This one is bugging me.....

[M3boy]

PokerStars Game #4615661495: Tournament #22780512, $10+$1 Hold'em No Limit - Level XII (800/1600) - 2006/04/13 - 19:46:56 (ET) Table '22780512 70' 9-max Seat #1 is the button Seat 1: M3boy (58488 in chips)
Seat 3: VeNSe (21775 in chips)
Seat 4: AcesUpCuervo (23449 in chips)
Seat 5: vittoriastar (66025 in chips)
Seat 6: JONAH J (19510 in chips)
Seat 7: CarepaQ (59818 in chips)
Seat 8: kasin (50044 in chips)
Seat 9: Kubbler (153486 in chips)
M3boy: posts the ante 75
VeNSe: posts the ante 75
AcesUpCuervo: posts the ante 75
vittoriastar: posts the ante 75
JONAH J: posts the ante 75
CarepaQ: posts the ante 75
kasin: posts the ante 75
Kubbler: posts the ante 75
VeNSe: posts small blind 800
AcesUpCuervo: posts big blind 1600
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to M3boy [ ]
vittoriastar: folds
JONAH J: folds
CarepaQ: folds
kasin: folds
Kubbler: raises 3200 to 4800
M3boy: calls 4800
VeNSe: folds
AcesUpCuervo: folds
*** FLOP *** [ ]
Kubbler: checks
M3boy: bets 4800
Kubbler: raises 4800 to 9600
M3boy: calls 4800
*** TURN *** [ ] []
Kubbler: bets 11200
M3boy: calls 11200
*** RIVER *** [ ] []
Kubbler: bets 24000
M3boy: calls 24000
*** SHOW DOWN ***
Kubbler: shows [ ] (a straight, Ten to Ace)
M3boy: mucks hand
Kubbler collected 102200 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 102200 | Rake 0
Board [ ]
Seat 1: M3boy (button) mucked [ ]
Seat 3: VeNSe (small blind) folded before Flop
Seat 4: AcesUpCuervo (big blind) folded before Flop
Seat 5: vittoriastar folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 6: JONAH J folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 7: CarepaQ folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 8: kasin folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 9: Kubbler showed [ ] and won (102200) with a straight, Ten to Ace

Now I know I paid him off in the end, but was hoping he had 2pr (this part was bad I know), BUT could/should I of played the flop/turn any different?

Cheers guys

[M3boy]

Oh its so much easier reading through it.

I would give myself this advice - ALL IN on the turn. Agree?

58k was well above average chips, other guy was c/l - 150 odd left

[totalise]

Oh its so much easier reading through it.

I would give myself this advice - ALL IN on the turn. Agree?

58k was well above average chips, other guy was c/l - 150 odd left

heh yeah, the turn is where the action needs to be made here. Theres a lot of second best hands that can call you here, its a great spot to shove em in

[tikay]

With hindisght, yes, a nice Bet on the turn secures it, but you have a set, & want to get paid. If he moves in on flop or turn, you still call, yes?

It's only a mistake with hindsight, he hit his lucky gutshot.

[totalise]

With hindisght, yes, a nice Bet on the turn secures it, but you have a set, & want to get paid. If he moves in on flop or turn, you still call, yes?

It's only a mistake with hindsight, he hit his lucky gutshot.

you aren't raising here to "secure" the pot, you are raising here to try and get your opponent to put more money in the middle. Calling and giving freecards on boards like this where there are so many scare cards is a bad play (in general)  because if a scare card comes and he doesn't have it, you likely dont get anymore action anyways, and if a scare card comes and he does have it, you end up paying him off. Give him a chance to put some serious chips in the pot if he has a made hand, and give him a chance to pay if he is drawing.

[M3boy]

With hindisght, yes, a nice Bet on the turn secures it, but you have a set, & want to get paid. If he moves in on flop or turn, you still call, yes?

It's only a mistake with hindsight, he hit his lucky gutshot.

Hmmmm, but once he bets 11k on the turn, the pot is already big enough (about the size of an average chip stack) , move in here and I think he passes - I am then on neally 90k and back in the top 15.

Oh well,,, live and learn (still only cost me $30)

[tikay]

Actually, totalise demolishes my thinking, & he's not wrong, either.

J P Kelly is in that school - bet big with monsters, it's amazing how often it works. He did me that way in Helsinki, barely one Level into the 90 minute clock Main Event, sheesh.....

[tikay]

It's amazing how greed, an essential component in a poker players armoury, can kick us in the teeth actually - slow-playing big hands being a good example. Guess it's a balance thng.....

[ifm]

It depends really, if you call a preflop raise and hit the flop it's best to check because just about every player on the net these days makes a continuation bet.
There is a place for slowplaying as is there for firing at the pot with trips, they are both methods for extracting the most chips from your hand, it all depends who you are up against.

[ACE2M]

all in on the turn. 10,K or a club on 5th street is unpleasent for you. You have extracted a nice big bet already with a vulnerable hand and should make him pay the maximum to see the end. Sklansky goes on about avoiding getting very good hands beat by allowing people to see the river for nothing, it's a sin.

[action man]

yeah m8, all in on turn is the ONLY move

[M3boy]

I know - lapse of concentration cost me dearly. I didnt even realise that the turn was another club at the time - just shows you how much of a lapse it was - neither did I realise how big the pot was.

[totalise]

It's amazing how greed, an essential component in a poker players armoury, can kick us in the teeth actually - slow-playing big hands being a good example. Guess it's a balance thng.....

I dont just think its a balance thing, I think its a live vs online thing as well (although I speak about live on a tiny sample size so I might easily be waaaaay off)

I was speaking to someone who tells me that when you play live, you can really get an astonishing handle on what someones holding.. so as an example of you are playing this hand live, and you can ascertain that the guy has absolutely nothing (through reads/tells etc) then raising is a bad idea, as you chop off his only avenue of winning the pot (bluffing) so the "correct" play from an internet p.o.v isn't necessarily the best play from a live p.o.v.

I would guess that its easier to slowplay live then it is on the internet, because of the above... but I am a huge live fish, so god knows if thats true. Heck, its not even relevant to the OP, but I'll hit post anyways

[tikay]

Live - v Internet - have you noticed that online it seems to be obligatory to move all-in, at any stage, of any tourney, if holding AK?

I saw it again yesterday, very first hand in a $200 Freezeout, 80 chips in the smiddle, & a guy goes "all-in" - 2,000 bet to win 80! He flashed the AK as if to say "yup, I gotta monster....."

Early stages of online comps, especially in early position, I almost always limp with AK these days, & if I miss the flop, no prob, let it go if a bet comes in. A Pre-Flop Raise to, say, 200, invariably attracts 5 callers, so you are in a pickle if you miss the flop. I limped with it yesterday, flop came K high, Matey Boy moves in, I call, he has King-small, & gives me one hell of a verbal assault in the text box for playing AK badly......But then I always was an awkward bugger.

[TightEnd]

Yes Tikay

I have taken to playing AK very soft first couple of levels of live comps too

limp. and then if you catch an A or K on the flop then you are often getting action from Ax or Kx who have no idea you are AK.

If you miss, you can assess and bail out if need be.