The Best In The Business

[dwayne110]

I'm only disappointed at 'dissapointed'... K, now we can move on...

[pleno1]

posting adam took over my account for a plo8 comp is one thing, i can understand it to some extent.

posting "it makes me wonder who was on the account in all the other binks" or however you rephrased it is taking the fucking piss.

[pleno1]

also, you dont need to apologise to me, you need to apologise to adam aswell.

[peejaytwo]

Partick, i'm glad you've proved me wrong, i was never adamant that my suspicions were true. I've had a couple PM's about what ive done here and know its the wrong way about making accusations.

  I shouldnt be asking about your integrity on an open forum, but what led to what i wrote is an understanding that i would've been happy to be proved wrong. I know full well your ability in poker is superior to 99% of us. My decision to post was based on your un-enthusiastic plo8 report which felt to me like a guilt trip, i couldnt understand why you wouldnt of been ecstatic to final and chop a major in a game you play very infrequently. I obviously looked too deep into it. I dont think you've looked arrogant in your replies, you stand your ground for what you know is right. I know money is power and it can lead towards unfair practice in any type of business. I hope you dont think im a complete ass for questioning your integrity because i love the game so much aswell. I respect the hard work you've put into this game to get to your position, but as you will understand its very easy to see where i was coming from, or maybe not. i dont know.



I'm not going to try defending my previous posts, i can accept being in the wrong happily.

So Patrick and Adam i apologise for doubting your mad skills

Prev page Patrick

[SuuPRlim]

Hmm, see what you're saying Dave but I disagree with your general point. Regardless how ghosting is defined, if you ask your mate for advice in a hand and on the basis of that advice make your decision, it's cheating.

I wasn't making a point, I was just saying that the way people define "ghosting" is wrong, I know 100% the way I defined it is in line with pokers T&C because I was with someone who works for stars security at the time and asked him, just wanted to point out exactly what the accusation was as It seemed to me pretty certain people were confused.

Would I like it to be impossible for people to ask there mate mid hand what to do? YES.
Is it possible to police that? NOT IN THE SLIGHTEST
Do I actually think its that big of an issue? NO

I get grimmed and btn'd 20 times an hour online and there is actually ways to police that, so I'd much rather people put there efforts sorting that out.

[buzzharvey22]

I'm not dissapointed or annoyed at any of you guys to have been proven wrong here. I find the immaturity of others accusing me to try ruin his rep on grounds of being jealous or beacuse i dont win tons of money pretty rofl. there was no ulterior motive behind my question's to pads. i was very curious and was not afraid to ask. Albeit the wrong way.

lol aye you were just curious

[NEWY]

Partick, i'm glad you've proved me wrong, i was never adamant that my suspicions were true. I've had a couple PM's about what ive done here and know its the wrong way about making accusations.

  I shouldnt be asking about your integrity on an open forum, but what led to what i wrote is an understanding that i would've been happy to be proved wrong. I know full well your ability in poker is superior to 99.99999999999999999 % of us. 

So Patrick and Adam i apologise for doubting your mad skills

FYP

[tikay]

The first thing you've done wrong here is misunderstand "ghosting" as a term, ghosting is when one person has teamviewer up, or someone sat behind them telling them what to do at virtually every decision; open this, 3bet that, fold here, ICM says we can't open this and so on - you don't need to be sat next to someone to ghost them and I would imagine 95%+ of ghosting that has happened in the world has been done in proxy.

If pads is playing a PLO8 tourney, and happens to be sat next to someone who is a very good PLO8 tourney player and every so often turn to him and says "god Kevin (well call him Kevin lol) I gotta fold this right?" And Kevin has a quick look and says "that guy the preflop raiser yh? If so yh you gotta fold" and turns back to his own games then there is absolutely nothing in the world wrong with that.

The be "ghosting" someone you have to be watching the whole time, be aware of the build up in dynamics and the pattern of game flow, just occasionally taking an 11 second break from 14tabling to glance at someone's screen and offer some basic advice once every 2 hours isn't anything remotely close to ghosting.

I can promise you a HELL of a lot of legit ghosting and MAing went on over scoop.

As for all the rando Uk accounts in the scoop main, a lot of German/Scandinavia/Russian heros have accounts located in the UK, tax reasons and all that. Martin Jacobson for e.g.

Now that the dust has settled, & nothing to do with what was alleged about Patrick, can I ask you to explain that please, Dave? (or anyone else).

You've explained "ghosting", but what is "legit Multi-Accounting", please?

Perhaps I misread it, but nobody, or almost nobody, seemed to challenge that statement. What am I missing?

[Marky147]

I'd guess that Lil' Dave was just saying that lots of MAing, and 'legit ghosting', rather than both were legit.

[tikay]

I'd guess that Lil' Dave was just saying that lots of MAing, and 'legit ghosting', rather than both were legit.

Oh, I see, yes, just confusingly phrased. (To me, anyway).

So if we KNOW lots of players are or were Multi-Accounting, were these players reported, or did we all just look the other way?

[Junior Senior]

The first thing you've done wrong here is misunderstand "ghosting" as a term, ghosting is when one person has teamviewer up, or someone sat behind them telling them what to do at virtually every decision; open this, 3bet that, fold here, ICM says we can't open this and so on - you don't need to be sat next to someone to ghost them and I would imagine 95%+ of ghosting that has happened in the world has been done in proxy.

If pads is playing a PLO8 tourney, and happens to be sat next to someone who is a very good PLO8 tourney player and every so often turn to him and says "god Kevin (well call him Kevin lol) I gotta fold this right?" And Kevin has a quick look and says "that guy the preflop raiser yh? If so yh you gotta fold" and turns back to his own games then there is absolutely nothing in the world wrong with that.

The be "ghosting" someone you have to be watching the whole time, be aware of the build up in dynamics and the pattern of game flow, just occasionally taking an 11 second break from 14tabling to glance at someone's screen and offer some basic advice once every 2 hours isn't anything remotely close to ghosting.

I can promise you a HELL of a lot of legit ghosting and MAing went on over scoop.

As for all the rando Uk accounts in the scoop main, a lot of German/Scandinavia/Russian heros have accounts located in the UK, tax reasons and all that. Martin Jacobson for e.g.

Now that the dust has settled, & nothing to do with what was alleged about Patrick, can I ask you to explain that please, Dave? (or anyone else).

You've explained "ghosting", but what is "legit Multi-Accounting", please?

Perhaps I misread it, but nobody, or almost nobody, seemed to challenge that statement. What am I missing?

I do sometimes think my posts are invisible. Maybe thats the problem with being a nobody.
I challenged this earlier and would like it qualified

[tikay]

The first thing you've done wrong here is misunderstand "ghosting" as a term, ghosting is when one person has teamviewer up, or someone sat behind them telling them what to do at virtually every decision; open this, 3bet that, fold here, ICM says we can't open this and so on - you don't need to be sat next to someone to ghost them and I would imagine 95%+ of ghosting that has happened in the world has been done in proxy.

If pads is playing a PLO8 tourney, and happens to be sat next to someone who is a very good PLO8 tourney player and every so often turn to him and says "god Kevin (well call him Kevin lol) I gotta fold this right?" And Kevin has a quick look and says "that guy the preflop raiser yh? If so yh you gotta fold" and turns back to his own games then there is absolutely nothing in the world wrong with that.

The be "ghosting" someone you have to be watching the whole time, be aware of the build up in dynamics and the pattern of game flow, just occasionally taking an 11 second break from 14tabling to glance at someone's screen and offer some basic advice once every 2 hours isn't anything remotely close to ghosting.

I can promise you a HELL of a lot of legit ghosting and MAing went on over scoop.

As for all the rando Uk accounts in the scoop main, a lot of German/Scandinavia/Russian heros have accounts located in the UK, tax reasons and all that. Martin Jacobson for e.g.

Now that the dust has settled, & nothing to do with what was alleged about Patrick, can I ask you to explain that please, Dave? (or anyone else).

You've explained "ghosting", but what is "legit Multi-Accounting", please?

Perhaps I misread it, but nobody, or almost nobody, seemed to challenge that statement. What am I missing?

I do sometimes think my posts are invisible. Maybe thats the problem with being a nobody.
I challenged this earlier and would like it qualified

Your Post was not invisible to me, I saw it & noted it. Nobody else picked up on it though, & I was rather hoping they would, to save me having to ask!

Perhaps modern day poker ethics have moved on, & I've been naive, but the statement by Dave really shocked me, & more so that almost nobody challenged it.

[Boba Fett]

I'd guess that Lil' Dave was just saying that lots of MAing, and 'legit ghosting', rather than both were legit.

Oh, I see, yes, just confusingly phrased. (To me, anyway).

So if we KNOW lots of players are or were Multi-Accounting, were these players reported, or did we all just look the other way?

Impossible to prove by players. A few big name Americans didn't play any scoops and it's probably more believable that they are playing on some random Russian account than not playing SCOOP at all but you can't really call them out without proof. Ghosting will most certainly have happened lots with the money up for grabs, but it's almost impossible for the random person to work out who is being ghosted and by who. Obv the people involved will never speak out.

[Junior Senior]

Agreed. I feel totally out of touch with the online world that i feel the only way i can truly trust i am in a straight game is to play live where the playing field is somewhat more levelled. No huds, no multi accounting, ghosting etc. at least live i would pick up any dodgy behaviour immediately.

[tikay]

I'd guess that Lil' Dave was just saying that lots of MAing, and 'legit ghosting', rather than both were legit.

Oh, I see, yes, just confusingly phrased. (To me, anyway).

So if we KNOW lots of players are or were Multi-Accounting, were these players reported, or did we all just look the other way?

Impossible to prove by players. A few big name Americans didn't play any scoops and it's probably more believable that they are playing on some random Russian account than not playing SCOOP at all but you can't really call them out without proof. Ghosting will most certainly have happened lots with the money up for grabs, but it's almost impossible for the random person to work out who is being ghosted and by who. Obv the people involved will never speak out.

Yes, I get all that, but Dave said he could PROMISE it was happening, which suggests he KNEW.

I absolutely agree, 100%, we should not "call out" people without proof. There is of course a mountain of difference between "evidence" & "proof". Informing 'Stars of reasonable suspicions is not "calling out" though.

I'm more asking about MA-ing than ghosting, as it seems to me the latter can never be satisfactorily proven, as the line between "legit" & "non-legit", as already explained by several, is a very fine line.