An Ape and a notebook, how long will it take?

[jgcblack]

Ok, after having watched this unfold over the day let me take these on one by one.

even i could multitable 10 tables playing nothing but 10/10/2 and win ... its not hard, its not playing streets and playing poker.  That's just being a super nit and waiting for people to spazz.

If its that easy, just do that and print money LDO

Anyone want to bet that I can't beat 50nl right now??? (albeit with a super nitty style)

Willing to lay 3 to 1 over a 100k sample.

I'm fairly confident that if I played just QQ+/ AK and 25% of btn's I could make a profit at 50nl over 50-100k sample.  I would neither enjoy the game nor enjoy the tiny amount of money that would gravitate to me in that time. 

I enjoy the complexities of the game, and when I make a good call with tp on a scary board or even A high in a decent spot - i know that is money that my 'skill' has allowed me to gain.  Winning AA vs AK aipf is sigh at best and meh at worst.  I do not want to play poker for that.

Although I love the use of 'bullsh*t man...' one of my most favourite moments of the tv series.

[jgcblack]

Ill bet that yeah. In order to be able to win at the highest levels you have to understand the game well enough to adjust to various games in terms of making money. "Poker" is maximising your ev as much as possible at every given decision point.

It's like saying that football is about who does the most extravagant tricks/skills during a game, it isn't it's who scores most goals.

I've not looked at the hands yet. Will do now

As usual sir, I thank you for your comments and input. 

I am trying to maximise my EV in these situations and at this level. 

I HAVE come to realise that Pat and the rest of you are correct about the bet,bet,bet line with folding to raises very often at 10 and 25nl.  I was trying to be too clever too often in too many kinds of spots.  However, using that 'clever' in some % of the spots is not only correct but more optimal than the 'programmed' lines the regs take.

1. river is a bit gross... c/f probably
2. not really sure what ur trying to achieve by jamming turn. picked up pretty strong SDV, call again
3. wp, ul
4. definitely fold pre under any circumstances. like postflop until river. Why are we jamming now?
5. why are we jamming the river?! as a guideline if unsure on the river. closing our eyes and jamming entire stack in not option 1
6. spew. not repping anything. fold turn if not flop
7. prob fine ul
8. cant imagine this is a standard get in at 25nl. could be wrong though
9. 4betting pre seems a bit disastrous, ok it seems like the cold caller is a fish but ur crushed by the 3bettors range even
10. ul
11. definitely raise flop, definitely jam turn, this is 25nl you have a straight on a wet board. FPS is not a good idea
12. spew
13. close to fold pre? turn feels like a fold. not 100% tho
14. definitely 3b pre. tough spot now.
15. meh
16. why?
17. bad get in, flat pre, most likely fold to the 4bet if not
18. if u need to raise this flop go bigger to give yourself a more favourable SPR for the turn
19. dont actually mind this that much
20. ul

I agree with much of the above.. and thanks again for your time and effort.

[Pugwashed]

I'm fairly confident that if I played just QQ+/ AK and 25% of btn's I could make a profit at 50nl over 50-100k sample.  I would neither enjoy the game nor enjoy the tiny amount of money that would gravitate to me in that time.  

I enjoy the complexities of the game, and when I make a good call with tp on a scary board or even A high in a decent spot - i know that is money that my 'skill' has allowed me to gain.  Winning AA vs AK aipf is sigh at best and meh at worst.  I do not want to play poker for that.

Although I love the use of 'bullsh*t man...' one of my most favourite moments of the tv series.

But you could play a lot more hands and make a lot more money by playing more hands to the point that you might enjoy it.

Some advice based on some observations (whatever its worth): Try to think in terms of relative hand strength rather than absolute hand strength, this seems to be a huge problem and leads to you making some bad value bets / calls (hands 1/2/4/5). And going all in because you're not sure what else to do is not a good excuse. It also seems like you have a problem getting drawn into silly leveling wars (hand 8/12) that probably only exist in your head, when you get into those spots just try to focus on playing your hand / range well and let them make mistakes against you (its hard for you to go wrong doing that) (this last part is definitely something I used to have a problem with aswell)

[rfgqqabc]

I HAVE come to realise that Pat and the rest of you are correct about the bet,bet,bet line with folding to raises very often at 10 and 25nl.  I was trying to be too clever too often in too many kinds of spots.  However, using that 'clever' in some % of the spots is not only correct but more optimal than the 'programmed' lines the regs take.

Its simply not more optimal at these stakes to do some of the crazy things you've shown in these hand histories.

"However, using that 'clever' in some % of the spots is not only correct but more optimal than the 'programmed' lines the regs take."

It is simply not necessary to do the things you are trying to make profitable. There is no need for perfect balance, no need to have the 20% gs/bdfd range Pat has when he b/3bs. Just cut all the spew out, focus on playing super tight and making profitable plays. Cut out the fps shit, it is not needed. Your throwing mud at a wall and hoping it sticks. When you learn that playing the sexy Pads way of 30/27/19 is only sexy when it is profitable, and that its not how poker has to be played. Sitting down, being a nit, playing 14/14/5 and making money is a million times better for everyone involved. Your making microstakes hold'em look like brain surgery. Employ the tight hammer to crack the nut, stop trying to be Robin Hood shooting an apple off his friends head.

[jgcblack]

1. river is a bit gross... c/f probably
2. not really sure what ur trying to achieve by jamming turn. picked up pretty strong SDV, call again
3. wp, ul
4. definitely fold pre under any circumstances. like postflop until river. Why are we jamming now?
5. why are we jamming the river?! as a guideline if unsure on the river. closing our eyes and jamming entire stack in not option 1
6. spew. not repping anything. fold turn if not flop
7. prob fine ul
8. cant imagine this is a standard get in at 25nl. could be wrong though
9. 4betting pre seems a bit disastrous, ok it seems like the cold caller is a fish but ur crushed by the 3bettors range even
10. ul
11. definitely raise flop, definitely jam turn, this is 25nl you have a straight on a wet board. FPS is not a good idea
12. spew
13. close to fold pre? turn feels like a fold. not 100% tho
14. definitely 3b pre. tough spot now.
15. meh
16. why?
17. bad get in, flat pre, most likely fold to the 4bet if not
18. if u need to raise this flop go bigger to give yourself a more favourable SPR for the turn
19. dont actually mind this that much
20. ul

My turn..

I am going to try and reason/ explain my thought process during these pots.

Firstly I will point out that
MevAsani is  a MASSIVE whale and as a result I took a LOT of big (i mean BIG) betting lines vs him.  Over a good couple of hours I managed to completely map his game down to only a few completely solid lines that I didn't see him deviate from once.


1 Vs Mev and I am sure that this will be good vs him over a decent sample.  He WILL be calling here with the following range:-
Jx/ Qx/ AA/ Kx/ all two pair combinations/ all sets/ flushes and straights

However what I should have done vs him because of his raising tendancies would be to bet 18 and fold to a raise.  This is because his raising range is so tight and this river completes a lot of draws.

2 I'll be honest, in this pot I was a little lost on the turn.. thought the guy 'could' be repping the A but could also have AQ/ QQ+ and it seems like a decent bluffing card.
tbh a decent part of me thought that he could actually have AA.

3 meh - standard.

4 As mentioned above Mev is a big fish and I was watching him yo-yo up and down as a result of bad beat after value hand after beat.  I saw a video once that mentioned that 'fish' have a timer over their head in games like this.. and I was sure I was the only one really noticing his tendancies and adjusting to them.  So I decided a 'good' reaction to this would be that I wouldn't 'pussyout' of being oop vs him but i would chose hands that can 'flop well' vs his 'call any' paired hands and can seem innocent vs my expected perception of his range and reactions. (he has a very solid bet sizing tell, even on the scariest boards i could happily fold some very strong hands)

5 vs Mev again and in pots vs him I'm trying to make tp or better and bet until raised.. in this instance I shape the pot sizes deliberately to make a <pot sized shove otr.  I'm not playing this hand any other way vs him.  As you see he called down with what ended up being a weak 2p on a straight and flushing board.. he would also have called down here with any 10 and possibly an 8.

6 In my head I'm repping a set vs a relatively competent player, he'd shown that he would react to preflop and flop aggression but had been extremely honest on rivers.  Iirc he actually bet folded a river on a very scary board where he couldn't have been bluffing but I couldn't reasonably rep a lot - in this instance i had top set but seeing him fold there made me do this.  (i was calling flop and turn with potentially the best hand.. the river line was due purely to his narrow value range, esp one that can withstand a raise).

7 I flat pre because I'd discussed flatting AK pre in some situations (mostly IP) in order to extract extra value from people with AJ/ AQ/ KQ type hands because I find a LOT of people at this limit will fold these to a 3bt and won't get out of line with them pre.  However once I setup a squeeze spot for a reg and he takes it, I have a much stronger hand than I am supposed to and it plays very well vs the range of both of them.

8 Honestly can't remember this one.. however I DONT 4b/call 88 pre as standard.  Something must have happened to make me think he was taking off pre. Obv once i 4bt a pair, I'm not folding - even if QQ+ AK is his stack off range I'm ok.  This hand from him is unusual at these levels which proves im right about him being lighter than most.. in this case he had a hand that was 'just' good enough.

9 vs Mev and a random who decides to spazz pre... I almost never see people have AK here.. they always have 66-JJ and obv Mev has almost atc.. in this spot this hand is absolutely fine and in fact the presence of Mev gets me paid so much more when they have any reasonable range.

10 sigh.. feel like ive been on this side of these more than the other... nvm

11 We're three handed, what hands can he have that want to get any kind of money in preflop? I 'slow' play in this instance because of that.. obv he has the one hand that makes no difference.  Anyone saying anything other than 'sigh ul' is being an arse imo.

12 No idea why i did this, i can only assume I was thinking 'blockers innit' AND he must have been pretty aggro preflop.

13 In retrospect I hate this.. at the time I couldn't think of any kind of value range that made sense.. its like only 22.

14 I didn't want to 3bt and lose my customer from a short stack.  Once a reg squeezes I (yet again) have a much stronger hand than I'm supposed to and since I'm happy to 4bt/get in JJ pre btn vs BB I don't love or hate this hand.

15 Same a previous hands, not 3bting AK some times so i can have a stronger range in single raised pots.  Is this terrible?

16 I'm trying to represent a very strong hand, such as KK/ AA here and as so few people cold 4bt, I often see people either just snap fold, or get a little stubborn to the flop with 77-JJ.  In this spot when he leads I expect him to have <AJ ALL THE TIME.  I don't expect him to fold QQ, i expect him to get that in pre.  Therefore vs the range I thought he would have I expect a 'donk/fold' here a suprisingly large % of the time.
I know that some of you will laugh at that saying "he only has $13 behind".
However I have seen them do this and fold when I have had the AA.... (so what did they have then?)

17 getting 10's in pre vs an aggressive reg might not be amazing but it can't be horrid. (don't love it though, i will admit)

18 Definitely need to work on my sizings.. I realise the flop is too small now.
No idea what I was doing on the turn.. guess I thought he could have and possibly fold AJ here some % - and we gots lots of outs.

19 Like this a lot and think the ****er got stupidly lucky to turn and river pairs... he definitely folds if he doesn't river 2p. mbn to smash a river in a sick spot.

20 sighhhh.....


so there we are...

I definitely think that Stato and Pugwashed's comments are fair in a vacuum but a lot of these hands were me trying to extract the max from a particular fish with a little spew rolled up.



What do we think now?  Any differences?  Did anyone even notice a lot of hands were with or involved Mev?

#flamegrilledhereicome

[jgcblack]

I'm fairly confident that if I played just QQ+/ AK and 25% of btn's I could make a profit at 50nl over 50-100k sample.  I would neither enjoy the game nor enjoy the tiny amount of money that would gravitate to me in that time.  

I enjoy the complexities of the game, and when I make a good call with tp on a scary board or even A high in a decent spot - i know that is money that my 'skill' has allowed me to gain.  Winning AA vs AK aipf is sigh at best and meh at worst.  I do not want to play poker for that.

Although I love the use of 'bullsh*t man...' one of my most favourite moments of the tv series.

But you could play a lot more hands and make a lot more money by playing more hands to the point that you might enjoy it.

Some advice based on some observations (whatever its worth): Try to think in terms of relative hand strength rather than absolute hand strength, this seems to be a huge problem and leads to you making some bad value bets / calls (hands 1/2/4/5). And going all in because you're not sure what else to do is not a good excuse. It also seems like you have a problem getting drawn into silly leveling wars (hand 8/12) that probably only exist in your head, when you get into those spots just try to focus on playing your hand / range well and let them make mistakes against you (its hard for you to go wrong doing that) (this last part is definitely something I used to have a problem with aswell)

Thanks for all your comments and time mate. I really appreciate them.

Sometimes it feels like im the 'runt' of the litter on blonde and that its just me looking at this mess of a diary, really helps when I get constructive criticism (tl900).

To your comments above -
Going all in is not a confusion reflex.  It was done in spots where I think I can represent a bluff but have a strong hand and want the maximum pennies.

It's definitely hard to tell about the levelling wars sometimes, but when I see people reacting to my aggression I want to be the one to adjust in the best way, I obviously still struggle with this.  Sometimes it is definitely in my imagination, other times I've caught people out in their aggression vs me and proved im right about adjusting (but we're not analysing hands I won or played well i know that).

I do however agree with a lot of your points and im not 100% A game yet, however I've noticed such a massive improvement in my A B and C games, with my C now being better than my A was when I started.  There are however still some serious leaks that result/ cause some big pots.  And no matter how good my A game is, it is hard to win big pots very often.... however it is relatively easy not to lose big pots - if i behave.

[jgcblack]

I HAVE come to realise that Pat and the rest of you are correct about the bet,bet,bet line with folding to raises very often at 10 and 25nl.  I was trying to be too clever too often in too many kinds of spots.  However, using that 'clever' in some % of the spots is not only correct but more optimal than the 'programmed' lines the regs take.

Its simply not more optimal at these stakes to do some of the crazy things you've shown in these hand histories.

"However, using that 'clever' in some % of the spots is not only correct but more optimal than the 'programmed' lines the regs take."

It is simply not necessary to do the things you are trying to make profitable. There is no need for perfect balance, no need to have the 20% gs/bdfd range Pat has when he b/3bs. Just cut all the spew out, focus on playing super tight and making profitable plays. Cut out the fps shit, it is not needed. Your throwing mud at a wall and hoping it sticks. When you learn that playing the sexy Pads way of 30/27/19 is only sexy when it is profitable, and that its not how poker has to be played. Sitting down, being a nit, playing 14/14/5 and making money is a million times better for everyone involved. Your making microstakes hold'em look like brain surgery. Employ the tight hammer to crack the nut, stop trying to be Robin Hood shooting an apple off his friends head.

perfect post mate +1.

thanks.

It's not easy to stop myself doing but I am trying and I AM improving. 



It's just tough some times.


I've done my best to get other people involved in sweats and coaching sessions BECAUSE I know I need to employ certain control measures.  I have the power to win, but i need to control it and let it out a little at a time.  The nights I've won the most I've been super stead, played well and run good... but most importantly in ALL of my big winning sessions there is a little downswing where I try to get 'clever' too much and realise it and cut it out quickly.... then its green and up all the way.

That is why I want and often 'need' to talk to someone or watch or be watched... to almost give me that feeling of 'being watched' so that I do behave and when I do -

I am a winning poker player at these levels.

[jgcblack]

Without this wanting to come across incorrectly or unfairly I obviously need to 'talk' to Pat to find out what he thinks/ feels and what he wants to do.

If he wants to cut his losses and say that enough **** is enough then that is obviously fine.  I don't want this as I know that when "its worth" his time, that working with him will be fun, challenging, and profitable.  But I have made some mistakes and have violated his trust by not moving back down again when I should have (its irrelevant that I 'did' move up and down as agreed over a few months).

If he wants to 'teach me a lesson' to prevent anything further like this happening then I guess there are ways we can do that
- earn X bi's @ 10nl (a stake I've proved I can beat)
- play X hands @ 10nl irrelevant of how much I win (to just 'bulldozer' the point into my thick skull)
- other..

If he wants to continue on and try again with no difference (unlikely) then I am happy to do that with this lesson and 'embarrassment' being quite the slap on the wrist.  And being so public it does make it tough.  It's irrelevant that I'm having a little bit of stress in my normal life, this is all separate and it doesn't affect me.

What I do need from him, you (mate) is more communication.... I've really tried a lot to get hold of you over the past month, and I know its been a particularly trying month in your life and I've been completely understanding of that.  But I do need more than I've had, which to be honest is not a lot. 

We don't talk on a regular basis, we don't do sessions of any kind on a regular basis whether all 3 of us small stakes grinders are here or not we need to... and I'm fairly confident that all three of us would be earning you more $$ than we are if we had. 

I hope this doesn't come across wrong but I have to hurry as I'm picking up C from 'roller derby' in 10 mins. 

I'll be online all night for all to see, speak to...


(john.black.grinder on skype)

[Eso Kral]

Never ever feel that you are "the runt of the litter" you are one of many characters that make the forum what it is.

Yes some people check in to see the "JB spew" but you also get so many hero's here trying to help and I cant think of any other diary that gets that mate, everyone knows about your passion for the game and how you really really want to succeed and deep down I reckon most ppl do as well.

<3 JB

[tikay]

"...Sometimes it feels like im the 'runt' of the litter on blonde and that its just me looking at this mess of a diary....."

That is so wrong John.

LOTS of us read every Post on here, I certainly do.

I do not comment on your play though, there is no point - enough people, far better than I at the game, give you enough good advice, again & again.

I do confess - & I mean this in a constructive way - at being utterly baffled at your mindset.

I can win fortunes easily by playing A-B-C, but that is no good, I want to be a flare player.

I cannot grasp that, nor do I want to in truth. It makes no sense to me, & to many others, none whatsoever. Before you can run, you have to learn to walk.

I also think that "attitude" & "respect" might help. You seem to classify almost all the villains as "fish". And yet you are struggling to beat them.........

Now you know why I read your Diary, but never comment, because you don't want to hear that, & you'll disagree.

No reply necessary, & this is all said with good intent, wholly.

[jgcblack]

Never ever feel that you are "the runt of the litter" you are one of many characters that make the forum what it is.

Yes some people check in to see the "JB spew" but you also get so many hero's here trying to help and I cant think of any other diary that gets that mate, everyone knows about your passion for the game and how you really really want to succeed and deep down I reckon most ppl do as well.

<3 JB

Hey mate, thanks. Much appreciated.

[jgcblack]

"...Sometimes it feels like im the 'runt' of the litter on blonde and that its just me looking at this mess of a diary....."

That is so wrong John.

LOTS of us read every Post on here, I certainly do.

I do not comment on your play though, there is no point - enough people, far better than I at the game, give you enough good advice, again & again.

I do confess - & I mean this in a constructive way - at being utterly baffled at your mindset.

I can win fortunes easily by playing A-B-C, but that is no good, I want to be a flare player.

I cannot grasp that, nor do I want to in truth. It makes no sense to me, & to many others, none whatsoever. Before you can run, you have to learn to walk.

I also think that "attitude" & "respect" might help. You seem to classify almost all the villains as "fish". And yet you are struggling to beat them.........

Now you know why I read your Diary, but never comment, because you don't want to hear that, & you'll disagree.

No reply necessary, & this is all said with good intent, wholly.

Not at all sir, thanks for both your comments and thoughts.

I agree that I 'label' people a lot, I do however think I try to say 'this was vs a good reg' or 'i think this guy thinks, so i thought x y and z'.

Definitely need to work on that more, but I believe I'm at least on the right path in the right direction with regard to all of that.  The comment a page or so ago about David Amos and his play is a testament to that and how my thought processes have changed over these few months.

I have spent very little time in your company but have read a lot of your thoughts about a wide variety of subjects and yet to find a problem, flaw, disagreement with much of what I've read and interpreted.  You seem like a very sharp and down to earth person... despite being on TV and all that.

thanks again

[jgcblack]

Ok, after having watched this unfold over the day let me take these on one by one.

Although I love the use of 'bullsh*t man...' one of my most favourite moments of the tv series.

really do love this gif

[pleno1]

I HAVE come to realise that Pat and the rest of you are correct about the bet,bet,bet line with folding to raises very often at 10 and 25nl.  I was trying to be too clever too often in too many kinds of spots.  However, using that 'clever' in some % of the spots is not only correct but more optimal than the 'programmed' lines the regs take.

Its simply not more optimal at these stakes to do some of the crazy things you've shown in these hand histories.

"However, using that 'clever' in some % of the spots is not only correct but more optimal than the 'programmed' lines the regs take."

It is simply not necessary to do the things you are trying to make profitable. There is no need for perfect balance, no need to have the 20% gs/bdfd range Pat has when he b/3bs. Just cut all the spew out, focus on playing super tight and making profitable plays. Cut out the fps shit, it is not needed. Your throwing mud at a wall and hoping it sticks. When you learn that playing the sexy Pads way of 30/27/19 is only sexy when it is profitable, and that its not how poker has to be played. Sitting down, being a nit, playing 14/14/5 and making money is a million times better for everyone involved. Your making microstakes hold'em look like brain surgery. Employ the tight hammer to crack the nut, stop trying to be Robin Hood shooting an apple off his friends head.

perfect post mate +1.

thanks.

It's not easy to stop myself doing but I am trying and I AM improving. 

where are the signs of improvement? every 20 hands there are 5 big spews, as they were from day 1. the a4/kq are as bad as any hand from the first day.

[pleno1]

on phone btw incase keyboard spazzing