flopped straight v v early in deepstack

[boldie]

We do't know what oppo is like yet...he could well have an overpair of some sort...I hope for him he hits his set on the turn..or another non-scare card.
He would surely fold JJ etc to any shove/4 bet...but a check call and non-scare card on the turn....check it to him..might induce an extra bet out of him.

[Royal Flush]

How does 2 betting then flatting a 753 flop mean we have 46 only? We can have 24/68, random 7's,  overpairs, pair and str8 draw, 2 pair or sets

Obv flat there is over 3k in now which is going to be easy to get in down the streets.

[david3103]

Opinions seem to be divided but we seem to be looking to find the best way to get all the chips in?

Our hero shoved, happy for that to be the end of the hand when the SB folded.

The SB called

what would you need to be thinking at this stage if you were that SB?

what cards would make you call your tourney life on the flop of hand 4? Even if you thought our hero was 'at it'?

[daviebhoy]

He shoved 8k into the 3k pot ? I think I would need 46 to call to be honest. I think your mates push is awful but does look bluffy so I won't be surprised to hear that some nutter called with 78. Also, why would he be happy for that to be the end of the hand when he has the nuts ?

From what you are saying I assume SB calls with a draw and hits but calling here with 77 would be pretty marginal as your mate really cant have anything other than 46.

[Longy]

Opinions seem to be divided but we seem to be looking to find the best way to get all the chips in?

Our hero shoved, happy for that to be the end of the hand when the SB folded.

The SB called

what would you need to be thinking at this stage if you were that SB?

what cards would make you call your tourney life on the flop of hand 4? Even if you thought our hero was 'at it'?

What??? I don't get it, does your mate hate money? The only reason to overshove here is to get villian to level himself and make some kind of hero call, we sure as hell don't want villian to fold.

Well as sb, i am calling with 46 and all sets (though with some history bottom set is a fold occasionally), 75o probably an interesting discussion. Lol @ folding 77 here.

[david3103]

He loves money, and loves poker (except when he hates it)

OK, so the shove is not a good move for all sorts of reasons but what really surprised me was the call and I'm interested now to see if anyone can make a case for calling with the SB hand. Which wasn't a set btw

The hand interested me, not just because it involved a mate, but also because the way it played out is alien to my thoughts on live poker.

In my mind the structure (this was the Welsh APAT btw) doesn't encourage hands like this this early. Although  by time this played out, there had already been an exit.

[GreekStein]

A few people have said that flatting is stronger than shoving - curious to know the thinking behind this as surely someones range to flat 1k more is a shedload wider than shovelling their whole stack across the line in a deepstack?

FWIW I weaklead the turn here and hope he raises. If I get flatted I overbet river.

[daviebhoy]

Lol @ folding 77 here.

4 hands in, opponent 5-bets all-in for 10k. You have 8500 left, 11.5k in the pot -  blinds are 25/50.

How is that an easy call with 77 in a limped pot and the board is 357 ?

[GreekStein]

Lol @ folding 77 here.

4 hands in, opponent 5-bets all-in for 10k. You have 8500 left, 11.5k in the pot -  blinds are 25/50.

How is that an easy call with 77 in a limped pot and the board is 357 ?

Answer taken from OP....'Live MTT'

No need to thank me

[daviebhoy]

No need to thank me.

Not saying I would fold but its not an easy decision. 75 would be an easy pass but I would probably throw up in my mouth if I have a set here when board doesn't pair.

[GreekStein]

No need to thank me.

Not saying I would fold but its not an easy decision. 75 would be an easy pass but I would probably throw up in my mouth if I have a set here when board doesn't pair.

Opponent dependant but lots of dumb live players will happy get bottom two in at this stage that we can't pass 77 here. He shows up with undersets & random dumbness too often to pass 77.

[Jon MW]

Lol @ folding 77 here.

4 hands in, opponent 5-bets all-in for 10k. You have 8500 left, 11.5k in the pot -  blinds are 25/50.

How is that an easy call with 77 in a limped pot and the board is 357 ?

Answer taken from OP....'Live MTT'

No need to thank me

This is why I don't think the over bet shove is that bad.

Obv. it depends on the thinking behind it though.

If it was a shove because he just wanted to take the pot on the flop, then I think it was a bad play.
If it was a shove because he thought his opponent would call with hands like pocket aces, kings and sets for example then I think it was feasible to believe this would work and is a good shove.

[daviebhoy]

FWIW I weaklead the turn here and hope he raises. If I get flatted I overbet river.

I agree with this line. 1kish on the turn could well induce a shove and with 5kish in pot and 7ish behind the overbet is likely to get called if he just flats the turn.

If he leads out on the turn our line doesn't matter tho as its all going in no matter what we do. Nothing wrong with min-raise on turn or flatting to go all-in on river.

[david3103]

Lol @ folding 77 here.

4 hands in, opponent 5-bets all-in for 10k. You have 8500 left, 11.5k in the pot -  blinds are 25/50.

How is that an easy call with 77 in a limped pot and the board is 357 ?

Answer taken from OP....'Live MTT'

No need to thank me

So you're saying that people call lighter in a live MTT they have driven/flown or whatever to get to, than if they were in an equivalent priced/rewarded tournament online?

[EvilPie]

The main reason that this hand can play out this way is that it's live.

You really don't get many 4 bets or 5 bets even when you're this deep.

If someone 3 bets me and I've got the nuts I'm happy to 4 bet him because I'm confident he's got a hand strong enough to shove.

Online this hand plays differently. You flat online because there is a much higher chance of your oppo trying to steal because they see the weakness in your betting pattern.

In a live game we have already shown strength and I honestly think that flatting makes us look even stronger.

Sure this hand is a cooler but unless you happen to be up against a very good player and you can somehow hide the fact that you've flopped the nuts (not easy live) then if it's not going in on the flop it's highly unlikely that it's going in.