CHANGES TO DTD

[GreekStein]

I travelled up to DTD once from London to play for 3 or 4 days over a long weekend and planning to come up again very soon. I'm not too bothered about the comps as I like rebuys and freezeouts.

However, it would be a big factor in my decision to come up especially to play at the club knowing that I could play that much longer til 6am rather than 3.30.

[AndrewT]

Therefore there is a higher ratio of luck to skill needed in rebuys than freezeouts - that's what I don't like.

No, because in a rebuy you can be unlucky lots of times and yet still win. In a freezeout you get unlucky once and you are out. Therefore luck has more of a chance to revert to mean in a rebuy.

[Snatiramas]

Therefore there is a higher ratio of luck to skill needed in rebuys than freezeouts - that's what I don't like.

No, because in a rebuy you can be unlucky lots of times and yet still win. In a freezeout you get unlucky once and you are out. Therefore luck has more of a chance to revert to mean in a rebuy.

I find myself agreeing with young master Andrew on this one.......plus you can have a bit of fun with a much broader range of hands.........the occassional rebuy should be in the diet of most players

[TheChipPrince]

I think most players like to 'know' exactly what they're going to spend beforehand on a comp, in a rebuy you can never be sure of course...

[Snatiramas]

I think most players like to 'know' exactly what they're going to spend beforehand on a comp, in a rebuy you can never be sure of course...

buy in times 5 should do it generally

[robyong]

From my point of view:

1. 1 day re-buys have to have a shorter clock due to the amount of chips in play after the re-buy period to get the comp finished on time
2. 1 day re-buys have less people are knocked out within the re-buy period than a freezoeut so the clock has to be shortened for this comp to finish on time
3. The more uncontrollable variables that you introduce into any poker game - the more the luck element increases and a good players edge decreases (eg. 6 card omaha v 4 card omaha) allowing people to purchase extra chips substancially increases the amount of uncontrollable variables on the table, therefore the luck element increase (eg. the effectiveness of bluffing as a poker weapin is decreased)
 
When I play my £500 heads-up challenge at the club I play 100bb freezout with no re-buy, I do this to make sure I have the best chance of winning against players who I have an edge over, I also expect to lose with this structure versus players that have an edge over me. Poker is of course about opinions, but I am absolutley mathematically sure that there is more skill in a £75 freezout starting with 100bb+ that a £20 unlimited RB starting with 30BB.

 

[TheChipPrince]

I think most players like to 'know' exactly what they're going to spend beforehand on a comp, in a rebuy you can never be sure of course...

buy in times 5 should do it generally

'generally' yes, but its never exact...  A couple of unlucky moves and its more, a couple of good hands and its less... For example the £75 freeze, ppl can budget ''right its £85 for the comp, plus £15 for food/drinks etc, now I know tonight will cost me £100''

I think most ppl think like that...

[robyong]

I travelled up to DTD once from London to play for 3 or 4 days over a long weekend and planning to come up again very soon. I'm not too bothered about the comps as I like rebuys and freezeouts.

However, it would be a big factor in my decision to come up especially to play at the club knowing that I could play that much longer til 6am rather than 3.30.

Hi mate as I said, closing hours will be tweaked to suit the new 5 day operation, cheers mate Rob

[jizzemm]

From my point of view:

1. 1 day re-buys have to have a shorter clock due to the amount of chips in play after the re-buy period to get the comp finished on time
2. 1 day re-buys have less people are knocked out within the re-buy period than a freezoeut so the clock has to be shortened for this comp to finish on time
3. The more uncontrollable variables that you introduce into any poker game - the more the luck element increases and a good players edge decreases (eg. 6 card omaha v 4 card omaha) allowing people to purchase extra chips substancially increases the amount of uncontrollable variables on the table, therefore the luck element increase (eg. the effectiveness of bluffing as a poker weapin is decreased)
 
When I play my £500 heads-up challenge at the club I play 100bb freezout with no re-buy, I do this to make sure I have the best chance of winning against players who I have an edge over, I also expect to lose with this structure versus players that have an edge over me. Poker is of course about opinions, but I am absolutley mathematically sure that there is more skill in a £75 freezout starting with 100bb+ that a £20 unlimited RB starting with 30BB.

Excellent post Rob.

We are so lucky on blonde, we have a person who has arguably built the best poker venue in Europe(disclaimer not played outside UK) and has the time to come onto the forum to openly discuss what HE wants from the club and also listens to feedback from poker players and involves them in the discussion. He wont be able to please all poker players, some want to play re-buys, some want freezeouts, but he has spent and invested a lot of money and time in getting his club up and running, and he is going have the club run the way that he wants poker in his club to run..

  to you Rob, you are putting pleasure before business, and also looking after your most loyal people the staff, and at the same time providing a excellent service to members/players. I bet there are no complaints in that suggestion box..

[StuartHopkin]

Really enjoyed the round of each tournament last night, im the first to admit my omaha game is pretty mediocre, and its the first time ive played PL hold em ever, but the atmosphere was superb, the low buy in created a friendly learning atmosphere and good times were had by all.

I believe the intention was announced last night to start running this along side a 6 max £50 on a thursday when computer software was sorted? Surely this is just going to dilute both comps? I for one will have no idea which comp to play, and may just alternate weeks.

I also think having Rob and Simon playing (Simon in the comp, Rob at cash) adds something to the whole experience. Obviously there always around, but having the chance to actually play against them in the standard tourneys is a great experience.

Where else can you share a table with Simon Trumper and Dave Smith in a £25 comp? Err..... No Where!

  is the new nuts 

[action man]

... the whole table went all-in first hand after a player had raised with AA, ...

That pretty much sums up the reason why I don't like rebuys.

?

What do you have against a one in three chance of nontupling up first hand?

The thing which causes many people to be against rebuys is that they play them as if they are freezeouts.

As started elsewhere in the thread, the problem with the rebuys is the cost. Many player seem to think of rebuys (especially £10 ones) as bingo. They generally only are for that first hour. One the freezeout period has started, you will find a lot of chips in play and some quite deep stacks, allowing more play than you would get in a comparative freezeout.

he speaks a lot of sense this andrew dude.

[Gazza]

I travelled up to DTD once from London to play for 3 or 4 days over a long weekend and planning to come up again very soon. I'm not too bothered about the comps as I like rebuys and freezeouts.

However, it would be a big factor in my decision to come up especially to play at the club knowing that I could play that much longer til 6am rather than 3.30.

Hi mate as I said, closing hours will be tweaked to suit the new 5 day operation, cheers mate Rob

I'm glad to hear its not set in stone, I definitely think the demand is there for later opening hours on the weekend.

[WarBwastard]

I think most players like to 'know' exactly what they're going to spend beforehand on a comp, in a rebuy you can never be sure of course...

buy in times 5 should do it generally

I just like to know how much my buy in will be and how much the starting stacks will be.

A £10 re-buy is essentially a £50 freeze-out at least from a cost point of view, but with the added disadvantage of not necessarily having the min of 5000 chips you'd be guaranteed if it were a straight freeze-out, if that makes sense.

Someone with deep pockets going all-in every hand can make the whole thing a little tedious if you never pick up the hands to play back at him/her. 

[77dave]

Who says there is more luck and less skill inolved in 4 card omaha than 6 card.

[Royal Flush]

I lol hard at the rebuy freezeout debate, there is clearly more skill in a rebuy.

Apart from anything you get a 2nd chance if your AA gets cracked by some lemon with 77, secondly there is a whole new dimension of wider pre flop ranges and post flop ranges. You have to adjust your ranges during rebuys and then post, how is that LESS skillfull?

The only time i would say a freezeout is more skillfull is when you have deepstacks to start as IMO playing deep NLHE is harder than adjusting ranges in short stack events, so unless you have 10k chips and 1hr levels @ 25-50 its a rebuy all day long!