AK Preflop decision 1/2 live cash

[geeforce1]

we have to be 100% certain the old guyc alls though right

nope

[cambridgealex]

I think the young guy would jam his QQ and AKs here instead of 4betting. I guess its possible he knows I'll think that this small 4bet looks super strong so might fold AK or QQ eg but seems unlikely he's on that level.

Fwiw I was folding if the old guy folded but with the chance to get my whole stack in vs him, I jammed.

[GreekStein]

I think the young guy would jam his QQ and AKs here instead of 4betting. I guess its possible he knows I'll think that this small 4bet looks super strong so might fold AK or QQ eg but seems unlikely he's on that level.

Fwiw I was folding if the old guy folded but with the chance to get my whole stack in vs him, I jammed.

I fold vs kid one, he has to have it but the older guy means we just shouldn't fold.

[SuuPRlim]

Give the young guy a ridic tight range (I dont think the small 4b has to be stronger than a jam here)

Hand 0:    42.819%     28.08%    14.74%          14424809      7571040.00   { AcKh }
Hand 1:    57.181%     42.44%    14.74%          21802231      7571040.00   { JJ+, AQs+, AKo }

Assume the old guy folds (nut result) we're geting 138 to win 465 so we need ~29% and lets not forget that we couldbe in much much better shape than this stove

Now trying give the old guy a range this might be ay off IDK


Hand 0:    27.771%     19.49%    08.28%         331889965    140911143.17   { AcKh }
Hand 1:    44.024%     37.23%    06.80%         633809995    115687294.67   { JJ+, AQs+, AKo }
Hand 2:    28.205%     25.55%    02.66%         434934302     45243768.17   { TT-77, AJs-ATs, KQs, AQo+ }

so we're getting 308 to win 1063 so we need ~ 28% but bearing in mind I think these two examples are the worst shape we'll be in unless you have a reason for not wanting to gamble here seems like a stndard get in to me

[smashedagain]

i hope what is coming here is that the kid has QQ and the old boy has AK also. i can never understand why AK is played so strong and has got you in a spot of bother here with basically ace hi. none the less in the current climate AK is deemed strong enough to 3 and 4 bet with and the main excuse is "fml i ran into AA/KK must be a cooler or i run  so bad i  lost a flip". as the better player i am sure its to your advantage to keep the pot small and play post flop poker. hence flatting seemed the sensible move to me....this way you stack off mr A9 when the A flops unless obv he makes two pair (thats run bad or mini cooler). or if the flop aint to your likeing you get away on the cheap n wait for a better spot.  your 3 bet is i assume to try get either to fold but my rule #1 is you cant make idiots to fold so all your bet is doing is increasing the pot for guys to lick their lips and go "its all mine. £2/£5 here we come." only my opinion and lil dave was not consulted in making any part of this statement.

[cambridgealex]

Young guys ranger should be tighter, old guys wider imo. Fist pumping if the young guy has qq or ak here after the small 4b. Only getting it in cos of old guy.

[Skippy]

Young guys ranger should be tighter, old guys wider imo. Fist pumping if the young guy has qq or ak here after the small 4b. Only getting it in cos of old guy.

Your 3bet size is a bit bigger than standard. More like £32 rather than £42, methinks.

[SuuPRlim]

i hope what is coming here is that the kid has QQ and the old boy has AK also. i can never understand why AK is played so strong and has got you in a spot of bother here with basically ace hi. none the less in the current climate AK is deemed strong enough to 3 and 4 bet with and the main excuse is "fml i ran into AA/KK must be a cooler or i run  so bad i  lost a flip". as the better player i am sure its to your advantage to keep the pot small and play post flop poker. hence flatting seemed the sensible move to me....this way you stack off mr A9 when the A flops unless obv he makes two pair (thats run bad or mini cooler). or if the flop aint to your likeing you get away on the cheap n wait for a better spot.  your 3 bet is i assume to try get either to fold but my rule #1 is you cant make idiots to fold so all your bet is doing is increasing the pot for guys to lick their lips and go "its all mine. £2/£5 here we come." only my opinion and lil dave was not consulted in making any part of this statement.

Jason, AK is one of the best hands you can get, so why you wouldnt wanna build a big pot with it I dont know. for example Im advocating a get in here with AKo but would be saying TT is an easy fold

[cambridgealex]

I think there were 2callers of the original £8, so between 35 and 45seemed standard. Dw Jason, I didn't think for moment that lildave had been consulted before you wrote that! Two different ways of thinking here though. I prefer to 3bet because they will call with lots of worse hands, so that is how we get value from our hand. With the initiative we can also bluff them off medium/small pairs if the flop comes qxx jxx txx for example, as well as winning much bigger pot on axx or kss vs dominated hands.

[cambridgealex]

Edit: Kxx

[smashedagain]

i hope what is coming here is that the kid has QQ and the old boy has AK also. i can never understand why AK is played so strong and has got you in a spot of bother here with basically ace hi. none the less in the current climate AK is deemed strong enough to 3 and 4 bet with and the main excuse is "fml i ran into AA/KK must be a cooler or i run  so bad i  lost a flip". as the better player i am sure its to your advantage to keep the pot small and play post flop poker. hence flatting seemed the sensible move to me....this way you stack off mr A9 when the A flops unless obv he makes two pair (thats run bad or mini cooler). or if the flop aint to your likeing you get away on the cheap n wait for a better spot.  your 3 bet is i assume to try get either to fold but my rule #1 is you cant make idiots to fold so all your bet is doing is increasing the pot for guys to lick their lips and go "its all mine. £2/£5 here we come." only my opinion and lil dave was not consulted in making any part of this statement.

Jason, AK is one of the best hands you can get, so why you wouldnt wanna build a big pot with it I dont know. for example Im advocating a get in here with AKo but would be saying TT is an easy fold

AK is in a bad place against these two imo dave. i see no end of guys stacking off with AK in bad shape (AA KK) or racing (any pair) dave. please note the use of brackets to help you dave not often they are stacking off against AQ or AJ (unless an A flops but then as i pointed out you can even stack off A9). i h8 racing but still take the 22 over AK heads up

[cambridgealex]

But you talked about 3betting. Would you not even 3bet AK? Not saying get it in, but to one raise, would you not re(back)raise?

[TheFallen]

i wouldnt be very happy finding myself in the position Alex wound up and in a lot of situation when UTG (tightish player) opens and only one person calls then flatting AK is the best play.

In this situation it is ridiculous to not want to pump up the pot and isolate the fish this deep. The point of 3betting is for the fish not to fold but to put us in a position where its possible to win his whole stack.

It worked out weird as utg doesnt jam and fish smooth calls, both these things happening is v unlikely and if either of them does not happen then it is pretty simple. Going on about how people over play AK and it not being a made hand etc etc just seems like results orientated selective memory to me. AK is constantly putting us in position where we are winning so much more money in other ways when we 3 or 4 bet with it that it easily covers infrequent losses to AA/KK. 


fwiw i dont know what u do now. Best guess is the old guy has 77-JJ or AQ and were crushed by UTG. I very quickly try and decide whether old guy sigh folds if we jam.

[pleno1]

Yeah when we 3bet the fish usually folds, calling in position and playig a pot WITH the fish in is good strategy imo.

[DMorgan]

Happy to get it in vs young guys QQ with £102 of dead money in there

Defintely not giving the old guy credit for being able to flat QQ+/AK twice pre, we always have him crushed equity wise either by him having a worse Ax or Kx or by us getting great odds on a flip vs QQ and his 99/TT