Noisy Neighbours - the Man City thread

[DungBeetle]

Wow, Stones an amazing signing. Will soon be the best defender in the world. Criminally underused by Roy in the Euros. Massive congrats on that purchase.

Hope you are right pleno and that  Pep helps him to a whole new level (as he did with Boateng) and likewise with Sterling which can only be positive for England.

Not sure how anyone can think Stones is a great signing at 50 million.  He may end up being world class but at 50 million there is plenty of downside there given some of his performances.  It's a fair punt but hardly a bargain is it?

[Archer]

No one saying it is a bargain but English tax, City tax, 2 years left on his contract, selling club not needing to sell, price set pre TV deal with the Chelsea offer last year....

Mourhino wanted him, Pep wanted him, ferdinand praises him to the hilt and pleno thinks he is going to be the best in the world - thats good enough for me

Then there is the deal. Stones is on a long contract - 6 years - which means it's only 7.92 million per year for the accounts. He is only 22 and if he doesn't flourish and they sell him, say, for £25 million after 3 years it makes it lower risk than risking £30million on a 29 year old.

[DungBeetle]

I think he'll do well under Pep but my point is simply I don't see how a signing can be deemed amazing without looking at the transfer fee.  It seems a decent speculative signing for the fee involved.  He may turn out to be a world beater under Pep, but as it stands it is a huge fee for a player currently kept out of the England team by Gary Cahill (albeit a player with high potential).

[hhyftrftdr]

I think he'll do well under Pep but my point is simply I don't see how a signing can be deemed amazing without looking at the transfer fee.  It seems a decent speculative signing for the fee involved.  He may turn out to be a world beater under Pep, but as it stands it is a huge fee for a player currently kept out of the England team by Gary Cahill (albeit a player with high potential).

I've not been a huge fan of Stones but the deal looks ok to me (for the reasons Archer outlined). As it stands, £50m looks a hell of a chunk to pay for a player who couldn't make the national team, but that's kinda beside the point as we're buying him for what he can become rather than what he currently is. If Pep thinks he can shape him into our Pique then we're laughing for the next decade. If it goes pear shaped then we'll be able to move him on further down the line and still recoup a decent amount of what was paid.

The way Pep plays football hinges on having a defender like Stones.

More importantly, he's also gone straight in my fantasy team as he's pretty cheap and we have no fit central defenders

Ps; transfer fees are so ridiculous these days that you just have to take them with a pinch of salt IMO. There are still bargains and value to be had, but its getting harder and harder to find it!

[DungBeetle]

Yes Stones does feel a good fit for the way Pep plays.

As an interesting related discussion, what do you reckon you would be able to get for Sterling and Mangala if you sold them now, a year after buying them for £50m and £40(?)m?   Do you think in Sterling's case someone would pay him £180k a week or do you think you'd need to sub the wages for the rest of his contract?  I know Man City definitely aren't looking to offload these guys but just being devils advocate.  Thinking aloud if Liverpool still reckon Benteke is worth in excess of £30m then this pair have probably gone up in value so bizarre is the market!

[hhyftrftdr]

Yes Stones does feel a good fit for the way Pep plays.

As an interesting related discussion, what do you reckon you would be able to get for Sterling and Mangala if you sold them now, a year after buying them for £50m and £40(?)m?   Do you think in Sterling's case someone would pay him £180k a week or do you think you'd need to sub the wages for the rest of his contract?  I know Man City definitely aren't looking to offload these guys but just being devils advocate.  Thinking aloud if Liverpool still reckon Benteke is worth in excess of £30m then this pair have probably gone up in value so bizarre is the market!

Packet of dolly mixtures for Sterling, and a burger/pint Weatherspoons combo for Mangala.

[exstream]

Wenger: "The value of a player is dependent on his talent, the expected strengthening of the team, his age and of course his resale value."

[rinswun]

Missed out on commercial value.

[Marky147]

Yes Stones does feel a good fit for the way Pep plays.

As an interesting related discussion, what do you reckon you would be able to get for Sterling and Mangala if you sold them now, a year after buying them for £50m and £40(?)m?   Do you think in Sterling's case someone would pay him £180k a week or do you think you'd need to sub the wages for the rest of his contract?  I know Man City definitely aren't looking to offload these guys but just being devils advocate.  Thinking aloud if Liverpool still reckon Benteke is worth in excess of £30m then this pair have probably gone up in value so bizarre is the market!

Packet of dolly mixtures for Sterling, and a burger/pint Weatherspoons combo for Mangala.

[buzzharvey22]

Will stones start on Saturday? I'm thinking FPL :-)

[hhyftrftdr]

Will stones start on Saturday? I'm thinking FPL :-)

Nailed on IMO.

Question marks over the fitness of pretty much every other centre half at the club, so although he'll have only had a couple of training sessions under his belt, he'll start I think.

I have him in my FF team

[Archer]

Yes Stones does feel a good fit for the way Pep plays.

As an interesting related discussion, what do you reckon you would be able to get for Sterling and Mangala if you sold them now, a year after buying them for £50m and £40(?)m?   Do you think in Sterling's case someone would pay him £180k a week or do you think you'd need to sub the wages for the rest of his contract?  I know Man City definitely aren't looking to offload these guys but just being devils advocate.  Thinking aloud if Liverpool still reckon Benteke is worth in excess of £30m then this pair have probably gone up in value so bizarre is the market!

Packet of dolly mixtures for Sterling, and a burger/pint Weatherspoons combo for Mangala.

VG

Sterling cost £44million + £5million add ons. I've see different interpretations of the add-ons and they will have been hardly triggered so far. City winning the CL was certainly a part of it so that is pie in the sky for the moment. As for wages, City incorparate a large performance bonus element into the package and it also weighted to the end of the contract. So, he won't be on £180K per week and he will be short on bonuses so far. In the current inflationary climate I reckon they'd  still get £40million for him without a problem particularly as he is still only 21.  Whilst his stock has fallen he did have very positive moments in the 1st half of the season and was particularly strong in the CL group stages making UEFA team of the group stages etc - there is a lot of magic in there.

Mangala is a harder one. City have had a few deals (Negredo, Dzeko etc) where they loan out with subsidised wages for 12 months or so and then a Transfer Fee 12 months down the line. I think we might find out soon what he is worth because Pep apparently not keen and rumoured he is on the way out.
Mangala totally different.

[Archer]

I enjoyed this - Xavi on Guardiola : https://www.theguardian.com/football/2016/aug/10/pep-guardiola-manchester-city-barcelona-xavi

And this: http://thelab.bleacherreport.com/pep-s-england-calling/

[Archer]

Enjoyable comedy article in the Daily Fail:

Can John Stones lift the 'curse' of English players at Manchester City following his £47.5m transfer?

    Youngsters like Jack Rodwell and Scott Sinclair struggled after transfers
    Owen Hargreaves, Richard Wright and Stuart Taylor barely played
    A number of big money purchases have worked out while some have not
    John Stones is only the 15th Englishman signed by Manchester City since they were taken over by their new owners in 2008

By Joe Bernstein for MailOnline

Published: 11:54, 11 August 2016 | Updated: 14:31, 11 August 2016

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-3734549/Can-John-Stones-lift-curse-English-players-Manchester-City-following-47-5m-transfer.html

[hhyftrftdr]

Enjoyable comedy article in the Daily Fail:

Can John Stones lift the 'curse' of English players at Manchester City following his £47.5m transfer?

    Youngsters like Jack Rodwell and Scott Sinclair struggled after transfers
    Owen Hargreaves, Richard Wright and Stuart Taylor barely played
    A number of big money purchases have worked out while some have not
    John Stones is only the 15th Englishman signed by Manchester City since they were taken over by their new owners in 2008

By Joe Bernstein for MailOnline

Published: 11:54, 11 August 2016 | Updated: 14:31, 11 August 2016

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-3734549/Can-John-Stones-lift-curse-English-players-Manchester-City-following-47-5m-transfer.html

lol so fucking zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz to use Stuart Taylor and Richard Wright as examples of English players not playing is simply ridiculous. People get paid to write this bollocks?!

If you (Daily shitting Mail) break it down, we have had reasonable success with English players in recent seasons.

Hart
Barry
Lescott
Milner all enjoyed/enjoying successful careers at City.

We did Adam Johnson's career no harm. In fact, if he wasn't out 'enjoying' Manchester's night life so much (and later on, enjoying 15 yr old girls in his car) he might well have got in Mancini's XI more often.

Richards was a crock (ditto Hargreaves and another laughable example from the fail) and unfortunately when fit he was up against Zabaleta in his prime years; no right back would have got in ahead of Pablo at that time.

Rodwell and Sinclair are the 2 sticks that people love to beat us with. Rodwell had potential but ultimately couldn't shift his well documented injury problems, and then wasn't a part of MP's plans when Bobby was sacked. Sinclair is a total anomaly, I'll happily concede. Neither have pulled up trees since leaving Manchester.

Sterling still plenty to prove but no concerns from me.

MCFC; ruining English footballers since 2008.