What's happened to Poker?

[kinboshi]

Just received an email from PokerPlayer, the first paragraph reads:

It's been a busy week for poker pros around the globe, with three of the games hottest and most exciting young talents each signing major sponsorship deals. Tom Dwan and Viktor Blom now find themselves team-mates as the pair join Gus Hansen at the soon to be relaunched Full Tilt, while tournament and high-stakes specialist Isaac Haxton has finally bitten the bullet and joined PokerStars.

I'm interested in what sort of returns that will bring for the companies in question.  Help them retain players? Help them get new players? 

[TightEnd]

FTP wants to be the home of nosebleed stakes again, Dwan and Blom are pretty necessary to be seen to be on the site for that to happen

(presumably FTP TV formats are on their way, starring these guys, as an acquisition tool)

[AlunB]

Yeah Blom and Dwan are no brainers for FTP's brand.

Haxton is Team Online, which is quite different to Team Pro.

[ShatnerPants]

Now I know nothing about poker.

But I think some of you proper players are getting this from the wrong angle.

If any sport is televised it helps the image of the whole game to have cheery, perky doods in front of camera. You might not get paid for it, but the more interesting poker is seen to be on TV, the more it will attract new blood. Look at how important image right are to football clubs attracting young kids to their clubs - little Johnny doesn't necessarily support his Dad's team anymore, it's all about Supporting Rooney or Walcott (even if he can't actually play the game) because they are the guys they see on TV, in the mags, posing in the adverts, and in the shop windows.

And to say there is no new potential out there is wrong, wrong wrong. How many teenagers play video games? How many nowadays do it interactively online?

They would love to play online poker, they just don't know it yet.

And as a recreational player, I love watching the 'set up' TV shows, and recently the best of those has been Pokerstars' Big Game, with the loose cannon. Minimise the analysis, mike up the players and encourage the banter, let the game speak for itself, and

best of all, you have the minnow with that once in a lifetime chance to make a fortune.

You might call it dumbing down, I find it compulsive viewing.

Ok so they are the American staple players, but Doyle, Negreanu, Hellmuth and Tony G, with youngsters like Galfond and Scott Sievers, and a sprinkling of William Reynolds and Lex Veldhuis and you have good poker AND plenty of characters. Oh, and Rousso adds another dimension as well

There must be a similar makeup of talent available over here - They have Doyle, we have Tikay, you lot supply the rest. (I'd vote for Liv Boeree as one option ) Then let me sit with them, make an arse of myself, so comparing their good play with my donkey moves can be entertaining and informative.

Then give the teenagers/early 20s the chance to win online to get on TV with a £20K stake or whatever..........then you have

Good TV, good poker, good banter, and you are attracting new blood as well.

Cue the cheerleaders.

     

[DaveShoelace]

I don't really see the value in in signing Blom. Anyone who knows who he is already has a Stars and Tilt account and have already made their decision of where to play. The same can be said of 99.99% of sponsored pros, but at least Dwan is on TV a lot and does interviews etc.

Yes Blom attracts rail birds but they are railing the nosebleed games no matter what and most if them are broke anyway.

[AlunB]

I don't really see the value in in signing Blom. Anyone who knows who he is already has a Stars and Tilt account and have already made their decision of where to play. The same can be said of 99.99% of sponsored pros, but at least Dwan is on TV a lot and does interviews etc.

Yes Blom attracts rail birds but they are railing the nosebleed games no matter what and most if them are broke anyway.

I think it's probably more of a brand decision than a strict ROI one, but I have no knowledge either way. Also it's worth noting the Scandi market is still a huge one.

[smurf]

maybe this question needs a thread of its own but surely i can not be the only one thinking it.

Why the f@#k have pokerstars bought fulltilt?

it just doesn't make business sense...online poker players don't have one account, they have several...so when fulltilt went tits up the following happened...1) they joined other sites namely the most reknown that was pokerstars or 2) they went bust and didn't play.

so what can pokerstars possibly hope to achieve by stumping up the cash to reimberse fulltilt players???

what'sthe odds that 90% of fulltilt players also use pokerstars and also what are the odds that those with big deposits just withdraw them and raise a glass saying 'praise the lord' i didn't expect to see that again.


no matter how i look at it i can't see why on earth they did it...buy a competitor and honour the deposits just (it seems) to get a list of players that they are likely to find is much the same as their own.

And if it was to persuade the American government to legalise the game then surely this could have happened with or without this crazy move.

[smashedagain]

Yeah Blom and Dwan are no brainers for FTP's brand.

Haxton is Team Online, which is quite different to Team Pro.

ffs so this is the type of player MC is up against for Team Online.

[iangascoigne]

Genuine shortage of interesting creative commentators who can make the game come alive and keep the audience entertained.

[smashedagain]

Genuine shortage of interesting creative commentators who can make the game come alive and keep the audience entertained.

you did a most excellent job. I am really suprised how good Tighty is in the Jesse May / anchorman role. He has been excellent with every guest, of which there had been quite a mix.

[edgascoigne]

Genuine shortage of interesting creative commentators who can make the game come alive and keep the audience entertained.

Subtlety ftw

[Royal Flush]

maybe this question needs a thread of its own but surely i can not be the only one thinking it.

Why the f@#k have pokerstars bought fulltilt?

it just doesn't make business sense...online poker players don't have one account, they have several...so when fulltilt went tits up the following happened...1) they joined other sites namely the most reknown that was pokerstars or 2) they went bust and didn't play.

so what can pokerstars possibly hope to achieve by stumping up the cash to reimberse fulltilt players???

what'sthe odds that 90% of fulltilt players also use pokerstars and also what are the odds that those with big deposits just withdraw them and raise a glass saying 'praise the lord' i didn't expect to see that again.


no matter how i look at it i can't see why on earth they did it...buy a competitor and honour the deposits just (it seems) to get a list of players that they are likely to find is much the same as their own.

And if it was to persuade the American government to legalise the game then surely this could have happened with or without this crazy move.

Two major reasons you touched upon, firstly to get favour with the US government. More importantly though imo they have bought the only site that has come close to them, much rather they own it that someone else comes along and buys the number 2 brand with (what a large majority of players believe) to be the market leading software.

As Johnson once said about Hoover, "It's probably better to have him inside the tent pissing out, than outside the tent pissing in."

[Dave 1961]

For poker to evolve and to attract a consistent audience worldwide then the way broadcasting works must change. Sponsors (who will be vital in ensuring a financial future) will need to see much better value from their investment and the public must receive a more entertaining experience. This will not come from within the industry (Pokerstars may be the exception but even this is unlikely). As I am sure everyone is aware the investment in players, tours, broadcasting and in poker in general has been massively reduced and even if the US switches on there will not be a large cash injection in poker anytime soon. The money from Full Tilt will give a short term boost but is unlikely to change the general direction that the industry is presently going.
The balance between skilfully played hands, table chatter and crazy antics is difficult to capture and though I agree that the game has been dumbed down to much the antics of Hevad Khan went way too far.
There are many people in the industry that produce entertaining shows, though many of these are targeted at a core audience that is steadily shrinking and comprises more of the devout than the recreational player.
However there are many companies working on new initiatives and trying to attract new players and sponsors into the game. This is a massive industry that has been badly managed and portrayed, the constant flow of negative press over the last five years and the poorly managed PR by many of the main operators has put off many organisations from considering associating their brands with the game. In the last year however attitudes have started to change and some of these organisations are now in discussions with several different parties with a view to supporting certain events and broadcasts. The quality of on line viewing and the reduction in costs of producing a show has encouraged investment and will result in several groups trying to produce new content via WebTV. This in turn will reach a wider audience and encourage new players and followers. TV shows are not likely to grow as the rate of change to viewing via your Ipad or PC has meant that everyone has had to adapt quicker than originally forecast. This has opened up the opportunity for more liberal shows were player’s comments and style will not be censored in the same way as if it were showed through TV.
I believe that there is a great future in the industry and hope that the coming year sees poker grow again. I am confident that new characters will emerge and that this helps encourage a new wave of players that play both recreationally and professionally.

[AndrewT]

There have always been 'many companies working on new initiatives and trying to attract new players and sponsors into the game' - they generally fail.

Come back to us when someone has arranged the Tesco Big Poker Tournament - till then it's just hot air.

[Dave 1961]

There have always been 'many companies working on new initiatives and trying to attract new players and sponsors into the game' - they generally fail.

Come back to us when someone has arranged the Tesco Big Poker Tournament - till then it's just hot air.

Come to Prague and see for yourself