Changes you would implement to revive the UK

[kukushkin88]

We do have a government with an unprecedented record of failure. That seems like an opportunity for change that might bring about improvement.

[teddybloat]

It stops peadophilia. Are you pro nonce or summat?

Wow! I didn't realise there was no peadophilia in the UK before 1964.

Wasn't he just mocking the idea of bringing back the death penalty? We best ask him I suppose?

i didnt think i needed sarcasm ellipses with that statement, but i'll add them AND a saftey wink just to be sure. belt and braces and all that...

it stops peadophilia. are you pro nonce or summat...

[RED-DOG]

It stops peadophilia. Are you pro nonce or summat?

Wow! I didn't realise there was no peadophilia in the UK before 1964.

Wasn't he just mocking the idea of bringing back the death penalty? We best ask him I suppose?

i didnt think i needed sarcasm ellipses with that statement, but i'll add them AND a saftey wink just to be sure. belt and braces and all that...

it stops peadophilia. are you pro nonce or summat...

On that occasion, I'm afraid I did need the safety wink. Sorry. 

[mikeymike]

There are currently around 90 lifers who will not be released and will die in prison. The average cost of keeping a lifer in prison is around £200,000 per annum, though government figures say it is much lower – they do not take into account the cost of the free rental space of the cell – heating and water – free food – free television – free Wi-Fi – free education – free counselling – free clothing and paying them a wage for making whatever.

So that’s a £18 million a year – which I am sure could be spent on better things. Does somebody like Peter Sutcliffe, deserve such good hospitality.

We are far too lenient IMO – in general with all crime committed – sure there can be exceptional circumstances, for example if I had caught the guys that had stolen my van in the act on my property and beaten them to death – I would expect to be exonerated as I was protecting my property on my property.

We need to bring in stronger tariffs and no parole – you do the crime and serve the time.

And yes there will be miscarriages of justice but that is life.

[Doobs]

There are currently around 90 lifers who will not be released and will die in prison. The average cost of keeping a lifer in prison is around £200,000 per annum, though government figures say it is much lower – they do not take into account the cost of the free rental space of the cell – heating and water – free food – free television – free Wi-Fi – free education – free counselling – free clothing and paying them a wage for making whatever.

So that’s a £18 million a year – which I am sure could be spent on better things. Does somebody like Peter Sutcliffe, deserve such good hospitality.

We are far too lenient IMO – in general with all crime committed – sure there can be exceptional circumstances, for example if I had caught the guys that had stolen my van in the act on my property and beaten them to death – I would expect to be exonerated as I was protecting my property on my property.

We need to bring in stronger tariffs and no parole – you do the crime and serve the time.

And yes there will be miscarriages of justice but that is life.

...or death in this case.

[TightEnd]

And yes there will be miscarriages of justice but that is life.

which is why you can never bring back the death penalty, and it never will be

[teddybloat]

" I would expect to be exonerated "


you should be expected to be found guilty of murder, and then killed...

[MintTrav]

if I had caught the guys that had stolen my van in the act on my property and beaten them to death – I would expect to be exonerated as I was protecting my property on my property.

You needed the safety wink there - for a minute I thought you were being serious.

[RED-DOG]

We are far too lenient IMO – in general with all crime committed – sure there can be exceptional circumstances, for example if I had caught the guys that had stolen my van in the act on my property and beaten them to death – I would expect to be exonerated as I was protecting my property on my property.

Where do you draw the line with this philosophy? Stealing your van, stealing your bike, stealing your biro, stealing one of your chips?

OK, I'll admit the last one is a given but you know what I mean.

[teddybloat]

Actually your post does deserve a more considered response, especially as it is so far from my own views.

"There are currently around 90 lifers who will not be released and will die in prison. The average cost of keeping a lifer in prison is around £200,000 per annum, though government figures say it is much lower – they do not take into account the cost of the free rental space of the cell – heating and water – free food – free television – free Wi-Fi – free education – free counselling – free clothing and paying them a wage for making whatever."


"We need to bring in stronger tariffs and no parole – you do the crime and serve the time."


most if this doesnt happen. prisons are over populated and brutalising. if only there were free education. most live in an environment where violence, racketeering and sexual abuse is rife. if you dont go in with a drug habit, you will likely pick one up. overpopulation has some terrible side effects one is an increase in organised crime and even the formation of prison gangs - a phenomenon that has, so far, evaded our system. but maybe not for long: once prisons become too full it becomes difficult to track a person's reputation - so gangs are formed and a person can establish his bona fides through gang affiliation. and people can track reputations and police bahaviour that way. its a very clever response to overpopulation where guards cannot keep order. unfortunately it increases the efficiency and prevalence of crime inside and outside of prisons.

so be careful what you wish for when you talk about making prisons even more about punishment then they are now.

[Longines]

And yes there will be miscarriages of justice but that is life.

Easy solution. When a miscarriage is proven a name is picked from a hat from those that back the death penalty and they are hanged as well. That's life.

[mikeymike]

Having served time in my younger years for an offence that I am not sorry for committing – you can’t let people take liberties, I found my time inside to be quite fulfilling – I learnt to play chess, was given an education in some life skills which helped me in later years and still do today.

There was already overcrowding and so called gangs and drugs – even back then. But you make your own decisions as a man.
 
I wasn’t happy to be sent down as I felt that my act had been self-protection – but when sentenced I accepted it – by the second day I had lost any chance of an early release due to a minor scuffle with the so called gangs. You should accept responsibility for your own actions.
 
In my twenties, thirties and forties I use to have mates that were career villains – they excepted that if they robbed a bank and got caught they would do time – if they dealt drugs and got caught they would do time – the guys who dealt in drugs never touched drugs – nobody was in a gang it was just a loose collection of blokes who knew each other.

Most interesting if you asked any of them what they thought of the sentencing in this country they would all say it was too soft and their views on rapists and women beaters and serial murders were that they should be chucked behind bars for life or worse.

I am a strong believer that one has the rights to protect their own property and family within that property if this means someone’s demise so be it.

Interesting to see some people obviously think the likes of Peter Sutclifee should enjoy the rest of his life.

[mikeymike]

Forgot to add - legislation of all drugs as this would kill off a lot of petty crime and organised crime would have to come up with something else.

[Jon MW]

There are currently around 90 lifers who will not be released and will die in prison. The average cost of keeping a lifer in prison is around £200,000 per annum, though government figures say it is much lower – they do not take into account the cost of the free rental space of the cell – heating and water – free food – free television – free Wi-Fi – free education – free counselling – free clothing and paying them a wage for making whatever.

So that’s a £18 million a year – which I am sure could be spent on better things. Does somebody like Peter Sutcliffe, deserve such good hospitality.

We are far too lenient IMO – in general with all crime committed – sure there can be exceptional circumstances, for example if I had caught the guys that had stolen my van in the act on my property and beaten them to death – I would expect to be exonerated as I was protecting my property on my property.

We need to bring in stronger tariffs and no parole – you do the crime and serve the time.

And yes there will be miscarriages of justice but that is life.

The problem with the cost argument is that it is based on the assumption that the death penalty would be cheaper.

In practice the average cost of keeping a lifer in prison is the total cost and not the marginal cost of doing so - i.e.you're double, triple, quadruple counting many parts of the cost which would be shared with other prisoners. So the actual cost is less than the headline figure for imprisonment.

On the other side if you had a death sentence every death sentence would be liable to dozens of appeals, and further investigations. Each one of which would cost hundreds of thousands of pounds - in which time you'd still be paying the cost of imprisonment. You might end up saving some money from the cost of imprisonment ending when the appeal process finally finished but it would be far outweighed by the additional costs involved in the failed appeals plus massively outweighed by all the appeals that were successful.

Also not wanting to be mean but the general idea and in particular the idea that a proportionate response to someone stealing your stuff should be to kill them seems awfully ... American; and that's rarely a good example to follow.

[teddybloat]

Forgot to add - legislation of all drugs as this would kill off a lot of petty crime and organised crime would have to come up with something else.

the legalisation of all drugs would be momumentally stupid. probably the single most destructive change to legislation proposed in this thread.

how would this legalisation work?

would you allow corner shops to sell anti-psychotic medication for example?