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Author Topic: Vagueness and the Aftermath - A sporadic diary  (Read 4459807 times)
RED-DOG
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« Reply #10500 on: December 12, 2010, 11:06:16 PM »

One of my favourite poems. it never fails to move me.

I've posted it before, more than once. I make no apology for posting it again.


The Men Who Don't Fit In.


There's a race of men that don't fit in,
 A race that can't stay still;
So they break the hearts of kith and kin,
 And they roam the world at will.
They range the field and they rove the flood,
 And they climb the mountain's crest;
Theirs is the curse of the Gypsy blood,
 And they don't know how to rest.

If they just went straight they might go far;
 They are strong and brave and true;
But they're always tired of the things that are,
 And they want the strange and new.
They say: "Could I find my proper groove,
 What a deep mark I would make!"
So they chop and change, and each fresh move
 Is only a fresh mistake.

And each forgets, as he strips and runs
 With a brilliant, fitful pace,
It's the steady, quiet, plodding ones
 Who win in the lifelong race.
And each forgets that his youth has fled,
 Forgets that his prime is past,
Till he stands one day, with a hope that's dead,
 In the glare of the truth at last.

He has failed, he has failed; he has missed his chance;
 He has just done things by half.
Life's been a jolly good joke on him,
 And now is the time to laugh.
Ha, ha!  He is one of the Legion Lost;
 He was never meant to win;
He's a rolling stone, and it's bred in the bone;
 He's a man who won't fit in.
« Last Edit: December 13, 2010, 02:18:53 AM by RED-DOG » Logged

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« Reply #10501 on: December 12, 2010, 11:34:47 PM »

Upper case "G" for Gypsy please.


 
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« Reply #10502 on: December 13, 2010, 02:18:22 AM »

Upper case "G" for Gypsy please.


 

Well spotted. Thank you Ralph.

I didn't write it (Unfortunately) but I will edit it.
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« Reply #10503 on: December 13, 2010, 08:12:46 AM »


Every day, another surprise. How do these things come to pass? (Sent to me by a good friend next door).

http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,2035862,00.html?xid=newsletter-europe-weekly
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« Reply #10504 on: December 13, 2010, 09:20:44 AM »

One thing I don't really understand Tom (and forgive me if this is insensitive/offensive) is why in these politically correct times it still seems to be okay in certain quarters to discriminate against Gypsies and it goes without very much outcry at all.  Sarkozy's policy in France is at the very least on a par with the BNP's planned repatriation of blacks and realistically closer to some of Hitlers policies (albeit not quite as extreme) yet there are no planned sanctions against the French.  Basically nothing of any note except for the denounciation and possible legal action by Viviane Reding.  In the UK it seems that discrimination against Gypsies is the last 'acceptable' prejudice.  I was wondering why you think this is??  Is it something to do with the large disenfranchisement of the community makes them less visible and important to politicians or the geographic disparity making effective political lobbying less likely?? 
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« Reply #10505 on: December 13, 2010, 11:10:14 AM »

One thing I don't really understand Tom (and forgive me if this is insensitive/offensive) is why in these politically correct times it still seems to be okay in certain quarters to discriminate against Gypsies and it goes without very much outcry at all.  Sarkozy's policy in France is at the very least on a par with the BNP's planned repatriation of blacks and realistically closer to some of Hitlers policies (albeit not quite as extreme) yet there are no planned sanctions against the French.  Basically nothing of any note except for the denounciation and possible legal action by Viviane Reding. In the UK it seems that discrimination against Gypsies is the last 'acceptable' prejudice.  I was wondering why you think this is??  Is it something to do with the large disenfranchisement of the community makes them less visible and important to politicians or the geographic disparity making effective political lobbying less likely??  

The "Dirty thieving Gypsy" Stereotype has been perpetuated by those in power throughout history.

Anything negative, (Real or imagined) is amplified and magnified by politicians and the media to feed the fears of an already an already hostile and prejudiced population.

Tony Kendal is probably my best friend in the world, but not so long ago, his views on Gypsies were probably in line with the majority of the population

We have our share of wrong-uns, like anyone else, but we are just people, like anyone else.

Let me give you an example to show you how it works. (This is about planning, I could have chosen any number of subjects, but this will do for now).

In 1968, a law was passed which prevented us from camping on the commons and in the lanes that we had used for generations. Until that time, we travelled in small family groups, kept the place clean (Because we had to come back) and moved on every few weeks)

After 1968, everywhere we went we were illegally camped. Police dragged out caravans on to the road with JCB's and then they escorted us across the county line, where the next police force took over. I myself have been "escorted" with my family all day, not even allowed to stop to use the toilet or feed the baby.

1n 1994, guidelines were issued to local authorities advising them that they should provide sites for their Gypsy populations, but these were only guidelines, and they were universally ignored.

Meanwhile, The Gypsies were forced to band together in larger groups, trying to find safety in numbers and becoming more visible and more of a nuisance in the process, which suited most politicians and the media down to a t.

In 1998, the Human Rights Act was introduced. (Pay particular attention to article 8 and article 14)

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/946400.stm

Now (We assumed) we had something to fight with.

In 2006, in a directive to local authorities, the Government said that they MUST provide sites for their Gypsy population. Almost none did, but it was more difficult to move us on when that same authorities had not fulfilled their legal obligation.

Aurhorities argued that They couldn't afford to build sites (despite spending countless thousands on evicting Gypsies from "Private" land.

Some Gypsies responded by offering to buy their own land. Some of these proposed sites (let's be generous and say 50% of them) were in unsuitable places, never the less, planning permission was refused in over 98% of cases, and those that were granted were usually under a motorway bridge or next to a sewerage works.

If a Gypsy bought a piece of land and applied for planning permission to live there, the local people and the media would go crazy, and what's more, if he didn't move on to it while his application was being determined, he was judged to have demonstrated that he obviously had somewhere else to park his caravans. If, on the other hand, he did move on to it, he was judged to have flouted the laws that everyone else has to live by.

Nevertheless, slowly, ever so slowly, circular 1/06 started to have an effect. Gypsy people bought small plots of land, moved on, and made a retrospective planning application.

In a few of these cases (about 15%) the Gypsies and the local communities got to know each other as people, the hue band cry died down, and eventually planning planning permission was granted. Things were still bad, but better than before.

In some cases of course, the sites were unsuitable and these caused huge amounts of friction, but at least we were getting a chance to have our case heard, and for the locals to get to know us.

Then, this year, the new secretary of state decided that he was going to abolish Circular 1/06 and remove the requirement for local authorities to provide sites, and he directed his planning inspectors to lend weight to the impending changes when making planning decisions, even though the existing laws are, as yet, still in place.


An example of spin from The Telegraph


http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/politics/8196548/Ministers-to-create-new-planning-powers-to-tackle-illegal-traveller-sites.html
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« Reply #10506 on: December 13, 2010, 11:31:22 AM »

Tom, here's something that you might want to enjoy tonight, the Geminid meteor shower.  If it's a clear night, and you can get a good vantage point away from light pollution (and can wait until the moon has 'set') then you should be able to see 2 or three every minute.  Think 'experts' have said that soon after midnight will be the best time to view.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geminids

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« Reply #10507 on: December 13, 2010, 11:37:25 AM »

Tom, here's something that you might want to enjoy tonight, the Geminid meteor shower.  If it's a clear night, and you can get a good vantage point away from light pollution (and can wait until the moon has 'set') then you should be able to see 2 or three every minute.  Think 'experts' have said that soon after midnight will be the best time to view.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geminids



Would have been great during the frost when the skies were clear.

It's raining here now, but it might clear up.....
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« Reply #10508 on: December 13, 2010, 11:52:26 AM »

Is one of the reasons the Gypsy community is prejudiced against the noticable lack of a public voice?

Most, if not all, minority groups who face discrimination have public "faces" who the media go to when an issue regarding that group are in the spotlight.

Or do these groups/indviuals exist amongst the Gypsy community and just ignored by the media?
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« Reply #10509 on: December 13, 2010, 11:52:34 AM »


"...Tony Kendal is probably my best friend in the world, but not so long ago, his views on Gypsies were probably in line with the majority of the population...."

You are correct. And I think hundreds of other blondes have realised, via you, that our pre-conceptions about Gypsies were so wrong.

 
   
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« Reply #10510 on: December 13, 2010, 11:54:34 AM »

And I miss-spelled Kendall. Sorry.
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« Reply #10511 on: December 13, 2010, 12:07:25 PM »

I had a blast from the past yesterday when an old school, dyed in the wool traditional type Gypsy friend that I haven't seen in donkeys years called round unexpectedly.

We spent a few hours lamenting the passing of the old days and the old ways. It was so nostalgic.   

As he took his leave, I berated him for not coming to see me sooner. He climbed into his battered van and delivered this parting shot...    "I know I know, but have searched for you on Facebook!"

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« Reply #10512 on: December 13, 2010, 12:41:29 PM »

And I miss-spelled Kendall. Sorry.

You did too, but I'm in a gentle mood today.

You also mis-spelled mis-spelled. Wink
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« Reply #10513 on: December 13, 2010, 12:45:49 PM »

And I miss-spelled Kendall. Sorry.

You did too, but I'm in a gentle mood today.

You also mis-spelled mis-spelled. Wink

I was going to attempt a rebuttal, but I think I'll quit while I'm behind.
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« Reply #10514 on: December 13, 2010, 06:30:11 PM »

Lovely as I find many of the tales and lore, Red's is a singular and in many ways romanticised perspective.

It is hard for non Gypsies (I cant remember what word Gypsies have for us) to differentiate a Red-Dog type Gypsy - good or bad - versus many other types of travelling communities -  a number of these communities are not particularly nice or desirable and I'm reasonably happy to say that, whilst I might respect their rights and freedoms to an extent, generally, I would rather they didn't park up opposite my house.
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