playing more live poker? should i be making friends with people who take the game as seriously as i do? Should i be finding more serious home games around my area?

Yes get to know some serious players, home games not really any good for learning the game TBH. The best way to learn is intensive play, i do not know your personal situation but if you want to get better then devote a month to playing for at least a few hours everyday. Think about the game all the time (yes this involves becoming a sad bastard) If you are not playing a game then be reading a book, imerse yourself in the game.

I once read a piece by Dan Negreanu saying the only way you can be a great player is to imerse yourself in the game and sacrafice having a normal life. It's up to you if thats the price you wish to pay.

Now obviously you dont need to go that far, but give it a go for a month and you will be suprised how much better a player you will be.

Is that an admission that you're a 'sad bastard' flushy?
 
though

Basically, yes, lol.

When i started playing i found myself in a situation where i was on my own for large amounts of the time so i read poker stratergy and played all the time, i am lucky that my only ever losing month was my first. I don't think thats possible anymore given then vast improvement of your bad/average online player in the last 3/4 years.

[Longy]

Some good advice above.

Firstly i would say put some money aside specifically for poker and get yourself a proper bankroll whatever you feel comfortable with losing basically. Then have a look at where that bankroll can take you, this should be at least 20 buy ins for NL cash, for other games you will have to ask others.

Read books, play alot and analyse your play honestly with software or maybe other people who are good players. If in doubt post a hand in the poker analysis forum there are some good winning players on here who will help you out.

I wish you the best of luck but as flushy has alluded to i think the online game is becoming harder as time goes on, the average player is alot more educated about the game than he/she used to be.

[bhoywonder]

p.s


u havent re-deposited???

u r way above 5/10 for that alone

at least 50% have i assume

[byronkincaid]

I read on another forum that 1-2NL today is about as hard as 5-10 was 3 years ago.

Anyone agree?

[Jon MW]

I can't remember where I read it but something which sounded particularly sensible was that if you are playing cash games then don't move up a level until you have had at least 3 consecutive winning sessions. Not sure how that would have to be adjusted if you were planning to concentrate on tournaments though.

[jezza777]

I can't remember where I read it but something which sounded particularly sensible was that if you are playing cash games then don't move up a level until you have had at least 3 consecutive winning sessions. Not sure how that would have to be adjusted if you were planning to concentrate on tournaments though.

3 winning sessions is nowhere near enough of a sample you need to be looking at a very minimum of 10,000 hands.

[Royal Flush]

I can't remember where I read it but something which sounded particularly sensible was that if you are playing cash games then don't move up a level until you have had at least 3 consecutive winning sessions. Not sure how that would have to be adjusted if you were planning to concentrate on tournaments though.

3 winning sessions is nowhere near enough of a sample you need to be looking at a very minimum of 10,000 hands.

Does that mean if i have lost 1k playing 1-2 this week over 1100 hands i might not actually be a fish? There was me about to give up....lol

[Jon MW]

Might depend on the level you're looking to move up from/to. 10,000 hands to move from $0.10 - $0.20 to $0.25 - $0.50 seems excessive, but this is just based on intuition I wouldn't claim to have any  pedigree at all when it comes to poker expertise.

[mikee_j]

thanks for some great replies.

to make some further points on what i have been playing, i have never gone bust or had to re-load from my personal funds. i deposited £75 initially and i am still playing with the same roll, just. as a student i have taken out most of the money on most of the sites i play on to pay for beer! so, i can honestly say, that at the small level i play at, i am showing profit, albeit small. i have never really thought about bankroll management before and this is something i will be concentrating more on now! and being real disciplined about it. i do believe also that i can beat the game at the levels i play at, but with the constant shocking play from my opponants (i know in the long run i will make money off them) i do get fed up with low limits. i don't think my game is getting any better because i can beat poor players at low limits. i think anyone who knows the basics and plays strict ABC poker will win and show profit at low limit poker.


so, some things i'm going to do to improve my game in the next few weeks. firstly, build my bankroll to a level where i can move up a step to $10 and $20 STTs. now that i have graduated and have a job, i have no need to withdraw any money to pay for beer!. Use a disciplined bankroll management strategy. i listen to an interview with Jesus ferguson who said he never buys into a game higher than 5% of his bankroll. think this is a good place to start. I'm going to forget about cash games until i have build a big enough bankroll to not worry about losing $20 in a .10c - .20c game, then i can start properly learning and playing cash games. finally, as flushy says, i'm trying to play as much as possible! playing poker is the only way to get better.

anyways, enough from me, anymore comments would be appreciated.