Tipping, your opinions please

[boldie]

Out of interest, anyone know what a dealer in this country gets paid? And how much they typically make in tips..?

We were discussing this at the weekend, and a dealer said that they get round about the minimum wage.  I'm sure the dealer said that the tips they receive make up a very large amount of their take home pay.

I'm sure it does. Say it was even a lowish stakes game, maybe £1-2 NL - it doesn't seem that unreasonable to think that in your average loosish live game a dealer might on average get tipped a quid a hand. So maybe as much as £20-25 an hour, on top of the 6 quid on whatever they actually get paid. Or am I massively overestimating it?

I'm in the wrong friggin job.

[littlemissC]

i always tip.even if its only a pound(as you well know az,lol) but you are my favourite so i tip you the most

[LLevan]

Lets open another can of worms:

Do unlicenced premises such as Gutshot, Equal Chance, Western etc pay their dealers and valets an hourly wage or are the staff expected to earn a living out of tips gained.

We all know that in casinos staff are paid an hourly wage and don't rely on tips and I would assume that the recently opened DTD club pays their staff too.

I remember playing in spielers and private games years ago when the staff did not get a share of the rake but earnt their wages by tips and most of them earnt a very nice hourly wage if they put the hours in, presumably tax free too(another can of worms just been opened lol).

[Jon MW]

Out of interest, anyone know what a dealer in this country gets paid? And how much they typically make in tips..?

We were discussing this at the weekend, and a dealer said that they get round about the minimum wage.  I'm sure the dealer said that the tips they receive make up a very large amount of their take home pay.

I think the amount dealers get paid can vary quite a bit, but one thing which Boldie touched on in one of his posts is that there is a fundamental difference between somebody earning minimum wage in Britain to earning the minimum wage in America.

In the States the minimum wage really isn't enough to live on, but in Britain it is. It might not leave you with much spare cash, but it means that if you don't tip in Britain nobody's going to go hungry or not pay their rent. With all the talk of casinos and card rooms paying their staff properly it's best not to forget that they're not consigning them to poverty by paying the minimum wage to the lowest earners.

[kinboshi]

Out of interest, anyone know what a dealer in this country gets paid? And how much they typically make in tips..?

We were discussing this at the weekend, and a dealer said that they get round about the minimum wage.  I'm sure the dealer said that the tips they receive make up a very large amount of their take home pay.

I'm sure it does. Say it was even a lowish stakes game, maybe £1-2 NL - it doesn't seem that unreasonable to think that in your average loosish live game a dealer might on average get tipped a quid a hand. So maybe as much as £20-25 an hour, on top of the 6 quid on whatever they actually get paid. Or am I massively overestimating it?

I think you're over-estimating it, but I might be wrong.  I think that most only tip when it's a decent-sized pot, and they aren't every hand (except on the loosest of tables).

At DTD, the tips go into a central pot that is shared amongst all the dealers.  That includes those who are dealing in the tournament, and who are therefore not receiving tips.  So when it's averaged out, it would be a lot less than the figure you estimated.  Proberly.

[M3boy]

I do tip - and tipping is a sore subject at the moment lol (See Equal Chance thread)

BUT - I dont think anyone that doesnt tip should be treated differently in any way to someone who does. It is upto the individual to choose to do with his/her money as he/she sees fit.

I have no idea what dealers get paid, I would imagine it is not very much - I think it is wrong of dealers to rely on tips to boost their wage, I really do. Treat them as a bonus.

If you are unhappy with the level of wage, find another job.

Also, look at the knowledge/skill which dealers pick up when dealing - a great way to learn poker no?

Maybe the dealers should be tipping the players for the knowledge they gain?!? lol

[WarBwastard]

Out of interest, anyone know what a dealer in this country gets paid? And how much they typically make in tips..?

We were discussing this at the weekend, and a dealer said that they get round about the minimum wage.  I'm sure the dealer said that the tips they receive make up a very large amount of their take home pay.

I'm sure it does. Say it was even a lowish stakes game, maybe £1-2 NL - it doesn't seem that unreasonable to think that in your average loosish live game a dealer might on average get tipped a quid a hand. So maybe as much as £20-25 an hour, on top of the 6 quid on whatever they actually get paid. Or am I massively overestimating it?

I think you're over-estimating it, but I might be wrong.  I think that most only tip when it's a decent-sized pot, and they aren't every hand (except on the loosest of tables).

At DTD, the tips go into a central pot that is shared amongst all the dealers.  That includes those who are dealing in the tournament, and who are therefore not receiving tips.  So when it's averaged out, it would be a lot less than the figure you estimated.  Proberly.

The DTD tournament dealers are tipped as you're 'obliged' to give 3% of your winnings should you cash.

[boldie]

Out of interest, anyone know what a dealer in this country gets paid? And how much they typically make in tips..?

We were discussing this at the weekend, and a dealer said that they get round about the minimum wage.  I'm sure the dealer said that the tips they receive make up a very large amount of their take home pay.

I'm sure it does. Say it was even a lowish stakes game, maybe £1-2 NL - it doesn't seem that unreasonable to think that in your average loosish live game a dealer might on average get tipped a quid a hand. So maybe as much as £20-25 an hour, on top of the 6 quid on whatever they actually get paid. Or am I massively overestimating it?

I think you're over-estimating it, but I might be wrong.  I think that most only tip when it's a decent-sized pot, and they aren't every hand (except on the loosest of tables).

At DTD, the tips go into a central pot that is shared amongst all the dealers.  That includes those who are dealing in the tournament, and who are therefore not receiving tips.  So when it's averaged out, it would be a lot less than the figure you estimated.  Proberly.

The DTD tournament dealers are tipped as you're 'obliged' to give 3% of your winnings should you cash.

really? Is that after your pay out or is that taken out of the prizepool?

[WarBwastard]

Out of interest, anyone know what a dealer in this country gets paid? And how much they typically make in tips..?

We were discussing this at the weekend, and a dealer said that they get round about the minimum wage.  I'm sure the dealer said that the tips they receive make up a very large amount of their take home pay.

I'm sure it does. Say it was even a lowish stakes game, maybe £1-2 NL - it doesn't seem that unreasonable to think that in your average loosish live game a dealer might on average get tipped a quid a hand. So maybe as much as £20-25 an hour, on top of the 6 quid on whatever they actually get paid. Or am I massively overestimating it?

I think you're over-estimating it, but I might be wrong.  I think that most only tip when it's a decent-sized pot, and they aren't every hand (except on the loosest of tables).

At DTD, the tips go into a central pot that is shared amongst all the dealers.  That includes those who are dealing in the tournament, and who are therefore not receiving tips.  So when it's averaged out, it would be a lot less than the figure you estimated.  Proberly.

After your payout.

The DTD tournament dealers are tipped as you're 'obliged' to give 3% of your winnings should you cash.

really? Is that after your pay out or is that taken out of the prizepool?

After the payout.  Perhaps obliged it not the right word, but once the idea of tipping the dealers is suggested by the TD, not just at DTD I generally feel obliged as it's preferable to being looked at as a tight git.

[Jaydeaa]

Lets open another can of worms:

Do unlicenced premises such as Gutshot, Equal Chance, Western etc pay their dealers and valets an hourly wage or are the staff expected to earn a living out of tips gained.

We all know that in casinos staff are paid an hourly wage and don't rely on tips and I would assume that the recently opened DTD club pays their staff too.

I remember playing in spielers and private games years ago when the staff did not get a share of the rake but earnt their wages by tips and most of them earnt a very nice hourly wage if they put the hours in, presumably tax free too(another can of worms just been opened lol).

If your on about spielers in Southend, Now MINT all of there valet's are on tips only basis!

[boldie]

Out of interest, anyone know what a dealer in this country gets paid? And how much they typically make in tips..?

We were discussing this at the weekend, and a dealer said that they get round about the minimum wage.  I'm sure the dealer said that the tips they receive make up a very large amount of their take home pay.

I'm sure it does. Say it was even a lowish stakes game, maybe £1-2 NL - it doesn't seem that unreasonable to think that in your average loosish live game a dealer might on average get tipped a quid a hand. So maybe as much as £20-25 an hour, on top of the 6 quid on whatever they actually get paid. Or am I massively overestimating it?

I think you're over-estimating it, but I might be wrong.  I think that most only tip when it's a decent-sized pot, and they aren't every hand (except on the loosest of tables).

At DTD, the tips go into a central pot that is shared amongst all the dealers.  That includes those who are dealing in the tournament, and who are therefore not receiving tips.  So when it's averaged out, it would be a lot less than the figure you estimated.  Proberly.

After your payout.

The DTD tournament dealers are tipped as you're 'obliged' to give 3% of your winnings should you cash.

really? Is that after your pay out or is that taken out of the prizepool?

After the payout.  Perhaps obliged it not the right word, but once the idea of tipping the dealers is suggested by the TD, not just at DTD I generally feel obliged as it's preferable to being looked at as a tight git.

ah OK.. If the TD only stands up and says "BTW guys, if you want to leave  tip it's greatly appreciated and 3% is about the norm" I think he's doing most people a favour as most would tip more than 3% simply because they don't know how much to tip. I have no problem with people suggesting it.much prefer it to just taking a % out of the prizepool to be honest.

I also have no problem with being percieved as a tight git though

[vegaslover]

to be honest..that is one of the worst articles I have ever read and would only make me inclined to not tip at all.

it's the age old excuse "The rake is for the house, not the dealer" What a load of bollox. I pay rake/ session fees so that the house can pay the dealer a decent wage.

Do I get paid more money for doing a decent job? No, I get to keep my job...as does the dealer. A shitty dealer should get the sack..thereby making less than a good one.

I always tip when winning, tipping when losing is something that's just not going to happen (unless I'm getting up from a table and find I have have a few £ left so might as well give that to the dealer) and is something that shouldn't be encouraged.

Casinos and card rooms should just pay their staff properly and hire the right people..not tell people already spending their money there to make sure the dealers and valets get a decent wage.

This entire discussion is really starting to piss me off.

Not a fan of tipping then shorty?

lol..I always tip..I just don't like the "you have to tip or you should be put to the stake because those poor little dealers will starve to death otherwise. F' em..let the get a different job if they don't make enough money dealing..or go work for a place that does pay a decent wage.

Do I have to tip the cleaning lady at my office for doing a good job? I'm pretty sure she's struggling to make ends meet as she has 3 different jobs.

I just can't believe casinos have gotten the players to accept that it's us that should be paying the dealers and valets a decent wage.

i agree entirely with the whole "poor starving dealers" comment you made boldie. although it is also the case that once you have dealt a few hands at varying levels it is an extremely mudnane task, especially tournaments where it can often be a case of shuffle deal muck muck muck muck muck limp muck call check minbet fold fold

it happens alot.  personally i can only imagine alot of comps especially in the early stages or near the bubble of a tournament are beyond lethally dull at least we can pick up a book and switch off while we wait for a short stack to die.


**it's the age old excuse "The rake is for the house, not the dealer" What a load of bollox. I pay rake/ session fees so that the house can pay the dealer a decent wage.**

rake and session fees really are for the house, especially in cardroom only venues where 95+% of the running costs of the building and covering the basic wages are covered by the rake itself, it goes on far more than merely paying the dealers better

the tips are imho what makes a guy dedicate his working time to ensuring that the player can concentrate on playing for money by operating the mechanics of the game allowing you to daydream or focus on your other players, instead of playing your hand - tracking the pots, ensuring ettiquette is adhered to etc and knowing the rules.  all the smaller comps i played at gala were usually dealt by the same group of people that recieved a comped meal from the casino and a couple of bob from each player to compensate for the fact that they were sacrificing their gamel. ive had hell on at other venues where noone wants to deal and pitching cards from the long end of a table and doing everything + playing leads to a grossly detrimental gaming experiance.

i found a couple of other online articles earlier which looked at it in better detail than that original one i posted the link to - on about.com - several advocating a different stance and methodology to the practice.

at the end of the day tis always each to their own and im finding some of the views to be rather interesting.  good to see a broad spectrum willing to speak their minds

AZ


edit : **Do you ever tip waiters and waitresses or taxi drivers?**
yes i do, not taxi drivers so much, but i used to be a waiter//bartender, it is always nice to know that someone appreciated your service enough to offer some extra pennies

Thats a terrible statement, if dealers are bored, and start making mistakes, goes hand in hand imho, then they should feck off and get another job. It seems pretty clear that you as a dealer expect tips. I only tip to those that give good service at the table, and certainly wouldn't to any that are actively looking for tips.

[Sunday8pm]

i tip copious amounts wherever i go. poker, taxis, bars, restaurants.

Say a £23 taxi = £30 paid

£50 meal = £60 paid

I really couldnt give a dogs arse about a few quid. Im a professional poker player, i earn much more than these people. I used to be a waiter when i was ultra young and i appreciate how hard it actually is. With taxis drivers the poor bastards get hit with never ending fuel hikes etc etc so i feel a little sorry for them doing 15 hour shifts to pay for their families. I earn that in no time sitting on my lazy ass busting fish. So i think these people deserve a little tip, especially if it puts a smile on their face and mine

[AndrewT]

If your on about spielers in Southend, Now MINT all of there valet's are on tips only basis!

Is that legal? What happened to the minimum wage?

[Jon MW]

If your on about spielers in Southend, Now MINT all of there valet's are on tips only basis!

Is that legal? What happened to the minimum wage?

It can be legal.

But it has to comply with the minimum wage, i.e. if the tips a dealer receives end up being lower than the minimum wage then the employers legally have to top it up.

In practice I suspect this isn't happening.