Last night at the G

[Snatiramas]

Now I am not one normally to post hands for analysis, basically because I know I am rubbish and generally have played the hand wrong and got lucky. Now this does not necessarily bother me but last night there was what I feel was an interesting situation where I wavered from one decision to another.............

The blinds are 200/400 and a running ante of 50........
I am in the big blind and the cut off raises to 1100

I look down and find
 

The flop comes down
 

Cut off bets 2000 out of turn...........takes bet back. I decide to bet 2000 he goes all in for 14000 more......my tournament life. Now obviously in retrospect I should have checked and let the bet of 2000 stand but I didn't and now I have a decision...........call or fold

And yes Vinni I did snap your Queens off with the  but as Bambos would say "it wasn't personal"

[jakally]

I would make the call.

You are probably flipping or better against his range (Against for instance you are a marginal favourite) and the pot is laying you good odds.

Your stack size is unknown but if you had the same stack as the other guy in the hand you are calling 14000 into an 20900 pot.

As you say it's for your tournament life, that is worst case, and the smaller your stack is, the better the odds you are getting.

My tourney skills are not that great, so, for me, it is right to take as many +Chip EV situations as possible.
For a player who rates themselves significantly better than the average for the tourney, there is a good case to fold and play on.

[boldie]

as soon as you lead out you should have known what to do if he pushed..I call after leading out here.

[Longy]

I call you are flipping most of the time here and there is enough dead money in the pot now to get a nice overlay.

[M3boy]

If he has bet 2000 out of turn, then his bet must stand. - He cannot take it back.

I fail to see how he can raise now if you make the same 2000 bet.

He does not have the option to raise, only call or fold - This was my understanding anyway.

[Snatiramas]

If he has bet 2000 out of turn, then his bet must stand. - He cannot take it back.

I fail to see how he can raise now if you make the same 2000 bet.

He does not have the option to raise, only call or fold - This was my understanding anyway.

Interestingly I did not think of that..............
needless to say I did make the call and went on to do a deal heads up. Part of the difficulty came from a long string of rather boring bad beats which had definitely affected my confidence to make a call.

[celtic]

If he has bet 2000 out of turn, then his bet must stand. - He cannot take it back.

I fail to see how he can raise now if you make the same 2000 bet.

He does not have the option to raise, only call or fold - This was my understanding anyway.

Interestingly I did not think of that..............
needless to say I did make the call and went on to do a deal heads up. Part of the difficulty came from a long string of rather boring bad beats which had definitely affected my confidence to make a call.

Did he make the bet Phish?  er Phil? I thought he went to make the bet and the dealer stopped him? Either way worked well for you, was a good call. And well done on a nice result mate.

[gatso]

If he has bet 2000 out of turn, then his bet must stand. - He cannot take it back.

I fail to see how he can raise now if you make the same 2000 bet.

He does not have the option to raise, only call or fold - This was my understanding anyway.

my understanding is that he has all 3 options here. he bet out of turn so if Snat checks the bet must stand.
however as Snat has now bet his oppo can't bet, only the first player to put chips in on any street can bet and you can't hold someone to an action if that action is no longer possible, therefore he can now call, raise or fold.

I call

[Benny Brox]

If he has bet 2000 out of turn, then his bet must stand. - He cannot take it back.

I fail to see how he can raise now if you make the same 2000 bet.

He does not have the option to raise, only call or fold - This was my understanding anyway.

my understanding is that he has all 3 options here. he bet out of turn so if Snat checks the bet must stand.
however as Snat has now bet his oppo can't bet, only the first player to put chips in on any street can bet and you can't hold someone to an action if that action is no longer possible, therefore he can now call, raise or fold.

I call

Yeah that's my understanding too, if you checked he would have to put in the 2k but as the action has changed (with your bet) he can fold now if he wanted. As played, I call also, when you call a raise OOP with Q9s, that's one of the best flops you could have hoped for. I think you'll be up against an overpair most of the time here.

Once I knew he was going to bet 2k I would have check-pushed.

[LutonGboi]

This hand made me laugh. You made out you were super weak (when really you were semi-weak if that....) and against him it worked. The guy you were up against is well known, his range in the cut-off is huge, he actually had AsTc I recall (not sure if you know him personally) but the way he played his hand was ruled by what you said to him during all the ill-timed betting. He thought you had absolutely nothing at all which is something you did really well at the time. Overall, if it folds round to the cut-off who makes it 3x bb to go and I call in the bb with Qd9d and the flop comes 9hTd5d im check-raising this flop against him anyway and at the time it would have been a check-raise all-in. And lets face it, if you limp with 9h5h in a multi-way pot, the flop comes down 7h7d4h everyone checks to the turn which brings , sb bets, bb raises and you smooth call on this board with the sb then re-raising all-in, the bb folding, and you calling with one card to come on a flush which the bb appeared to have also (possibly drawing dead) your not going to fold your Q high flush are you? :-)

I'm the guy who 'hollywooded' you a couple hands after with KK when you held AA btw but hey thats variance. Did you get a ticket on Monday for the main event?

[Snatiramas]

This hand made me laugh. You made out you were super weak (when really you were semi-weak if that....) and against him it worked. The guy you were up against is well known, his range in the cut-off is huge, he actually had AsTc I recall (not sure if you know him personally) but the way he played his hand was ruled by what you said to him during all the ill-timed betting. He thought you had absolutely nothing at all which is something you did really well at the time. Overall, if it folds round to the cut-off who makes it 3x bb to go and I call in the bb with Qd9d and the flop comes 9hTd5d im check-raising this flop against him anyway and at the time it would have been a check-raise all-in. And lets face it, if you limp with 9h5h in a multi-way pot, the flop comes down 7h7d4h everyone checks to the turn which brings , sb bets, bb raises and you smooth call on this board with the sb then re-raising all-in, the bb folding, and you calling with one card to come on a flush which the bb appeared to have also (possibly drawing dead) your not going to fold your Q high flush are you? :-)

I'm the guy who 'hollywooded' you a couple hands after with KK when you held AA btw but hey thats variance. Did you get a ticket on Monday for the main event?

Indeed sir I did.........a bit of positive variance.

By the way all if you come up against LutonGboi..........nice bloke good player

[Snatiramas]

Do you know how many runners they normally get tonight? And whether the NL cash game holds until close? Grats on the ticket i had a feeling three-way it was possible that night.

Hmmm tricky to know how many will turn up....some away in Brighton.......I would hope 30 to 40......on the cash game I have no idea as it isn't my poison

[LutonGboi]

Ahh ty.