Issues Arising from Staking

[The Camel]

As I said at the start of this, I was basically thinking out loud.

Just feels like there have been quite alot of disputes and arguments recently.

I don't *know* a staking board mod would solve this, but it felt like a decent shot at a solution.

One day, there might be a dispute like the T May affair on 2+2, which involves tens of thousands of pounds.

That could get really nasty.

[titaniumbean]

I don’t favour the idea of staking mods but have enjoyed reading the debate. Any member should be free to put up whatever they like and see if it sells. What the board does need though is fair impartial comment. If negative comment is passed on a current thread it’s akin to somebody walking around with a placard outside your business putting customers off. Who would take kindly to that? Especially if another business benefits from free advertising. Suddenly the market isn’t fair.

What the board needs is a protocol section where staking issues are discussed to find a general consensus of conduct. Horses can be rated on various criteria including profitability and reliability. Before I go & watch a film or a show, or book a restaurant, or go on holiday I find it helpful to log onto rating websites and get a broad spectrum of opinions. Sites like eg rotten tomatoes produce an overall rating for films. This approach is better than one or two people offering opinions because a) maybe those opinions have an agenda and b) they are just singular opinions.

Actually this isn't a bad idea.

It hardly seems a good idea.




This is really hard for me to make my point without naming people or 'types' of threads........


NO OFFENCE BUT....etc



how do threads with no money invested by the OP get rated?

ratings will depend on who is voting and their relationship with OP. are we having a popularity contest or is everyone guesstimating just how +ev they are?

remember that most people seem to have little or no idea what is going on half the time with regards to markup and the possibility of actually knowing someones true lifetime live ROI how profitable the stake was etc.

[TightEnd]

One day, there might be a dispute like the T May affair on 2+2, which involves tens of thousands of pounds.

That could get really nasty.

Yes but blonde provides a service for buyers and sellers and stays at arms length (flaming apart) We don't charge a fee/take a commission, it stays entirely non-commercial and we don't get involved if it goes wrong -  unless the mods decided that a forum ban is necessary.

caveat emptor. Not asking you to suck eggs Keith, but for inexperienced people do your research, exercise caution, don't stake money you can't afford to lose. If in doubt don't do it

Same advice as always

[The Camel]

One day, there might be a dispute like the T May affair on 2+2, which involves tens of thousands of pounds.

That could get really nasty.

Yes but blonde provides a service for buyers and sellers and stays at arms length (flaming apart) We don't charge a fee/take a commission, it stays entirely non-commercial and we don't get involved if it goes wrong -  unless the mods decided that a forum ban is necessary.

caveat emptor. Not asking you to suck eggs Keith, but for inexperienced people do your research, exercise caution, don't stake money you can't afford to lose. If in doubt don't do it

Same advice as always

Hmmm I wonder if Alex has considered this with his site?

Assuming his site takes a fee, if someone gets scammed, would the site/Alex be open to legal action from the wronged party?

[MC]

All this discussion seems a bit unnecessary.

The staking boards have been around for ~4 years and only one or two issues have really arisen in that time out of hundreds of threads.

[The Camel]

All this discussion seems a bit unnecessary.

The staking boards have been around for ~4 years and only one or two issues have really arisen in that time out of hundreds of threads.

I can think of 4 issues in the last month! (And another one is likely to hit the front page very soon, I believe)

[TightEnd]

One day, there might be a dispute like the T May affair on 2+2, which involves tens of thousands of pounds.

That could get really nasty.

Yes but blonde provides a service for buyers and sellers and stays at arms length (flaming apart) We don't charge a fee/take a commission, it stays entirely non-commercial and we don't get involved if it goes wrong -  unless the mods decided that a forum ban is necessary.

caveat emptor. Not asking you to suck eggs Keith, but for inexperienced people do your research, exercise caution, don't stake money you can't afford to lose. If in doubt don't do it

Same advice as always

Hmmm I wonder if Alex has considered this with his site?

Assuming his site takes a fee, if someone gets scammed, would the site/Alex be open to legal action from the wronged party?

don't know Keith

I do know that before we set up staking boards on here we had long discussions on what they should look like, what the position of blonde should be

We felt by far the best approach then was to be at arms length, and make it explicit what we would mod, and what a wronged member could not come to us for. Namely redress

You could argue with justification that the staking boards on here now are more sophisticated in their proposals, certainly involved larger sums of money. Very happy to expand templates if needed in light of this

Less convinced personally that a system of self regulation needs to be replaced by regulation. Can be convinced, but not yet I'm not

Taking it a stage further, the highest profile problem on here was Blatch, which was not actually on the staking boards. Financials apart, that ended not with us banning Blatch, but he's never posted since. Self-Regulation in action, namely he's banned himself, probably very sensibly

[titaniumbean]

All this discussion seems a bit unnecessary.

The staking boards have been around for ~4 years and only one or two issues have really arisen in that time out of hundreds of threads.

I can think of 4 issues in the last month! (And another one is likely to hit the front page very soon, I believe)

are any of them situations that couldn't have been avoided by a more thoroughly worded proposal?

[MANTIS01]

I was thinking more feedback scores from backers about their experience with a stake rather than just randoms. Like ebay feedback. So eg if a backer doesn't get paid the horse has a logged negative feedback score. I don't know why just one person's opinion would be better than everybody's opinion. But if you wanted a single opinion it would still be available to you in that format.

[TightEnd]

I was thinking more feedback scores from backers about their experience with a stake rather than just randoms. Like ebay feedback. So eg if a backer doesn't get paid the horse has a logged negative feedback score. I don't know why just one person's opinion would be better than everybody's opinion. But if you wanted a single opinion it would still be available to you in that format.

I like this idea. A feedback thread on stakers on which anyone can post with + or - rep.

[The Camel]

All this discussion seems a bit unnecessary.

The staking boards have been around for ~4 years and only one or two issues have really arisen in that time out of hundreds of threads.

I can think of 4 issues in the last month! (And another one is likely to hit the front page very soon, I believe)

are any of them situations that couldn't have been avoided by a more thoroughly worded proposal?

Yes.

2 for sure, probably 3.

[pleno1]

Can I put forward PokerStrategy.coms perspective or will it be deleted? It works well and has had 4.3m posts in the forum..

we have a page where somebody makes a thread, in the thread they have to follow a basic guideline but it is not too strict, they also have to have 300 posts. The board is left open, but if they dont have 300 posts the thread is deleted if they make another one, they are blocked.

They have to include at least one reference, which is usually vouching for the guy.

They then have to have a feedback thread which is a seperate thread and in this thread they give updates and stakees talk about it there is any problems etc.

[The Camel]

I was thinking more feedback scores from backers about their experience with a stake rather than just randoms. Like ebay feedback. So eg if a backer doesn't get paid the horse has a logged negative feedback score. I don't know why just one person's opinion would be better than everybody's opinion. But if you wanted a single opinion it would still be available to you in that format.

I like this idea. A feedback thread on stakers on which anyone can post with + or - rep.

The other side should have right of reply obv.

[TightEnd]

I was thinking more feedback scores from backers about their experience with a stake rather than just randoms. Like ebay feedback. So eg if a backer doesn't get paid the horse has a logged negative feedback score. I don't know why just one person's opinion would be better than everybody's opinion. But if you wanted a single opinion it would still be available to you in that format.

I like this idea. A feedback thread on stakers on which anyone can post with + or - rep.

The other side should have right of reply obv.

It's happened on here with Guy, to choose a current one

[titaniumbean]

I was thinking more feedback scores from backers about their experience with a stake rather than just randoms. Like ebay feedback. So eg if a backer doesn't get paid the horse has a logged negative feedback score. I don't know why just one person's opinion would be better than everybody's opinion. But if you wanted a single opinion it would still be available to you in that format.

'ty shipped will back again' in response to money being paid out is the same thing though right? that's what I do.


you could deffo incorporate the stars on the left under a persons name to equate to how many stakes have been done without hiccups/how much physical dollar has been paid out to give people 'a guide' to what to expect.



If you open a thread of someone you know is a twatty grimmer and yet you subscribe to your 'cant post bad stuff' how are other people going to know about this person? I think all threads should be open to people posting good/bad feedback and criticism, questions with regards to markup and reasoning and gentle well meaning flames.  Anyone who obviously trolls threads will be called out on it, that's how flaming works!


Keith what sort of issues are you talking about specifically?