Hey ant..
This deep i by really want to make it any bigger. This guy in particular was a huge overly aggro fish.
Here Is a piece I wrote about as all 4bets in position.
Have been working on this for the last few days as no internet at home (moving house atm)
Don't want to post it all around the internet so regs can dominate me, so thought I'd post a thread here to keep it more internally for the poker farmers. Please give feedback
Min 4B - BU vs Blinds with a depolarized range
Example
I raise to 3bbs otb, bb 3bets to 10bb, i 4bet to 16/17 bbs.
First thoughts about this concept:
People will fold too much because they don’t want to play a 4B pot OOP
People will call too much, because they get a good price, with dominated hands
5B will be more likely especially when deep
I think this is very important to do this against a depolarized range otherwise they get too good price for set mining when they 3B PP or to call with SC etc…
1) Why is it good for bluffing
The bluff is very cheap. We put 14bb to win 13bb.
Since the bluff is cheap we might 4B PP like 22-99 and fold to a 5B
2) Why is it good for value
The whole idea behind it is to get dominated hands to call (that would fold to a normal 4B) and get some more value when they hit TP with worse kicker. In a 4B pot they would probably not fold it.
A) Tight 3B range: TT+,ATs+,KJs+,QJs,AJo+,KJo+
Let’s consider the following 3B depolarized range (8.9% - 118 combos) with 100bb:
TT+,ATs+,KJs+,QJs,AJo+,KJo+
Villain will 5B for value with (2.56% - 34 combos):
QQ+, AK
Villain will fold the following (2.71% - 36 combos):
ATs, KJs, QJs, AJo, KQo, KJo
Villain will call the following (3.62% - 48 combos):
JJ-TT, AQ, AJs, KQs
Villain will fold 30% of the time.
As can be seen from the calling range if we do this with AQ, AK every time there is a Q or a K on the flop we get great value.
Our min4B value range is:
QQ+, AQ+ (3.77% - 50 combos)
As a bluff we want our range to have maximum equity vs his calling range.
Our min4B bluffing range should be:
22-99, 56s-JTs, 86s-T8s (6.33% - 84 combos) with which we have 41% equity vs his calling range. I don’t think we should be min4Betting with Axs bc his calling range contains loads of A so we want a better kicker.
So our min4B range would be 10% with 2/1 ratio bluff/value
I) Post flop play
Villain will call the following (2.41% - 32 combos):
JJ-TT, AQ-AJ, KQ
1) Low boards
With our bluffing range we will probably pick up some equity so we CBet
With AK,AQ I think we should Check back because TT and JJ is not folding and he will
fold all his worse hands. Hands that we can get value from if the turn brings a Q or a K.
With QQ+ we want to CBet to get value from TT-JJ that would bluff catch.
2) A high boards
He has 53% of the time an A. So we can Cbet small and it would be profitable. If he calls the CBet we give up
With AK,AQ value bet.
3) K or Q high board
With AK or AQ Value bet
With the rest Check back and give up.
Sizing of the CBet. On the flop there is 35bb in the pot. We CBet 15bb for value and as a bluff. We then have 68bb on the turn into a 65bb pot so we can shove with our value hands. We could also Check back some of the time to balance when we Check our bluffing range.
II) EV of min4B
When villain 5B we 6B (or call if 5B is a shove) with QQ+,AK
EV= when he folds + when he 5B and we fold (75% of the time) + when he 5B and we call (25% of the time) + the EV of when he calls
EV= 0.3*13+ 0.29*[0.75*(-14)+0.25*(0.5*(27)-14)] + EV when he calls
EV= +0.82 + EV when he calls.
As seen in the post flop play section, when he calls this is very profitable because we get massive value on K and Q high boards, take the pot down almost always on low boards and we give up and not invest more than the 4B in the other situations.
So overall I think that this is a very profitable move.
When deep 5B/Fold will become an option. It doesn’t necesseraly mean that the min4B is bad but I will have to think about it more.
B) Loose 3B range: 99+, A8s+, A5s-A2s, K9s+, Q9s+, J9s+, ATo+, KJo+, QJo
Let’s consider the following 3B depolarized range (14.78% - 196 combos) with 100bb:
99+, A8s+, A5s-A2s, K9s+, Q9s+, J9s+, ATo+, KJo+, QJo
Villain will 5B for value with (2.56% - 34 combos) (17% of the time):
QQ+, AK
Villain will fold the following (4.22% - 56 combos):
A8s, A5s-A2s, K9s, Q9s, J9s, ATo, QJo
Villain will call the following (7.99% - 106 combos):
JJ-99, AQs-A9s, KTs+, QTs+, JTs, AQo-AJo, KJo+
Villain will fold 28% of the time.
Our min4B value range could be the following:
QQ+, AJ+, KQ (6.18% - 82 combos)
With this value range we dominate all his Kx,Qx and Jx type of hands.
As a bluff we want our range to have maximum equity vs his calling range.
Our min4B bluffing range could be:
88-22, A5s-A2s, 56s-T9s, 86s-J9s (7.09% - 94 combos)
This range is slightly wider than in the tight 3B range example because he will 3B A2s-A5s and fold them so I think we should have them in our bluffing range. Apart from this it is the same range made of SCs, PPs, and 1sGappers
with which we have 42% equity vs his calling range.
So our 4B range is 13.27% - 176 combos with about 1/1 ratio bluff/value.
I) Post flop play
Villain will call the following (7.99% - 106 combos):
JJ-99, AQs-A9s, KTs+, QTs+, JTs, AQo-AJo, KJo+
1) Low boards
With our bluffing range we will probably pick up some equity so we CBet
With AJ+ I think we should Check back because 99-JJ is not folding and he will fold all his worse hands. Hands that we can get value from if the turn brings J, Q or K.
With QQ+ we want to CBet to get value from TT-JJ that would bluff catch.
2) A high boards
He has 37% of the time an A.
With our bluffing range we can Cbet small and it would be profitable. If he calls the CBet we give up (even with our A2s-A5s). It is even more profitable than in the tight 3B range example because villain has less A in his range.
With AJ+,AA value bet.
With QQ and KK we should Check back because he is not folding Ax and we are ahead of the rest.
3) K, Q or J high board
With AJ+ Value bet
With the rest Check back and give up.
Sizing of the CBet. On the flop there is 35bb in the pot. We CBet 15bb for value and as a bluff. We then have 68bb on the turn into a 65bb pot so we can shove with our value hands. We could also Check back some of the time to balance when we Check our bluffing range.
II) EV of min4B
When villain 5B we 6B (or call if 5B is a shove) with QQ+,AK
EV= when he folds + when he 5B and we fold (% of the time) + when he 5B and we call (% of the time) + the EV of when he calls
EV= 0.28*13+ 0.17*[0.81 * (-14) + 0.19*(0.5*(201)-100)] + EV of when he calls
EV= +1.625 + EV when he calls
As in the previous example the beauty of the min4B move is that we get great EV when he calls so it is overall greatly +EV
I didn’t include any 5B bluff here. But what we have to keep in mind is that with 100bb there is no 5B/Fold so I think that ppl will probably have an honest 5B range – 5B bluffing range could be 99-TT (in which case we have to 6B JJ+,AK)
This will dramatically change if we are 150bb and I will not cover this as it gets very complicated.
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