Being overstacked in a cash game...

[The Dark Horse]

Something happened to me in an online cash game yesterday, that made me consider something I haven't before:

Having been playing well and building a bankroll, I moved up to a $800 max buy-in NLHE cash game on Mansion (4/8 blinds).

I bought in for $400, and had the right cards at the right time to make it up to $1800 in a few hours.  As players were coming and going, 7 of the other 8 stacks were between $400 and $800 because of the max buy-in of $800.  There was one guy with about $4500, who I think had been playing the same table since Easter.

Here's what happened - I got into one of those hands where you are destined to lose a lot of money, with the chip monster, and sure enough I donked off the whole $1800 in one hand.  I got around to thinking:

If you are in my situation (before the carnage hand!) does it make any sense to have $1800 on the table, when only one of the other stacks has more than $800, and the exception is the guy who has you covered?  Obviously, if you are short stacked at a cash table, you are reducing your potential winnings in one hand because you can't take the maximum bite from another stack.  However, when only one player has the chips to double you up in the event that you flop the quads/whatever then would it make more sense to take some chips off the table (ie. stand up, wait, rejoin the game)?

I think if this arises again I will do that - my reasoning is that I chose the $800 max buy-in because that's about the maximum loss I can stand to take from one horrific hand without having getting stomachache... so the $1800 felt bad, even though it was chips I hadn't brought to the table myself.

Does anyone have any thoughts on this, or any advice?

DH

[Ironside]

personally i would have sat there with the 1800 but avoided playing against the daddy without a premium hand

and certainly not over playing draws etc on the flop although calling with draws if the odds were there and the implied odds were huge

[Royal Flush]

It depends on the skill level between you and him and also who has position on who.

[KingPoker]

is this notion known as going south?!

[The Dark Horse]

He was two seats behind me, and the fateful hand was:

DH:  

CL:  

Chips went in on a     board, after he check-called his flopped house.  He hadn't re-raised me pre-flop, so couldn't put him on queens... cest la vie.  Maybe a better player wouldn't have gone broke here, but never mind!

It wasn't the hand that troubled me, more the wisdom (or otherwise) of being so overstacked in a cash game...

DH

[bolt pp]

is this notion known as going south?!

no, thats in a live cash game where someone pockets some of their chips, i saw someone get smashed to pieces by 3 guys after doing that in a private game about 6 years ago.

[KingPoker]

is this notion known as going south?!

no, thats in a live cash game where someone pockets some of their chips, i saw someone get smashed to pieces by 3 guys after doing that in a private game about 6 years ago.

but the same idea applies, you take chips off the table to minimise a loss.

[bolt pp]

is this notion known as going south?!

no, thats in a live cash game where someone pockets some of their chips, i saw someone get smashed to pieces by 3 guys after doing that in a private game about 6 years ago.

but the same idea applies, you take chips off the table to minimise a loss.

you cant do this online, most sites you cant cash out of a table and then sit back down with less for a certain period of time

[The Dark Horse]

This is true, but that's what I meant - cash out, go get something to eat, come back later.  Or join another 4/8 table right away, depending - the same players are sitting at most of them anyway!

I'm not sure why it's not allowed, I can't see how it's wrong or disadvantages anyone.  As long as the number of chips you have available for a hand is clear to the other players when the hole cards are dealt, and does not change during the course of a hand, I can't see the big deal?

[bolt pp]

This is true, but that's what I meant - cash out, go get something to eat, come back later.  Or join another 4/8 table right away, depending - the same players are sitting at most of them anyway!

I'm not sure why it's not allowed, I can't see how it's wrong or disadvantages anyone.  As long as the number of chips you have available for a hand is clear to the other players when the hole cards are dealt, and does not change during the course of a hand, I can't see the big deal?

yeah its a big deal if you bought in for $400, played it up to $1800 and then all of a sudden cashed in $1000!!! your freerolling and it's not fair on the others.

plus like flushy said if you dont feel theres a class disparity between you and the bigstack you want to get full value when you double through him dont you?

i never understand why players feel like this in a cash game, once i double/tripple up in a cash game you couldn't drag me off!

[jakally]

It's the best feeling in poker IMO, being chipped up at a cash game - it's what you aim to do at the start of a game.

I would only leave if I was too tired, or felt that I had a negative expectation at that point.

[Longy]

It depends on the skill level between you and him and also who has position on who.

I think this is the most important point, because of the inflated stack sizes. It can -ev to be playing if you are at a disadvantage to the big stack as you are in playing extremely deep against an opponent who can bust you.

It may be worth if you oop to the big stack to stand up and then sit down with position on him.

[RichEO]

is this notion known as going south?!

no, thats in a live cash game where someone pockets some of their chips, i saw someone get smashed to pieces by 3 guys after doing that in a private game about 6 years ago.

Ratholing?

[bolt pp]

is this notion known as going south?!

no, thats in a live cash game where someone pockets some of their chips, i saw someone get smashed to pieces by 3 guys after doing that in a private game about 6 years ago.

Ratholing?

theres a difference between ratholing and going south, you can never go south online.

If you done either in a live club dont bother going back and i genuinly dont see the benefit to any half decent player of ratholing on line, which is difficult to do anyway because of the time restrictions sites out on you buying back in.

[KingPoker]

is this notion known as going south?!

no, thats in a live cash game where someone pockets some of their chips, i saw someone get smashed to pieces by 3 guys after doing that in a private game about 6 years ago.

Ratholing?

I had to look ratholing up and found
Ratholing is a poker term which refers to illegally taking money off the table[3]. For example, If you are at a casino table and you win $100 dollars in a hand, and you wish to take out that $100 from the table, but keep the rest of your money at the table, that would be called ratholing, and it is not allowed

But i prefer this definition which describes a lot of posts of mine
Ratholing is a term used to describe a conversation or process that has deviated from its original productive purpose into a generally unproductive but long and winding detour that eventually comes to a dead end. The original discussion purpose may be to agree on a course of action. However, if one or more people rathole into a specific point of the discussion then the discussion stalls with no actionable outcome.

And finally i hope you didnt mean this definition!
Ratholing is prison slang for smuggling or hiding items in the rectum!!!!