Player dependent call?

[Pyso]

I’ve been known for overly long posts so I’ll try and tone this one down.

It’s a live £0.50/£1 cash game at DTD. I’ve been playing for about 5 hours and I'm on around £165 having bought in for the max. The table has been a good spot with several weak players, although now some have left and we have had some better players sit down. One target remains however, a scouser in seat nine who is a little tipsy, having fun and getting very lucky. He plays the game back to front and is a stack-off waiting to happen. He is the reason I'm still sat here despite it getting late.

Anyway, the hand I would like to get some feedback from.

UTG + 1 opens for £13 - it’s folded to me and I re-pop to £45 with Kings. Blinds fold and opponent flats.

Flop is Q, 7, 4 with two spades. He checks, I c-bet for £50. Oppo check-raises all-in and it’s £48 more to call.

My question is two pronged. Obviously we call if we are up against a standard £0.50/£1 player, right? Probably yes - ok, so far so good.

So, do we call now if the player in question is Simon Trumper?

I believe it makes a difference. Simon had only been at the table about 40 minutes and although he had been involved in a few pots, apart from a nice float, hadn’t been getting too far out of line. A player of his quality doesn’t over play AQ, KQ, JJ or tens on this board out of position to a re-raise pre-flop. He hasn’t played with me before but the two guys next to him have helpfully been telling him I have been quite tight up to this point (thanks guys). Simon says he thinks I have AK which seems an odd comment, more designed to get me to call than anything else.

I am pretty certain he has either QQ for a set or AA. He may have the nut flush draw with AK and there is a very small chance he also has KK but I don’t put him on much else. His range from UTG is pretty tight at a full table.

I think against a random £0.50/£1 fish I can call, and against Simon Trumper I can find a pass. Does any one agree?

I am trying not to be results oriented in my assessment here because I called having said I thought he had a set of queens and was proved right.

When I got home I reckoned I could have found a pass here and saved myself £48. I don’t think Simon was ever bluffing here given what was left for me to call and the way the action went pre-flop. Ok, so he may push a big draw but I just feel that the most likely result here is that I am toast.

Anyway, your thoughts please.

[Pyso]

oops wrong board, sorry! Can it be moved please?!!

[Colchester Kev]

Done.

[boldie]

ussually I would say you are nuts for folding kings here but your read was right.

My main question is "Why make it 45 pre?"

[Pyso]

I made it £45 to make sure I got it heads up, no other reason. If I flat call I probably have to play a 3 or 4 way pot at this sort of table.

[StuartHopkin]

mbsfn to be simon trumper

lol

i dont think i can find a pass for my last £48 into a £250 ish pot with an overpair

i agree with your point here that its not against the normal fish but i still call, rightly or wrongly

[maldini32]

You pass here and its chip dumping.

[boldie]

I made it £45 to make sure I got it heads up, no other reason. If I flat call I probably have to play a 3 or 4 way pot at this sort of table.

yes but why not make it less than 45? 35-40 does the same, no?

[AlexMartin]

mbsfn to be Simon Trumper

lol

i dont think i can find a pass for my last £48 into a £250 ish pot with an overpair

i agree with your point here that its not against the normal fish but i still call, rightly or wrongly

so sometimes hes gonna show AA and QQ. Nevermind. dont slowroll

[Newmanseye]

You cant fold here, pots too big you have an overpair if he caught a rogue queen then so be it, this one you take on the chin.

[Pyso]

You pass here and its chip dumping.

Why can't I ever get anyone to see that sometimes you can and should pass in these spots? This is live poker remember with all the extra tells and sensory input. I had a very strong sense that I was beaten here, not just from going through the logic of the hand, but also due to a gut feeling picked up from looking at Simon, what he was saying to me and just the general internal feeling that I knew what he had.

Granted I call here in an online game, but this was a live hand and I think they are worlds apart.

I want to see the day when someone comes on a forum and agrees that it is possible in this spot to fold, even if it's for £48 into a £240 pot.

I know most of us, including me, are calling, and I did, but haven't some of us made that pass in this spot before and been right?

[jakally]

Are you Chris Bruce in disguise? 

[Pyso]

No, not Chris Bruce

...oh and what does mbsfn stand for? I'm not very good at net lingo.

[Newmanseye]

You pass here and its chip dumping.

Why can't I ever get anyone to see that sometimes you can and should pass in these spots? This is live poker remember with all the extra tells and sensory input. I had a very strong sense that I was beaten here, not just from going through the logic of the hand, but also due to a gut feeling picked up from looking at Simon, what he was saying to me and just the general internal feeling that I knew what he had.

Granted I call here in an online game, but this was a live hand and I think they are worlds apart.

I want to see the day when someone comes on a forum and agrees that it is possible in this spot to fold, even if it's for £48 into a £240 pot.

I know most of us, including me, are calling, and I did, but haven't some of us made that pass in this spot before and been right?

Tell us some of the tells and we may agree that a pass is possible, Just because he moves in on a checkraise aint enough info here, He could do the same with AQ if he thinks you are over playing an underpair tbh.

More background on the way the play has gone and what Tells you have picked up on would be better, otherwise the Math makes you call here.

[Pyso]

You pass here and its chip dumping.

Why can't I ever get anyone to see that sometimes you can and should pass in these spots? This is live poker remember with all the extra tells and sensory input. I had a very strong sense that I was beaten here, not just from going through the logic of the hand, but also due to a gut feeling picked up from looking at Simon, what he was saying to me and just the general internal feeling that I knew what he had.

Granted I call here in an online game, but this was a live hand and I think they are worlds apart.

I want to see the day when someone comes on a forum and agrees that it is possible in this spot to fold, even if it's for £48 into a £240 pot.

I know most of us, including me, are calling, and I did, but haven't some of us made that pass in this spot before and been right?

Tell us some of the tells and we may agree that a pass is possible, Just because he moves in on a checkraise aint enough info here, He could do the same with AQ if he thinks you are over playing an underpair tbh.

More background on the way the play has gone and what Tells you have picked up on would be better, otherwise the Math makes you call here.



Ok, here goes. He liked his cards pre-flop and raised confidently. I was watching him watching me as the flop came down. He then looked at the flop and looked away quickly, usually a sign of strength. He checked, which I was expecting anyway. I bet because I'm not letting AK get there on the turn and I also need some feedback as to the strength of his hand. I admit I inflated the pot size unnecessarily pre-flop and maybe my c-bet was a little large but he took very little time to check-raise me, in fact he looked so keen he could hardly stop himself.

As I was taking my time calling he then said, "I think you have AK" which I repeated with incredulity because I saw it for what it was, an attempt to get me to call as he could sense I might actually be passing.

I made the maths based call but I didn't feel good about it and my inner gut was right when he flipped over QQ very quickly. He pretended to sound surprised that I had KK but I'm sure he knew all along what I had, given the flop and my bet into him.

Also my view of his view of me was that he would see me as relatively tight preflop because in the time he had been sat down it was my first raise and also I was obviously respecting position. So I think he had me tagged on better than a mid pair or AK.