Hand dead - ruling

[doubleup]

Is the substantial action rule what is being applied here? I know that's the rule for preflop (no misdeal after substantial action), but is it different here?

If not it's even more absurd. Then Bill bets and Bob snap folds, then Jennys hand is also dead?!

Yes that's my point.



 

[Junior Senior]

I, like Matt wasnt necesarily blaming the dealer. I was merely affirming the assertion that in general, alot of dealers dont concentrate enough or marshall the table well enough. And, yes it tilts the shit out of me too.

[George2Loose]

I think Dtd aside they're often not given sufficient training or cba cos they're working on a zero hour contract for minimum wage and generally treated like plebs

[theprawnidentity]

So the conclusion is that if you're seat 2 and this kind of action happens behind, it's in your interests not to say anything?  Pretty sure if I'm seat 2 with 'the nuts' then I'm keeping quiet anyway.

[AdamM]

FWIW the dealer wasn't the 'watch the TV' type, but she was a little distant and quiet. Looked a bit like she wasn't exactly thrilled to be there.
She wasn't aware that Seat 2 had been missed until he spoke up.

The action was described to the TD without reference to the speed, he ruled it dead, a few people, player 2 included then mentioned how fast it happened and the TD did look like he would like to have undone his ruling, but once it's out of their mouths, TDs rarely take anything back, and I understand that. Don't want to look indecisive or open to negotiation.

I think, if I remember right, when seat 2 said "I haven't acted yet, the dealer snap-called "FLOOR!" and I think seat 2 did try and say something like "no, it's ok, never mind" perhaps just intending to crack on but it was too late. It certainly wasn't seat 2 asking for a ruling.

[jakally]

I think the common sense ruling in this spot is to take seat 2's inaction as a check, and to give seat 4 a gentle telling off, when the hand is finished.
If seat 2 was facing a bet, the situation is very different, and they gain a big advantage by seeing action behind.

[Gemini Kings]

I have seen this 'hand dead' rule enforced in these circumstances but it should be changed.

If the dealer couldn't stop the action unfolding how is seat 2 supposed to. If he is first to act he couldn't expect players behind him to act out of turn.

This clearly means this rule is open to cheating. From the description of this hand it appears to all be genuine mistakes but the following situation could easily be adopted by two colludimg players.

Seat 2 raises pre flop and two friends call behind. While seat 2 is contemplating the size of his cbet one friend bets and another calls or raises. Under this rule they are guaranteed the pot. Crazy.

By comparison it's very hard to angle shoot from seat 2's position.

This rule is Not in the interests of a fair game.