Observation and tells @ the table

[ACE2M]

Online, everything is mostly done by instinct without much fear or concern.  But live, I have a HUGE problem with my breathing patterns when I'm in a hand.  Been working on controlling it a bit better, but the problem still exists.  Might have to find some mind tricks for meself as well. 

Laxie, don't worry about your breathing problems. as long as you do the same thing whether you have the goods or you are bluffing it makes not a jot of difference.

I often shake when I'm in a big pot, but I do it regardless of my hole cards. I used to be embarrassed about it because I thought it made me look like a novice, but now I don't give a monkeys. You worry about your game, let them worry about your breathing.

agreed, i've seen top professionals shaking in big pots in big tournaments.

[Laxie]

Awwww, cheers lads.  Will keep your words ringing in me ear from now on when I'm in that situation.  It's the one thing had me truly worried for the upcoming Waterford Festival.  I do it as much in a €20 buy in as a €100 buy in, but never played one as big as this before, so reckon I'll need to wear a top with a VERY high neck line!     

[AdamM]

have a look at this clip.
The guys name is Bob Spour. He's former SAS
the first 4 mins he talks about his SAS selection, but after that he touches briefly on controlling fear in different situations, in particular he mentions stage fright when he did a performing arts degree.

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=GR6amkc_cZ8

Fear is sometimes caused by, and always worsened by lack of confidence.
The greater confidence you have in your ability, the less fear you have, and the less information you give off.
Of course, there's always an element of uncertainty in poker, which is why even the best get nervous sometimes.

[kinboshi]

Awwww, cheers lads.  Will keep your words ringing in me ear from now on when I'm in that situation.  It's the one thing had me truly worried for the upcoming Waterford Festival.  I do it as much in a €20 buy in as a €100 buy in, but never played one as big as this before, so reckon I'll need to wear a top with a VERY high neck line!     

No - get the artillery out (so to speak).  Use all the weapons at your disposal!

[technolog]

( . )( . ) 

[ifm]

See there is the inconsistency, your heart pumps faster, your breathing becomes heavier and your hands may shake when you have a monster hand or nothing at all!!
So how can you read these "tells"??

BTW someone once told me nerves are the fear of losing.

[AdamM]

that's kind of what Bob's saying in the clip

also, the inconsistency is the point.
Mannerism A doesn't mean Hand B

you're looking for inconsistencies in someones behaviour that, coupled with information from their betting, leads you to a conclusion

people looking for players to play with their earlobe when they're bluffing are going to be waiting a long time

[MKKfish]

As a previous poster mentioned new players can second guess themselves when looking for tells because in fact they don't really know what they're looking for... ooh he's shaking, he must be nervous ergo he must be bluffing - as it turns out he has the stone cold nuts and is just on a 'rush'.

Although there can be some very obvious tells, even amongst the top players, ( I challenge anyone to find me a clip where Hellmuth loses a hand after the turn where he has his elbows on the table and his bunched hands on his cheeks), the average newbie is going to struggle to take in all the info for all the players at the table.

For me, I break down what I'm looking for when I sit down to two initial observations.

The first, which I think is greatly under valued, is chip treatment. It is unbelievably reliable to watch the guy who has picked up AA/KK... if he is riffling he will stop when the play gets to 2/3 players before him and go no where near them again until it's his turn to act.

Anyone who flopped a monster will try and look disinterested and go no where near their stack... whereas normally they'd be chip tricking allover the shop.

Secondly, make sure you watch how they place their chips over the line and match it to the result of the hand. The nonchalant splash can either mean I've got the nuts or I've got f*ck all...doesn't seem helpful?... well watch the splash and watch the result and you'll have a fair idea next time.

BTW... when playing inexperienced players I'm always very wary of the careful count out and deliberate placement of neat chips into the pot.


*dons flameproofs*

[M3boy]

Tells are a BIG part of live poker.

They come in many forms - movement, eyes, chip handling, betting, speaking.

They are player dependent of course , and one tell on one person is completely different for another.

Richard and I exchanged tells we had on each other - none of us knew our own tell. Mine was the speed of betting , Richards was breathing.

If you watch good professionals, they give off nothing. But watch your usual casino regulars and you can pick up many things.

I for one use my tell (betting speed) against people that know about it - the reverse tell that Richard speaks off.

I have many tells on the people that regularly play at Luton - and I know Richard does aswell.

It is Human nature to form patterns of behaviour - these are what to look for and also be aware of yourself.

I agree with IFM (yes it pains me to say it) that nervous breathing/shaking can mean a monster or a bluff - the key is to know who does what with what.

[KingPoker]

I know of 2 tells i have on myself and I love it when i see people recognise what they are.

It doesnt affect my game at all because as long as i know that they are aware of them, i can use them to manipulate their plays in the hand.

Along the lines of what M3 is saying, i think it is very important to be able to reverse tell as much as it is to spot tells in others.

Im no expert and dont claim to be but thanks to someone, i now have 6 or 7 tells i look for in each player and more than often is the case, they demonstarte at least one of them.

And believe it or not im sure even the best players have tells, its just mostly they are too arrogant to admit this.

[Ironside]

I know of 2 tells i have on myself and I love it when i see people recognise what they are.

It doesnt affect my game at all because as long as i know that they are aware of them, i can use them to manipulate their plays in the hand.

Along the lines of what M3 is saying, i think it is very important to be able to reverse tell as much as it is to spot tells in others.

Im no expert and dont claim to be but thanks to someone, i now have 6 or 7 tells i look for in each player and more than often is the case, they demonstarte at least one of them.

And believe it or not im sure even the best players have tells, its just mostly they are too arrogant to admit this.

you tell is simple you put a chip into the pot and we all know your about to get lucky

[KingPoker]

And im more than happy for ppl to keep thinking that 

[ifm]

I had a brief chat with a guy at walsall a year or 2 back that went something like this:

him "you have a tell"

me (inwardly sighing) "do i?"

him "yes, it's very obvious"

me "ok"

him "you do!!"

me "right"

him "i'd tell you but you're on my table"

me "don't tell anyone else then"

A couple of hours later........well it was ironic.
true story.

[AlexMartin]

Luton is a tell-house. I have plenty, but i randomise my action so much i hide a few. Apart from the re-steal hush, i must work on that.

[Ironside]

if i had a tell i would want to know what it was so i knew what i was supposed to do

cause boy i never know what i am doing so how is anyone else supposed to know