The UK Politics and EU Referendum thread - merged

[DaveShoelace]

This was my fave funny of the day

https://vine.co/v/5BLLdaVLwHJ

[DungBeetle]

this is another FT one

probably get derided by some but here it is

Click to see full-size image.

Given all the tinpot degrees that sprung up because Blair wanted to vastly increase university participation, isn't a graph based on degree holders pretty similar to a graph based on age?  (i.e. a much bigger percentage of young people have degrees irrespective of intelligence)  

[arbboy]

Anyone getting sick of listening to this 'the kids knew 73% voted remain, the baby boomers have ruined it for the future etc'.  Since when has the youth of today suddenly been so clued up about since big decisions that they have got it right and everyone else who is more experienced in life has got it so badly wrong?

As a "young" person I would like to chime in. Quite clearly the vote was very close and the nation has been divided. The single thing that annoys me about this whole campaign is that such a gross proportion of people that voted "leave" don't know what they are voting for. Nobody has a fucking clue what is going on at the moment, there is just lots of skepticism.

In response to what I have said above, I think the smarter vote is to remain because of the uncertainty. That is literally the only reason I would vote remain, I cannot distinguish the bullshit and propaganda from the truth among the campaigning so it feels way too risky to change something so great, especially when there is no immediate threat in our country.

When I woke up this morning, I hoped for terrible things to happen in the future just so I can say "told you so", but I don't think the public that voted leave is at fault at all. People are quite compassionate about their own country (rightly so) and feel the need to stand up for themselves in some way.

I wasn't including guys like you Dan in the 'kids' group.  It was 18-24 age group which had 73% remain.

[TightEnd]

this is another FT one

probably get derided by some but here it is

Click to see full-size image.

Given all the tinpot degrees that sprung up because Blair wanted to vastly increase university participation, isn't a graph based on degree holders pretty similar to a graph based on age?  (i.e. a much bigger percentage of young people have degrees irrespective of intelligence) 

could be, hadn't thought of that. so maybe the correlation is irrelevant

degrees ain't what they used to be...polys became unis etc etc?

[arbboy]

Surely impossible for Scotland not to get another Vote to leave now surely?  Given over 60% voted remain in the EU surely they would be favs to leave the UK now if they had another vote?

http://www.oddschecker.com/politics/british-politics/scottish-politics/date-of-next-scottish-referendum

4/6 looks a cracking price if you didn't have to tie up your cash for a few years.

[JohnCharver]

Anyone getting sick of listening to this 'the kids knew 73% voted remain etc'.  Since when has the youth of today suddenly been so clued up about since big decisions that they have got it right and everyone else who is more experienced in life has got it so badly wrong?

it just reflects that by and large they are optimistic, multi-cultural, inclusive..only ever known the eu, broad based immigration etc. so likely to vote remain

it just so happens that there is a big contrast under 30s and over 60s, in part borne of life experiences broadly (suppression of wage growth, changed industries due to globalisation, changed communities etc etc)  as some older voters hark back to a different time

and a bigger set of voters seem to be cynical about elites, politics etc...a cynicism (possibly correct) and scepticism (certainly widespread) which the young voters (generalising) don't have yet

Wouldnt those willing to gamble be the more optimistic? See the old constantly being described as negative couldnt their vote be described as a vote that we deserve better than the clearly floored EU and that the young have no idea there is something better as theyve never known anything else? Isnt the older voters life experience a far greater a factor in being in a good position to make a decision compared to someone whos done little more than 17 years of school?

How floored can a system be where britain constantly votes in MEPs who want little more than to be out of a job?

[TightEnd]

^ agreed. i am a unionist but its tough to argue they shouldn't go and have a mandate to do so

ruth davidson v nicola S will be a hell of a scrap though

--

anyone been reading about the nationalist implications of the Ireland border, and the tensions that might stoke up from not having free movement north/south/north?

an unintended consequence for almost all leave voters i am sure, but scary stuff

[mondatoo]

Anyone getting sick of listening to this 'the kids knew 73% voted remain, the baby boomers have ruined it for the future etc'.  Since when has the youth of today suddenly been so clued up about since big decisions that they have got it right and everyone else who is more experienced in life has got it so badly wrong?

As a "young" person I would like to chime in. Quite clearly the vote was very close and the nation has been divided. The single thing that annoys me about this whole campaign is that such a gross proportion of people that voted "leave" don't know what they are voting for. Nobody has a fucking clue what is going on at the moment, there is just lots of skepticism.

In response to what I have said above, I think the smarter vote is to remain because of the uncertainty. That is literally the only reason I would vote remain, I cannot distinguish the bullshit and propaganda from the truth among the campaigning so it feels way too risky to change something so great, especially when there is no immediate threat in our country.

Totally this for me also. I did not vote, not because I couldn't be bothered or that I didn't care but because I thought it was close to impossible to educate myself to a level that I'd actually feel comfortable with having an input in something that is so important. Tragically most people don't actually seem to care to much about that though and for whatever reason be it : own self importance, fear of change or yes that word racism amongst many other ludicrous reasons people justified there vote we now end up in a situation were as Dan put it nobody has a fucking clue what is going to happen next. There are people who have voted to leave for the sole reason of immigration when they could fit what they actually know about immigration on a stamp ffs whilst similarly there are people who will have voted for remain just so that means they aren't a Racist, it's truly diabolical. Both sides seem to have ran truly awful campaigns and showed how truly inept they are so the idea that those same people will now hold the fate of our country in there hands... good fucking luck us!

[TightEnd]

Anyone getting sick of listening to this 'the kids knew 73% voted remain etc'.  Since when has the youth of today suddenly been so clued up about since big decisions that they have got it right and everyone else who is more experienced in life has got it so badly wrong?

it just reflects that by and large they are optimistic, multi-cultural, inclusive..only ever known the eu, broad based immigration etc. so likely to vote remain

it just so happens that there is a big contrast under 30s and over 60s, in part borne of life experiences broadly (suppression of wage growth, changed industries due to globalisation, changed communities etc etc)  as some older voters hark back to a different time

and a bigger set of voters seem to be cynical about elites, politics etc...a cynicism (possibly correct) and scepticism (certainly widespread) which the young voters (generalising) don't have yet

Wouldnt those willing to gamble be the more optimistic? See the old constantly being described as negative couldnt their vote be described as a vote that we deserve better than the clearly floored EU and that the young have no idea there is something better as theyve never known anything else? Isnt the older voters life experience a far greater a factor in being in a good position to make a decision compared to someone whos done little more than 17 years of school?

could be ;-)

so many of the older votes appear to be protests rather than anything else though? or is that unfair?

[The Camel]

Anyone getting sick of listening to this 'the kids knew 73% voted remain, the baby boomers have ruined it for the future etc'.  Since when has the youth of today suddenly been so clued up about since big decisions that they have got it right and everyone else who is more experienced in life has got it so badly wrong?

As a "young" person I would like to chime in. Quite clearly the vote was very close and the nation has been divided. The single thing that annoys me about this whole campaign is that such a gross proportion of people that voted "leave" don't know what they are voting for. Nobody has a fucking clue what is going on at the moment, there is just lots of skepticism.

In response to what I have said above, I think the smarter vote is to remain because of the uncertainty. That is literally the only reason I would vote remain, I cannot distinguish the bullshit and propaganda from the truth among the campaigning so it feels way too risky to change something so great, especially when there is no immediate threat in our country.

When I woke up this morning, I hoped for terrible things to happen in the future just so I can say "told you so", but I don't think the public that voted leave is at fault at all. People are quite compassionate about their own country (rightly so) and feel the need to stand up for themselves in some way.

I will tell you what really annoys me, if it had been 52-48 to remain, UKIP and the boys would have hung around like a bad smell funking for austerity to last as long as possible and push for another referendum in a decade or less.

And keep doing it until they won one.

Remain loses one by a whisker and we are out of the EU forever.

[BigAdz]

FTSE bouncing back already.  Dollar back to 1.38 already.  Business as usual.

It feels like Remainers actually want something bad to happen, just to give us the old told you so routine.

Lets just get along and get along

One good thing to come out of this.   Arbboy and Adz have kissed and made up.  

It's like one of those sports films where 2 veteran adversaries realise if they work together they can make something special happen for the team.  Throw in some uplifting music and it's moving stuff.

Obv I would be Rocky, the down and out slugger, who keeps getting lucky. While Arb is Apollo the ultimate pro that keeps telling everyone how good he is, until Rocky knocks him out.

Then Apollo, helps Rocky brush up on his poor technique to create a worldbeater....

[arbboy]

In 20 years time the EU might not exist.  Will all the remain voters then say 'we were miles ahead of the game leaving when we did'?  Given numerous other countries are probably thinking right now they don't want to be in the EU either because we don't?  Seems to me the remain people love to ignore the risk of staying in the EU because the stability it supposedly brings.  This could easily not be the case further down the road and we might have made the greatest decision ever leaving when we have.  Standing still doesn't mean there is not risk attached.

[JohnCharver]

Anyone getting sick of listening to this 'the kids knew 73% voted remain etc'.  Since when has the youth of today suddenly been so clued up about since big decisions that they have got it right and everyone else who is more experienced in life has got it so badly wrong?

it just reflects that by and large they are optimistic, multi-cultural, inclusive..only ever known the eu, broad based immigration etc. so likely to vote remain

it just so happens that there is a big contrast under 30s and over 60s, in part borne of life experiences broadly (suppression of wage growth, changed industries due to globalisation, changed communities etc etc)  as some older voters hark back to a different time

and a bigger set of voters seem to be cynical about elites, politics etc...a cynicism (possibly correct) and scepticism (certainly widespread) which the young voters (generalising) don't have yet

Wouldnt those willing to gamble be the more optimistic? See the old constantly being described as negative couldnt their vote be described as a vote that we deserve better than the clearly floored EU and that the young have no idea there is something better as theyve never known anything else? Isnt the older voters life experience a far greater a factor in being in a good position to make a decision compared to someone whos done little more than 17 years of school?

could be ;-)

so many of the older votes appear to be protests rather than anything else though? or is that unfair?

Always a factor between GE but cant account for the sheer apetite to leave.

[DungBeetle]

Anyone getting sick of listening to this 'the kids knew 73% voted remain, the baby boomers have ruined it for the future etc'.  Since when has the youth of today suddenly been so clued up about since big decisions that they have got it right and everyone else who is more experienced in life has got it so badly wrong?

As a "young" person I would like to chime in. Quite clearly the vote was very close and the nation has been divided. The single thing that annoys me about this whole campaign is that such a gross proportion of people that voted "leave" don't know what they are voting for. Nobody has a fucking clue what is going on at the moment, there is just lots of skepticism.

In response to what I have said above, I think the smarter vote is to remain because of the uncertainty. That is literally the only reason I would vote remain, I cannot distinguish the bullshit and propaganda from the truth among the campaigning so it feels way too risky to change something so great, especially when there is no immediate threat in our country.

When I woke up this morning, I hoped for terrible things to happen in the future just so I can say "told you so", but I don't think the public that voted leave is at fault at all. People are quite compassionate about their own country (rightly so) and feel the need to stand up for themselves in some way.

I will tell you what really annoys me, if it had been 52-48 to remain, UKIP and the boys would have hung around like a bad smell funking for austerity to last as long as possible and push for another referendum in a decade or less.

And keep doing it until they won one.

Remain loses one by a whisker and we are out of the EU forever.

Don't worry Camel - pop stars such as Damon Albarn will sort it out:

"To my mind, democracy has failed us," he said. "Democracy has failed us because it was ill-informed. I just want all of you to know that when you leave here we can change that decision. It is possible."

[kukushkin88]

Anyone getting sick of listening to this 'the kids knew 73% voted remain, the baby boomers have ruined it for the future etc'.  Since when has the youth of today suddenly been so clued up about since big decisions that they have got it right and everyone else who is more experienced in life has got it so badly wrong?

As a "young" person I would like to chime in. Quite clearly the vote was very close and the nation has been divided. The single thing that annoys me about this whole campaign is that such a gross proportion of people that voted "leave" don't know what they are voting for. Nobody has a fucking clue what is going on at the moment, there is just lots of skepticism.

In response to what I have said above, I think the smarter vote is to remain because of the uncertainty. That is literally the only reason I would vote remain, I cannot distinguish the bullshit and propaganda from the truth among the campaigning so it feels way too risky to change something so great, especially when there is no immediate threat in our country.

When I woke up this morning, I hoped for terrible things to happen in the future just so I can say "told you so", but I don't think the public that voted leave is at fault at all. People are quite compassionate about their own country (rightly so) and feel the need to stand up for themselves in some way.

I will tell you what really annoys me, if it had been 52-48 to remain, UKIP and the boys would have hung around like a bad smell funking for austerity to last as long as possible and push for another referendum in a decade or less.

And keep doing it until they won one.

Remain loses one by a whisker and we are out of the EU forever.

Don't worry Camel - pop stars such as Damon Albarn will sort it out:

"To my mind, democracy has failed us," he said. "Democracy has failed us because it was ill-informed. I just want all of you to know that when you leave here we can change that decision. It is possible."

Damon Albarn is a very talented man but we shouldn't care too much what he thinks of course, as you've alluded to. Hitchen's would say Democracy is a terribly flawed thing but is better than any of the alternatives." Cameron gave the keys to lunatics and it went badly, now we suffer. No recriminations and try to make it work is all we can do. Biggest lurch to the right in Europe for 80 years.