Was there a better play, or is this non-gettoffable?

[tikay]

Can I just say I'm not a fan of Skalie's call of your preflop raise, most of the time he'll face an unfavourable board OOP, some of the times he does hit a set you'll have missed with AK/AQ anyway, or will be looking at an Ace or King high board with QQ or JJ. If he hits his set he has to get your whole stack for it to be profitable, I just don't think that between 9/1 and 10/1 is enough for this.

This reply is also to Rookie, who makes essentially the same point.

Well, if you just confine your thinking to pot odds, yes, it's a horrendous call against me - of all people - with 4-4. But I believe he was thinking other things, naughty things. I mean, if he puts me on AK & it comes raggy taggy, he can get me off, in fact he probably thinks he can get me off anything with a stop & go. Which, as it fell, he did not need to, as he hit.

But if we confine our thoughts to him actually hitting his 4, yes, a bad call, but like I say, I believe he had mischief in his mind. Which is partly why I fell for his Push.

[tikay]

ok thanks - oh and one more quick question, when you turned your cards over did they both have a pointy like letter in the top corner or did they both have non-matching curly numbers?

 

Lol, RUMBLED!

To tell the truth, I actually thought I had 4-4, & was a bit puzzled when he flipped his cards over & showed another two Fours..... 

[matt674]

ok thanks - oh and one more quick question, when you turned your cards over did they both have a pointy like letter in the top corner or did they both have non-matching curly numbers?

 

Lol, RUMBLED!

To tell the truth, I actually thought I had 4-4, & was a bit puzzled when he flipped his cards over & showed another two Fours..... 

[MANTIS01]

Posted by: matt674

one important piece of info which is very relevant to the situation is how many chips Skalie has.

Tikay says he had been "busy" so if he had got himself upto about 50-60k where the average was 18k then calling the 2k in an attempt to hit a set and bust someone you believe to be weak passive isnt that bad a move.

Not sure I am liking this sentiment Matt. As a chip daddy I want to be looking for favourable situations with which to edge forwards whilst always maintaining my current stack without too much jeapordy.

I think calling a raise of 5x bb oop in the hope of hitting a 9-1 shot is a mathematically hopeless play....and even then you are going to have a job busting someone who is weak and passive. You must hope you hit a set and your opponents has aces or such like. These kind of hopes can decimate a big stack quite quickly I think.

Calling to bluff...well maybe...but there has to be looser targets out there

Hand Selection: Poor...Opponent Selection: Poor...Position: Poor...Luck: Excellent.

[matt674]

Posted by: matt674

one important piece of info which is very relevant to the situation is how many chips Skalie has.

Tikay says he had been "busy" so if he had got himself upto about 50-60k where the average was 18k then calling the 2k in an attempt to hit a set and bust someone you believe to be weak passive isnt that bad a move.

Not sure I am liking this sentiment Matt. As a chip daddy I want to be looking for favourable situations with which to edge forwards whilst always maintaining my current stack without too much jeapordy.

I think calling a raise of 5x bb oop in the hope of hitting a 9-1 shot is a mathematically hopeless play....and even then you are going to have a job busting someone who is weak and passive. You must hope you hit a set and your opponents has aces or such like. These kind of hopes can decimate a big stack quite quickly I think.

Calling to bluff...well maybe...but there has to be looser targets out there

Hand Selection: Poor...Opponent Selection: Poor...Position: Poor...Luck: Excellent.

maybe but sometimes i think tikay isnt as weak passive or uber-tight as he tries to make out

[tikay]

you are going to have a job busting someone who is weak and passive

Hold up, are you saying I'm weak & passive? WHAT?

PS - Ahh, yes, I already admitted that.

[tikay]

Posted by: matt674

one important piece of info which is very relevant to the situation is how many chips Skalie has.

Tikay says he had been "busy" so if he had got himself upto about 50-60k where the average was 18k then calling the 2k in an attempt to hit a set and bust someone you believe to be weak passive isnt that bad a move.

Not sure I am liking this sentiment Matt. As a chip daddy I want to be looking for favourable situations with which to edge forwards whilst always maintaining my current stack without too much jeapordy.

I think calling a raise of 5x bb oop in the hope of hitting a 9-1 shot is a mathematically hopeless play....and even then you are going to have a job busting someone who is weak and passive. You must hope you hit a set and your opponents has aces or such like. These kind of hopes can decimate a big stack quite quickly I think.

Calling to bluff...well maybe...but there has to be looser targets out there

Hand Selection: Poor...Opponent Selection: Poor...Position: Poor...Luck: Excellent.

maybe but sometimes i think tikay isnt as weak passive or uber-tight as he tries to make out

Hush now Monkey Boy, that's libellous. I could sue.

Anyway, I've e-Mailed the link to this thread to skalie, be interesting to hear his thinking. I'll be quite surprised if he called just to hit his Set. He was planning mischief, I'm sure.

[matt674]

i'll have my cheetah lawyer on standby just in case

[byronkincaid]

hitting a 9-1 shot

wrong, it's 7.5-1

[NoflopsHomer]

Can I just say I'm not a fan of Skalie's call of your preflop raise, most of the time he'll face an unfavourable board OOP, some of the times he does hit a set you'll have missed with AK/AQ anyway, or will be looking at an Ace or King high board with QQ or JJ. If he hits his set he has to get your whole stack for it to be profitable, I just don't think that between 9/1 and 10/1 is enough for this.

This reply is also to Rookie, who makes essentially the same point.

Well, if you just confine your thinking to pot odds, yes, it's a horrendous call against me - of all people - with 4-4. But I believe he was thinking other things, naughty things. I mean, if he puts me on AK & it comes raggy taggy, he can get me off, in fact he probably thinks he can get me off anything with a stop & go. Which, as it fell, he did not need to, as he hit.

But if we confine our thoughts to him actually hitting his 4, yes, a bad call, but like I say, I believe he had mischief in his mind. Which is partly why I fell for his Push.

His hand is telegraphed already as mostly likely a medium pair though. Even if he check/calls you on a rag flop, you put another good bet on the turn he'll have to fold.

[tikay]

Can I just say I'm not a fan of Skalie's call of your preflop raise, most of the time he'll face an unfavourable board OOP, some of the times he does hit a set you'll have missed with AK/AQ anyway, or will be looking at an Ace or King high board with QQ or JJ. If he hits his set he has to get your whole stack for it to be profitable, I just don't think that between 9/1 and 10/1 is enough for this.

This reply is also to Rookie, who makes essentially the same point.

Well, if you just confine your thinking to pot odds, yes, it's a horrendous call against me - of all people - with 4-4. But I believe he was thinking other things, naughty things. I mean, if he puts me on AK & it comes raggy taggy, he can get me off, in fact he probably thinks he can get me off anything with a stop & go. Which, as it fell, he did not need to, as he hit.

But if we confine our thoughts to him actually hitting his 4, yes, a bad call, but like I say, I believe he had mischief in his mind. Which is partly why I fell for his Push.

His hand is telegraphed already as mostly likely a medium pair though. Even if he check/calls you on a rag flop, you put another good bet on the turn he'll have to fold.

Well yes, but I see it MUCH wider than that.

He may just have had a Stop & Go in mind? He knows my game pretty well, we play Online together a fair bit, & he pretty much has my number as a grinder & bullet-dodger.

[NoflopsHomer]

Can I just say I'm not a fan of Skalie's call of your preflop raise, most of the time he'll face an unfavourable board OOP, some of the times he does hit a set you'll have missed with AK/AQ anyway, or will be looking at an Ace or King high board with QQ or JJ. If he hits his set he has to get your whole stack for it to be profitable, I just don't think that between 9/1 and 10/1 is enough for this.

This reply is also to Rookie, who makes essentially the same point.

Well, if you just confine your thinking to pot odds, yes, it's a horrendous call against me - of all people - with 4-4. But I believe he was thinking other things, naughty things. I mean, if he puts me on AK & it comes raggy taggy, he can get me off, in fact he probably thinks he can get me off anything with a stop & go. Which, as it fell, he did not need to, as he hit.

But if we confine our thoughts to him actually hitting his 4, yes, a bad call, but like I say, I believe he had mischief in his mind. Which is partly why I fell for his Push.

His hand is telegraphed already as mostly likely a medium pair though. Even if he check/calls you on a rag flop, you put another good bet on the turn he'll have to fold.

Well yes, but I see it MUCH wider than that.

He may just have had a Stop & Go in mind? He knows my game pretty well, we play Online together a fair bit, & he pretty much has my number as a grinder & bullet-dodger.

Your preflop raise however represents huge strength, a tight player raising an utg limper should send the vast majority of hands scurrying for the hills. I don't see why he would lead out here with any hand, knowing that you were going to bet, and if he did lead out, I'd raise to find out how strongly he thinks his Sevens or Eights are.

[tikay]

Can I just say I'm not a fan of Skalie's call of your preflop raise, most of the time he'll face an unfavourable board OOP, some of the times he does hit a set you'll have missed with AK/AQ anyway, or will be looking at an Ace or King high board with QQ or JJ. If he hits his set he has to get your whole stack for it to be profitable, I just don't think that between 9/1 and 10/1 is enough for this.

This reply is also to Rookie, who makes essentially the same point.

Well, if you just confine your thinking to pot odds, yes, it's a horrendous call against me - of all people - with 4-4. But I believe he was thinking other things, naughty things. I mean, if he puts me on AK & it comes raggy taggy, he can get me off, in fact he probably thinks he can get me off anything with a stop & go. Which, as it fell, he did not need to, as he hit.

But if we confine our thoughts to him actually hitting his 4, yes, a bad call, but like I say, I believe he had mischief in his mind. Which is partly why I fell for his Push.

His hand is telegraphed already as mostly likely a medium pair though. Even if he check/calls you on a rag flop, you put another good bet on the turn he'll have to fold.

Well yes, but I see it MUCH wider than that.

He may just have had a Stop & Go in mind? He knows my game pretty well, we play Online together a fair bit, & he pretty much has my number as a grinder & bullet-dodger.

Your preflop raise however represents huge strength, a tight player raising an utg limper should send the vast majority of hands scurrying for the hills. I don't see why he would lead out here with any hand, knowing that you were going to bet, and if he did lead out, I'd raise to find out how strongly he thinks his Sevens or Eights are.

He may well lead out here, knowing I am likely to fold to strength with most hands. And , of course, he never put me on a hand as strong as A-A, & he reverted to Plan B when he hit his set.

[matt674]

He may just have had a Stop & Go in mind? He knows my game pretty well, we play Online together a fair bit, & he pretty much has my number as a grinder & bullet-dodger.

how can he have a stop and go in mind when you are first to speak in every round of action?

[tikay]

He may just have had a Stop & Go in mind? He knows my game pretty well, we play Online together a fair bit, & he pretty much has my number as a grinder & bullet-dodger.

how can he have a stop and go in mind when you are first to speak in every round of action?

He was UTG, I was mid-pos.