Issues Arising from Staking

[The Camel]

Surprised we never have had a thread discussing some of the issues surrounding staking.

Here's a couple of grey areas, which I think we should have "standard" rules so everyone knows where they stand before a disagreement arises.

1. Foreign Exchange fees.

A horse cops 100,000 Euros. The current xe.com rate means this is £78,525. However, when the horse gets the money transferred to his bank, he only receives £75,000. Who should swallow this difference?

2. Tips.

The horse who cops 100k Euros decides to tip 2500. Should the backer pay his share of the tip?


FWIW, I think the staker should swallow the difference in point 1, but the horse should give the backer the chance to receive full payment in the currency he won the money in.

Point 2, I think the player is responsible for tips and should not deduct tips from payment.

(I once swapped with a very rich guy, and he ended up winning the tournament and tipped 10%!! And deducted this from my share.. needless to say I wasn't very happy, but felt it would be cheap to complain)

Any thoughts of either of these two?


I am sure there are plenty of other issues that sometimes arise.. please post any so we can get a "standard" procedure for horses and backers.

[Longy]

Ha point 2 reminds of "wazz" charging his stakers for massages when he binked EPT san remo (i think).

[rfgqqabc]

Impartial moderator is really needed. I admire James Keys work here, but its been self nominated and he has a vested interest as he sells/buys action regularly. The dreenie thread pissed me off. If other people disagree i wouldn't have a problem, i just think it needs discussing. Here seems like a good place.

@dreenie, v good staking proposal, glglgl

no graphs or links and charging a mark up - i got caned for that

good to see you are consistant

I took it to mean she was a decent prospect with a probable return on investment Guy

This.

And pleno playing the 100r at all is a bad idea for most players due to skill and/or bankroll limitations.

Oh so you just have free reign to insult who you wish on the staking boards then?

I see

Cool

[MPOWER]

Point 2, I think the player is responsible for tips and should not deduct tips from payment

I have heard of players who cash in EPT/ Overseas Events being almost bullied into giving tips. Have you heard anything similar?

Just a thought for the inexperienced player who does not know the form regarding tipping/or NOT tipping.


Regards

M.
  

[Karabiner]

In point two, fictional horse is over-tipping imo, 1% is generally enough.

[The Camel]

Point 2, I think the player is responsible for tips and should not deduct tips from payment

I have heard of players who cash in EPT/ Overseas Events being almost bullied into giving tips. Have you heard anything similar?

Just a thought for the inexperienced player who does not know the form of tipping/Or Not tipping.

Regards

M.
 

Yes. When Thomas Kremser was in charge of the EPT players (especially inexperienced ones) were definitely bullied into tipping (although this was in the days before a % was taken out for the staff).

I think any event where a % is kept, you shouldn't tip unless a member of staff has done something beyond the call of duty to help you.

[The Camel]

In point two, fictional horse is over-tipping imo, 1% is generally enough.

He's not fictional and he did tip 10%.

He had no idea of the norm.

[The Camel]

Impartial moderator is really needed. I admire James Keys work here, but its been self nominated and he has a vested interest as he sells/buys action regularly. The dreenie thread pissed me off. If other people disagree i wouldn't have a problem, i just think it needs discussing. Here seems like a good place.

@dreenie, v good staking proposal, glglgl

no graphs or links and charging a mark up - i got caned for that

good to see you are consistant

I took it to mean she was a decent prospect with a probable return on investment Guy

This.

And pleno playing the 100r at all is a bad idea for most players due to skill and/or bankroll limitations.

Oh so you just have free reign to insult who you wish on the staking boards then?

I see

Cool

I think this is an excellent idea.

I've weighed in with my thoughts on a couple of threads recently and probably just succeeded in pissing people off.

A neutral, impartial moderator of the staking board would be great imo.

[Woodsey]

1. Staker should suck it up. Maybe stakee should put a proviso in his proposal and as long as there is evidence of what rate he got there should be no argument.

2. Stakee sucks it up.

[DMorgan]

#1 Buyers should be swallow their %age of the fees. Everyone knows going into the stake that should there be a big bink there will be associated costs with getting the money to UK bank accounts

#2 I think Keys' method of treating tips the same as above but letting people anonymously opt out if they really want to is probably the most accommodating method. I'd prefer to name and shame the nits though

As for %age tips, if its already taken out of the prize pool I'd tip 1% max.

[smashedagain]

I most be going soft .

1. Stakee can't help xchange and obv wants to get cheapest for himself as well. Other than paying in euros what else can they do. If £75k goes into his bank this is what he won so divide accordingly IMO.

2. Tips are expected and once again as long as it ain't too balla then once again pay out on net.


But this is easy for me to say as I stake 1% of the people on here that Keith does.

[pokerfan]

Point 2, I think the player is responsible for tips and should not deduct tips from payment

I have heard of players who cash in EPT/ Overseas Events being almost bullied into giving tips. Have you heard anything similar?

Just a thought for the inexperienced player who does not know the form of tipping/Or Not tipping.

Regards

M.
 

Yes. When Thomas Kremser was in charge of the EPT players (especially inexperienced ones) were definitely bullied into tipping (although this was in the days before a % was taken out for the staff).

I think any event where a % is kept, you shouldn't tip unless a member of staff has done something beyond the call of duty to help you.

He told me 5% was customary, I said you can have 1.
Most others let him have it afaik, but I was the only Yorkshireman 

[NigDawG]

1. shouldn't be on the horse to swallow exchange rates

2. staker shouldn't have to tip anything if they do not wish to

[pleno1]

Keys appeared massively out of lone in the Dreenie tread and whilst e probably doesnt care his opinion holds no value in staking threads anymore with his conduct there. He was possibly right in regards to guy but bring it up elsewhere.

I actually think tipping for massages is a lot more reasonable than tipping. Usually the comps take a % out for themselves ak tipping would be a huge nono. We were treat like shit in Marbella and I think Alex/Petes donation showed that. Maybe next year they will be more tolerant of us.

Massages though could really be a no difference between pay jumps, it can be a huge part of being relaxed and optimising performance, perhaps this should be though about in the mark up price. If I bought at 1.1 off somebody then I'd maybe feel sifferebt than somebody who I bought off at 1.6 although it really shouldn't make a difference of course.

I just want to point out one more thing regarding markups. Generally good players will be a lot writer at making deals and getting the nut outcome, should probably be factored
In to some extent regarding Mu even if very small.

[The Camel]

The problem with point 1 is dealing with someone who isn't financially savvy.

I once bought a share in someone who took the money in cash and went down to his local Post Office to change it up.

Obviously the nut worst way of changing money.

It was like giving up nearly 10% of the bink.