Live game etiquette...what would you do?

[Poppet7]

Yeah but this guy that Tightend is talking about sounds as if it was said in an aggressive way, shouting over to your mate "Oi mate, this guy just called my xx with xx... MUPPET" is a bit nasty!

Ok ok... maybe I am sensitive, but that's just me!

[mikkyT]

So u never call someone who outdraws u a muppet or a fish to ur mates? Cos I do. Maybe not so publically but its not offensive... I wudnt Iike it n I wud say somethin to the guy but I aint so thin skinned to be offended.

[mjrevie]

If its a self-dealt tournie, then why should the dealer get involved? The table is not his responsibility. It is up to everyone to speak up. If dealers are provided, then it becomes an issue of what one person see's as friendly ribbing others see as being abusive.

[mikkyT]

Friendly ribbin it wasnt. Thats a given in this situation anyway.

[Poppet7]

Yes I do, you've heard me!

But I'm not so rude to shout it in front of them

[Karabiner]

The ideal cure for this kind of behavour is for him to be sat in between Kev Ward and Vinni.

They would soon bring him up to speed on etiquette. 

[Royal Flush]

Play him at his own game - make witty, pithy comments taking the mickey out of him, wind him up, send him on mega tilt. If his actions start affecting your play, call the TD over.

Thats exactly what i would do. I play live poker for fun, money is secondary. If some prat is going to ruin the atmosphere then i am going to keep winding him up, and mocking his play.


As for Janes experience, i didnt realsie that was even going on! I thought the guy was having a laugh? I have to say i had the most enjoyable night of poker last saturday in that room. So many people had come along to have a good laugh who had never been before. I spent more in the bar after a few of us got knocked out than i did on the rebuys! Still amazed Dave managed to get to the final table though, lol.

[londonpokergirl]

Even if you are not directly affected by this guys behaviour, but you can see other people are, call over the TD, have a quiet chat with him away from the table so the TD can assess their behaviour.

If it was me I would have a word with the player, and warn them if they try it again 20mins away from the table and possible disqualification.

[thetank]

But disrespect is subjective and in context.

To me bein called a muppet can never be offensive. Its a term for banter..Like mug or fish.

I dont think its banter if he's telling his mates in front of you that he thinks you're a muppet.

To say nothing of the fact that it's just plain rude to refer to someone in the 3rd person when they are within earshot.

He certainly wouldn't get an invite to any of my tea parties. Not sure if it warrants a time penalty though.

[Ginger]

As for Janes experience, i didnt realsie that was even going on! I thought the guy was having a laugh? I have to say i had the most enjoyable night of poker last saturday in that room. So many people had come along to have a good laugh who had never been before. I spent more in the bar after a few of us got knocked out than i did on the rebuys! Still amazed Dave managed to get to the final table though, lol.

LOL, and you wonder why you missed it?!

I'm not talking about Kevin, Dave and him were a good laugh. It was the guy to Kev's right that was being a moron.

[Royal Flush]

As for Janes experience, i didnt realsie that was even going on! I thought the guy was having a laugh? I have to say i had the most enjoyable night of poker last saturday in that room. So many people had come along to have a good laugh who had never been before. I spent more in the bar after a few of us got knocked out than i did on the rebuys! Still amazed Dave managed to get to the final table though, lol.

LOL, and you wonder why you missed it?!

I'm not talking about Kevin, Dave and him were a good laugh. It was the guy to Kev's right that was being a moron.

They were good.

These 2 lads decided to play the comp, never having played before not realisng they could rebuy etc, they expected a quick 10 minute laugh. Well Dave just hit evreything and had 23k by the break 1k starting stack! They were already both pissed badly and when Kevin got knocked out we pissed of to the bar and got more drunk. Come the final and Kevin trying to persuade Dave to leave the table (he couldnt get it in his head that you cant just leave the table) the best bit when he stumbled up to the final table and said "Dave give me a couple of chips so i can get a drink" about 5 times! Classic!

[Wardonkey]

If someone is behaving in a manner that is socially unacceptable then it is the duty of the host to do something about it. People go to casinos to enjoy themselves and if their evening is spoiled by prats like this one then they tend to choose other forms of entertainment.

The social situation in casinos is rare, where else do people sit round a crowded table with a bunch of strangers? For many people this is part of the fun and most people behave very well in circumstances which can sometimes be very stressful. No-one would play much live if the atmosphere was tense and hostile every time they played.

As someone who used to run pits and supervise tournaments I considered it my duty make sure that the atmosphere was welcoming and friendly for all patrons and staff. Dealing with these types of situations was never easy and subjective judgements had to made as to what was acceptable behavior and what wasn't.

My questions:

Do I as a player at the table but not directly involved in a specific hand with the guy have the right to ask a TD to do something if I feel his behaviour is OTT?

What should a TD do if called upon?

What is and what isn't acceptable with regards to this type of behaviour?

In answer to the questions;

1 - Yes, you have every right to complain, your experience is being spoiled as well as the target of any abuse.

2- If the TD is satisfied that the behavior is unacceptable then firstly the abusive player should be warned. If the behavior persists then the TD can issue a time penalty. If that does not work then the player can be disqualified and barred. If the offence is bad enough then the warning or time penalty can be waived and the abusive player ejected immediately.

3- This is subjective but generally if the behavior is intended to offend or upset another person then it is not acceptable.

[bobby1]

I played in the final Wm hill qualifier last night, the less said about my night the better!

However a situation cropped up on my table.

On it is a twenty something Midlander, brash, cocky, self opinionated. Professes to play a lot on the internet and he says his normal live comps are at lower buy ins but he is stepping up to have a shot at this event, as a treat.

Shouts across to his mates on other tables

One example

"Yes Chris, I've just doubled up, muppet called me with AJ when I had AK" The whole table hears

He gives a running commentary after most hands to most players, whether he is in the hand or not..."I knew you had that" "That was a bad bet" etc etc

Whenever he gets outdrawn, which is amusingly frequently..usually by an unfailingly polite Ali Mallu, he goes off one one..swear words, stands up, arms everywhere, stamping feet

All of the rest of the table are polite and indulge him, not wanting to make a scene

Then he really goes off, a short stacked player limps and he raises on the button and the limper pushes. Limper has Ax, loud man has QQ. An Ace falls on the flop.

Fifteen minutes later our loud man is still addressing the limper about his "bad play". Limper looks embarrassed for a while but then begins to verbally fight back. It's unpleasant, unfriendly all round, horrible atmosphere.


My questions:

Do I as a player at the table but not directly involved in a specific hand with the guy have the right to ask a TD to do something if I feel his beaviour is OTT?

What should a TD do if called upon?

What is and what isn't acceptable with regards to this type of behaviour?

Hi Richard,

I hope this didnt spoil the event for you.

A couple of times in the past I have been uncomfortable with the way a player has been treating other players in a comp. On both occasions I have had a quick word with the TD along the lines of' I hope you dont ming me pointing this out to you but the guy in seat x at our table is being a little out if order, could you keep your eye on him' On one occasion the guy carried on and was givien a teliing off and warned about his behaviour and the second time I got annoyed and tried to knock him out.......and he outdrew me and then gave me a rubdown.

[dik9]

This is an excerpt of what "used" to be on display in the Broadway's cardroom? Don't know if it is still there

Ladies and Gentleman,

   Poker is a fair and just game, where everyone starts off as equals. It is essential for the running of a cardroom, that this is understood by all. No unfair advantage can be obtained by any player. “Stroke pulling” will not be tolerated regardless of how insignificant it seems. Any player, who spots an infringement, must report it immediately to the cardroom supervisor.
   Due to growing popularity of poker on the television, people seem to think that it is acceptable to use “verbal” to confuse and obtain an advantage. Although some people feel this is part of the game, it is once again an unfortunate Americanism. This cardroom DOES NOT operate this policy! “Verbal” is not part of our game. The same rule applies to criticism. Every player is allowed to play their cards, as they see fit, without fear of intimidation from others. You pay, you play, you decide, you follow your head and cards, and you accept the flop and most important you accept the outcome, regardless of how unjust the odds go against you, or even for you!

Only a snippit but it gives you a taste of the house rules were/are to ensure a pleasant game of poker. This was seperate from the rules, as nobody read the rules as it was/is 47 pages long, and covered most eventualities. But i felt this was important to keep seperate. Maybe as the TV players and circuit players are regulars, they have waived this slightly, and I know some people love verbal and use it as a major part of the game, but where do you draw the line? I drew it quite close to the top (que next debate)
But it was a fantastically friendly cardroom, and think it probably still is.

[TightEnd]

Hi Richard,

I hope this didnt spoil the event for you.

it didn't thanks, both satellites I played were terrific. Too tough, but terrific!!