Scotland's Shame thread

[Ironside]

Yes the league will be more competitive without the OF but it hardly means anything. Winning the league will be just like getting third at the moment. I really don't think I would be dancing in the streets if Aberdeen beat off stiff competition from the mighty Hearts Hibs and Dundee Utd to win the league.

I also agree with Dave, coefficient will crash without the OF and the league winner will have to start in the first qualification round for the champions league along with all the other small teams.

The sad fact is that the OF are Scottish football. They bring in the TV money and without them, revenues will plummet - TV and gates. I can't see clubs getting bigger crowds if the OF leave. The OF games are the only ones that get big crowds at Pittodrie.

OF games are the only ones to get crowds cause the standard of the rest of the teams is piss poor
when the OF leave the standard will improve IMHO and people will turn up to see good games

How will it improve with less funds, meaning poorer training facilities, and poorer youth academies?

because managers wont be filling there teams with crap over paid forgeiners

more fans would come into the game as games will have meaning where as now
the only thing they have to look forward to is getting to a final and coming 3rd

[Scottish Dave]

Yes the league will be more competitive without the OF but it hardly means anything. Winning the league will be just like getting third at the moment. I really don't think I would be dancing in the streets if Aberdeen beat off stiff competition from the mighty Hearts Hibs and Dundee Utd to win the league.

I also agree with Dave, coefficient will crash without the OF and the league winner will have to start in the first qualification round for the champions league along with all the other small teams.

The sad fact is that the OF are Scottish football. They bring in the TV money and without them, revenues will plummet - TV and gates. I can't see clubs getting bigger crowds if the OF leave. The OF games are the only ones that get big crowds at Pittodrie.

OF games are the only ones to get crowds cause the standard of the rest of the teams is piss poor
when the OF leave the standard will improve IMHO and people will turn up to see good games

How will it improve with less funds, meaning poorer training facilities, and poorer youth academies?

because managers wont be filling there teams with crap over paid forgeiners

more fans would come into the game as games will have meaning where as now
the only thing they have to look forward to is getting to a final and coming 3rd

with poor youth systems,and managers not filling the team with players from over seas, it doesn't leave much tho does it. I do hope im wrong tho, as no doubt, a few old firm fans will head to some of the games up here if the OF are playing away at Brighton in the cup that day lol

[Ironside]

Yes the league will be more competitive without the OF but it hardly means anything. Winning the league will be just like getting third at the moment. I really don't think I would be dancing in the streets if Aberdeen beat off stiff competition from the mighty Hearts Hibs and Dundee Utd to win the league.

I also agree with Dave, coefficient will crash without the OF and the league winner will have to start in the first qualification round for the champions league along with all the other small teams.

The sad fact is that the OF are Scottish football. They bring in the TV money and without them, revenues will plummet - TV and gates. I can't see clubs getting bigger crowds if the OF leave. The OF games are the only ones that get big crowds at Pittodrie.

OF games are the only ones to get crowds cause the standard of the rest of the teams is piss poor
when the OF leave the standard will improve IMHO and people will turn up to see good games

How will it improve with less funds, meaning poorer training facilities, and poorer youth academies?

because managers wont be filling there teams with crap over paid forgeiners

more fans would come into the game as games will have meaning where as now
the only thing they have to look forward to is getting to a final and coming 3rd

with poor youth systems,and managers not filling the team with players from over seas, it doesn't leave much tho does it. I do hope im wrong tho, as no doubt, a few old firm fans will head to some of the games up here if the OF are playing away at Brighton in the cup that day lol

the youth systems wont be so poor though and kids will get a chance in the first teams which they aren't currently getting
and they wont have the OF stealing all the better kids then letting them rot in the reserves as they are paying wages to over paid foreigners

[Boba Fett]

I actually believe Scottish football would thrive without them, the league suddenly becomes very competitive with the OF gone. I also think there would be more opportunity for young scots to make the break through. I think Scottish Football would win, the OF would win, I just really don't see what's in it for the EPL.

Totally agree. Seems most fans are more than happy to be waving goodbye to the OF. Thanks for nothing really, don't let the door hit you on the way out.

you need to remember that none of the other SPL teams would be where they are financially right now, if it wasn't for Us bringing in the Setanta Money (when they actually paid up) and ESPN Money. don't bite the hand that feed you.

but the crowds would be bigger and the games more intresting the league more competitive and the whole package more intriguing to the TV companies who at the moment are only intrested in the old firm and derbys

I only half agree with you TBH.

The part i agree with is that the league would defo becoming more competitive, and enjoyable for the fans of the SPL teams, but i disagree with the TV companies taking a new interest, i really don't see them being interested in showing (a newly competitive) Hearts v Aberdeen, than say West Ham v Everton even.

Yes Hearts, Hibs, Aberdeen, Dundee Utd etc will thrive and win the league, but they will only thrive in a desperate league which might not even gain entery into Europe anymore, if UEFA decide so once celtic and rangers leave (which i think will happen)

No Europe and no TV deals, how good will the league be?

Why would UEFA do that? They might well ban Rangers and Celtic from europe for not playing in their own domestic league a la the Welsh sides in England but the Scottish sides who remain will be more than welcome.

well if they do still let them compete in Europe it will be 10 times harder to get in due to the Coefficient, Celtic and rangers Co-eff's are majorly higher than hibs, aberdeen etc, and we struggle to make it through 1 or 2 rounds, with their C0-eff they will need to go through all three rounds, plus the play off round.

IMO they wont be competing in Europe.

I still think there wont be any TV deals tho, so very little money's coming in, meaning any young talent will still leave for Lower english leagues for better money

How is that any different to what is happening now to the non old firm scottish sides. The majority are still going through the qualifying stages of the Europa cup, if Rangers and Celtic leave the co-efficient will almost certainly drop but the clubs will also be finishing higher up the league/winning cups to qualify for the spot vacated by the old firm.

The implications of old firm's european future are a lot more concerning, what the old firm gain for being in the EPL they will also possibly lose european football leading to a situation where they couldn't financially compete with the big 4 in England.

I think there is more money to be made for being in the EPL than in the Champions league

[Scottish Dave]

Yes the league will be more competitive without the OF but it hardly means anything. Winning the league will be just like getting third at the moment. I really don't think I would be dancing in the streets if Aberdeen beat off stiff competition from the mighty Hearts Hibs and Dundee Utd to win the league.

I also agree with Dave, coefficient will crash without the OF and the league winner will have to start in the first qualification round for the champions league along with all the other small teams.

The sad fact is that the OF are Scottish football. They bring in the TV money and without them, revenues will plummet - TV and gates. I can't see clubs getting bigger crowds if the OF leave. The OF games are the only ones that get big crowds at Pittodrie.

OF games are the only ones to get crowds cause the standard of the rest of the teams is piss poor
when the OF leave the standard will improve IMHO and people will turn up to see good games

How will it improve with less funds, meaning poorer training facilities, and poorer youth academies?

because managers wont be filling there teams with crap over paid forgeiners

more fans would come into the game as games will have meaning where as now
the only thing they have to look forward to is getting to a final and coming 3rd

with poor youth systems,and managers not filling the team with players from over seas, it doesn't leave much tho does it. I do hope im wrong tho, as no doubt, a few old firm fans will head to some of the games up here if the OF are playing away at Brighton in the cup that day lol

the youth systems wont be so poor though and kids will get a chance in the first teams which they aren't currently getting
and they wont have the OF stealing all the better kids then letting them rot in the reserves as they are paying wages to over paid foreigners

so where would the money come from to maintain the youth systems, without any TV deals?

[boldie]

Yes the league will be more competitive without the OF but it hardly means anything. Winning the league will be just like getting third at the moment. I really don't think I would be dancing in the streets if Aberdeen beat off stiff competition from the mighty Hearts Hibs and Dundee Utd to win the league.

I also agree with Dave, coefficient will crash without the OF and the league winner will have to start in the first qualification round for the champions league along with all the other small teams.

The sad fact is that the OF are Scottish football. They bring in the TV money and without them, revenues will plummet - TV and gates. I can't see clubs getting bigger crowds if the OF leave. The OF games are the only ones that get big crowds at Pittodrie.

OF games are the only ones to get crowds cause the standard of the rest of the teams is piss poor
when the OF leave the standard will improve IMHO and people will turn up to see good games

How will it improve with less funds, meaning poorer training facilities, and poorer youth academies?

because managers wont be filling there teams with crap over paid forgeiners

more fans would come into the game as games will have meaning where as now
the only thing they have to look forward to is getting to a final and coming 3rd

with poor youth systems,and managers not filling the team with players from over seas, it doesn't leave much tho does it. I do hope im wrong tho, as no doubt, a few old firm fans will head to some of the games up here if the OF are playing away at Brighton in the cup that day lol

the youth systems wont be so poor though and kids will get a chance in the first teams which they aren't currently getting
and they wont have the OF stealing all the better kids then letting them rot in the reserves as they are paying wages to over paid foreigners

lol @over paid foreigners.. Foreign players are cheaper to buy than the overrated Scottish players (whom are snapped up by Celtic or Rangers after they've had one good season for a club like Hibs), this is why they go for foreign players...oh and obviously because they are generally speaking better than their Scottish counterparts.

[boldie]

Also..some current squads with nationalities (according to wiki).

where are all the over paid foreign players that managers "fill their squad with"?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aberdeen_F.C.#Current_squad

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dundee_United_F.C.#Current_squad

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hibernian_F.C.#First-team_squad

I would stick Hearts in there but I reckon we'd both agree that Hearts is not representative of the avarega Scottish club ATM

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Partick_Thistle_F.C.#Current_squad

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunfermline_Athletic_F.C.#Current_squad


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Livingston_F.C.#First-team_squad

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Falkirk_F.C.#Current_squad

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hamilton_Academical_F.C.#Current_squad

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kilmarnock_F.C.#Current_squad

I reckon the above lists show that Scottish players get plenty of chances to play...they're just not any good as the standard of coaching in Scotland, from youth level onwards, is terrible.

There are some very talented kids playing U16 footie at the moment but they get all the skill drilled out of them by the managers they have. Kids need to be managed and taught properly, and that's what's lacking at the moment. Obviously the standard of management with SPL clubs in general is shocking..but how would Rangers and Celtic leaving improve this? Rangers and Celtic are both struggling to find a decent manager FFS...what chance does Dundee Utd or Aberdeen have? Celtic, a team that'd pretty much guaranteed European footie every year can only bring in a man who got relegated with West Brom and is tactically completely naive.

What Scottish footie would need to be successfull (whether it'd be the national side or the SPL and other leagues) is investment in management and a complete cultural overhaul with regards to their attitude towards footie...it has nothing to do with over paid foreigners.

[Rod Paradise]

I actually believe Scottish football would thrive without them, the league suddenly becomes very competitive with the OF gone. I also think there would be more opportunity for young scots to make the break through. I think Scottish Football would win, the OF would win, I just really don't see what's in it for the EPL.

Totally agree. Seems most fans are more than happy to be waving goodbye to the OF. Thanks for nothing really, don't let the door hit you on the way out.

you need to remember that none of the other SPL teams would be where they are financially right now, if it wasn't for Us bringing in the Setanta Money (when they actually paid up) and ESPN Money. don't bite the hand that feed you.

but the crowds would be bigger and the games more intresting the league more competitive and the whole package more intriguing to the TV companies who at the moment are only intrested in the old firm and derbys

I only half agree with you TBH.

The part i agree with is that the league would defo becoming more competitive, and enjoyable for the fans of the SPL teams, but i disagree with the TV companies taking a new interest, i really don't see them being interested in showing (a newly competitive) Hearts v Aberdeen, than say West Ham v Everton even.

Yes Hearts, Hibs, Aberdeen, Dundee Utd etc will thrive and win the league, but they will only thrive in a desperate league which might not even gain entery into Europe anymore, if UEFA decide so once celtic and rangers leave (which i think will happen)

No Europe and no TV deals, how good will the league be?

Why would UEFA do that? They might well ban Rangers and Celtic from europe for not playing in their own domestic league a la the Welsh sides in England but the Scottish sides who remain will be more than welcome.

well if they do still let them compete in Europe it will be 10 times harder to get in due to the Coefficient, Celtic and rangers Co-eff's are majorly higher than hibs, aberdeen etc, and we struggle to make it through 1 or 2 rounds, with their C0-eff they will need to go through all three rounds, plus the play off round.

IMO they wont be competing in Europe.

I still think there wont be any TV deals tho, so very little money's coming in, meaning any young talent will still leave for Lower english leagues for better money

How is that any different to what is happening now to the non old firm scottish sides. The majority are still going through the qualifying stages of the Europa cup, if Rangers and Celtic leave the co-efficient will almost certainly drop but the clubs will also be finishing higher up the league/winning cups to qualify for the spot vacated by the old firm.

The implications of old firm's european future are a lot more concerning, what the old firm gain for being in the EPL they will also possibly lose european football leading to a situation where they couldn't financially compete with the big 4 in England.

I think there is more money to be made for being in the EPL than in the Champions league

In a BIG way, and it's guaranteed.

[sovietsong]

not really sure why this debate is happening, they wont be allowed in the premiership anyway...

[GreekStein]

not really sure why this debate is happening, they wont be allowed in the premiership anyway...

If they managed to get in they'd get relegated (cos they're crap) and then go back to Scotland.

[sovietsong]

not really sure why this debate is happening, they wont be allowed in the premiership anyway...

If they managed to get in they'd get relegated (cos they're crap) and then go back to Scotland.

if they started in league 2 they might make the play offs...

[Teacake]

not really sure why this debate is happening, they wont be allowed in the premiership anyway...

If they managed to get in they'd get relegated (cos they're crap) and then go back to Scotland.

Part of the proposal is that there is no relegation.

Yes they are both crap at the moment but both clubs would be able to attract much better players if they were part of the EPL due to the massive increase in revenue and the atrraction of playing in EPL and not the SPL.

[Boba Fett]

not really sure why this debate is happening, they wont be allowed in the premiership anyway...

If they managed to get in they'd get relegated (cos they're crap) and then go back to Scotland.

if they started in league 2 they might make the play offs...

For comments like this can you explain why in the last few years some Rangers rejects have been ripping up the Championship?

[Acidmouse]

not really sure why this debate is happening, they wont be allowed in the premiership anyway...

If they managed to get in they'd get relegated (cos they're crap) and then go back to Scotland.

if they started in league 2 they might make the play offs...

For comments like this can you explain why in the last few years some Rangers rejects have been ripping up the Championship?

who? the championship seems a high standard these days, most of the teams going up doing rather well for themselves.

I would love to see Rangers / Celtic each week down here, massive away support and better atmosphere at games

[Scottish Dave]

not really sure why this debate is happening, they wont be allowed in the premiership anyway...

If they managed to get in they'd get relegated (cos they're crap) and then go back to Scotland.

if they started in league 2 they might make the play offs...

For comments like this can you explain why in the last few years some Rangers rejects have been ripping up the Championship?

I have to disagree with this mate, they ain't rangers rejects, they were 1st team regulars that rangers didn't want to sell, but were forced to due to the Banks calling. Hence the reason they are ripping up as you put it