would you have played this any differently ?

[booder]

just wondering if any of you cash specialists would play this different ?           i have not been playing cash long so any constructive advice / criticism welcome


jeneum4   like so many players that i have encountered is quite capable of reraising preflop with nothing.  did i extract the maximum or should i have pushed on the turn risking losing my customer


Game #2788253263: Hold'em NL ($1/$2) - 2006/12/15 - 15:24:55 (UK)
Table "King" Seat 5 is the button.
Seat 1: jackmoor ($1032.25 in chips)
Seat 2: Karaboo ($371.50 in chips)
Seat 3: Horal ($206 in chips)
Seat 4: LiveWire ($211.25 in chips)
Seat 5: Bengun001 ($235.09 in chips)
Seat 6: jeneum4 ($198 in chips)
jeneum4: posts small blind $1
jackmoor: posts big blind $2
----- HOLE CARDS -----
dealt to Karaboo [ ]
Karaboo: raises to $6
Horal: folds
LiveWire: folds
Bengun001: calls $6
jeneum4: raises to $20
jackmoor: folds
Karaboo: calls $14
Bengun001: calls $14
----- FLOP ----- [ ]
jeneum4: bets $50
Karaboo: calls $50
Bengun001: folds
----- TURN ----- [ ][]
jeneum4: checks
Karaboo: checks
----- RIVER ----- [ ][]
jeneum4: checks
Karaboo: bets $52
jeneum4: calls $52
----- SHOW DOWN -----
Karaboo: shows [ ] (Four of a kind, Nines, Jack high)
jeneum4: mucks hand  [As Ah]
Karaboo collected $263 from Main pot
----- SUMMARY -----
Total pot $266 Main pot $263 Rake $3
Board [ ]
Seat 1: jackmoor (big blind) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 2: Karaboo showed [ ] and won ($263) with Four of a kind, Nines, Jack high
Seat 3: Horal folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 4: LiveWire folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 5: Bengun001 (button) folded on the Flop
Seat 6: jeneum4 (small blind) mucked  [As Ah]

[boldie]

I probably would have reraised the flop. he won't take you for a 9, let alone pocket 9's, after your pre-flop raise, and might even reraise you all-in there thinking you have a pocket pair and must be scared of the FD or you're going for the FD . The third heart is a killer for you...a shame that came down as otherwise he might have done his dosh in. Now he's scared of the flush....a shame but stilla  nice pot.

[tantrum]

I probably would have reraised the flop. he won't take you for a 9, let alone pocket 9's, after your pre-flop raise, and might even reraise you all-in there thinking you have a pocket pair and must be scared of the FD or you're going for the FD . .

No way this guy is going to put booder on quads.
re-rasing pre-flop would end up in a preflop war where booder would have to fold.


Depending on your image (what are you likely to call with are you a chaser or not) the question is whether he calls you on the turn, and could you bet a bit more on the river.

not many people are so easily persuaded to fold their overpairs so it does depend on your opposition.

[Sheriff Fatman]

With hindsight, having seen his hand, you could probably have got more out of him by betting the turn, given that he has the  in his hands.  However, you don't know this at the time and against a 'typical' distribution of hands you'd probably expect him to fold to a bet on the turn, given that your hand is so huge and the board is 'scary'.

Don't beat yourself up too much about it.  I think seeing his hand has affected you, but probably 9 times out of 10 in this situation you'll get a fold to any bet, on the turn or river.  I think you played it fine.

Sheriff

[boldie]

With hindsight, having seen his hand, you could probably have got more out of him by betting the turn, given that he has the  in his hands.  However, you don't know this at the time and against a 'typical' distribution of hands you'd probably expect him to fold to a bet on the turn, given that your hand is so huge and the board is 'scary'.

Don't beat yourself up too much about it.  I think seeing his hand has affected you, but probably 9 times out of 10 in this situation you'll get a fold to any bet, on the turn or river.  I think you played it fine.

Sheriff

why not just reraise the flop.,..you've made quads and he won't take you for them...He probably won't even take you for trips.

[booder]

With hindsight, having seen his hand, you could probably have got more out of him by betting the turn, given that he has the  in his hands.  However, you don't know this at the time and against a 'typical' distribution of hands you'd probably expect him to fold to a bet on the turn, given that your hand is so huge and the board is 'scary'.

Don't beat yourself up too much about it.  I think seeing his hand has affected you, but probably 9 times out of 10 in this situation you'll get a fold to any bet, on the turn or river.  I think you played it fine.

Sheriff

why not just reraise the flop.,..you've made quads and he won't take you for them...He probably won't even take you for trips.

i didnt reraise on the flop,as he could well have had AK and i lose my customer.i was hoping to get at least one other bet out of him and by just calling i give him a turn card to try and improve his hand further.as it happened a heart probably killed any major action and my bet on the end is small enough for him to call with an overpair ,or for him to move all in if he thinks he has me beat.

[boldie]

With hindsight, having seen his hand, you could probably have got more out of him by betting the turn, given that he has the  in his hands.  However, you don't know this at the time and against a 'typical' distribution of hands you'd probably expect him to fold to a bet on the turn, given that your hand is so huge and the board is 'scary'.

Don't beat yourself up too much about it.  I think seeing his hand has affected you, but probably 9 times out of 10 in this situation you'll get a fold to any bet, on the turn or river.  I think you played it fine.

Sheriff

why not just reraise the flop.,..you've made quads and he won't take you for them...He probably won't even take you for trips.

i didnt reraise on the flop,as he could well have had AK and i lose my customer.i was hoping to get at least one other bet out of him and by just calling i give him a turn card to try and improve his hand further.as it happened a heart probably killed any major action and my bet on the end is small enough for him to call with an overpair ,or for him to move all in if he thinks he has me beat.

fair point

[GrannyDee]

I would re-raise allin on that the flop. The way your opponent played the hand pre-flop indicates a big pocket and by raising allin your hand is disguised as I believe your opponent is much more likely to put you on a semi-bluff or an overpair than a nine or indeed quads in this case.

[theplayer_uk]

Preflop can be a fold sometimes, flop is the easiest call ever, bet turn.

[The Baron]

With the pre flop action the only customer you are going to lose by raising this flop is AK unless he really has junk, but I think this can be discounted by his post flop bet of $50.

So IMO a raise on the flop will work most of the time except the odd player who has AK. I think it's worth the risk though as more often than not you'll "stack" the guy with the overpair and this is a winning play in the long run IMO.

I would definately bet the turn after his check, some small like 1/3 to 1/2 pot hoping for a raise but wanting a least a flush draw's call and I would value bet the river as you did.

[NoflopsHomer]

I move in on the flop, if you call, he's slowing down even if an A or K comes which isn't that likely. A flat call looks scary, that's why you should move in, how can AA, KK and QQ pass? They can't because why would you move in with a lock hand there?

[theplayer_uk]

I move in on the flop, if you call, he's slowing down even if an A or K comes which isn't that likely. A flat call looks scary, that's why you should move in, how can AA, KK and QQ pass? They can't because why would you move in with a lock hand there?

lol, AA is never slowing down here if you call the flop. PF call is also pretty thin.

[Sheriff Fatman]

I move in on the flop, if you call, he's slowing down even if an A or K comes which isn't that likely. A flat call looks scary, that's why you should move in, how can AA, KK and QQ pass? They can't because why would you move in with a lock hand there?

If I've got QQ or KK there and you move in then I seriously consider folding.  I don't fear 99 as much as I fear a higher overpair or  and my equity isn't good against that range.

Many people holiding the overpair in Booder's position will make the 'panic' play here with AA or KK and jam to protect against a potential flush draw.  If the opponent reads it as such he could well fold so I think its a -EV play to push the flop with 99.  Its not a situation where you're going to get called 100% of the time.

[theplayer_uk]

I move in on the flop, if you call, he's slowing down even if an A or K comes which isn't that likely. A flat call looks scary, that's why you should move in, how can AA, KK and QQ pass? They can't because why would you move in with a lock hand there?

If I've got QQ or KK there and you move in then I seriously consider folding.  I don't fear 99 as much as I fear a higher overpair or  and my equity isn't good against that range.

Many people holiding the overpair in Booder's position will make the 'panic' play here with AA or KK and jam to protect against a potential flush draw.  If the opponent reads it as such he could well fold so I think its a -EV play to push the flop with 99.  Its not a situation where you're going to get called 100% of the time.

a -EV play to push with 99 on a 99x board, please stop, I am crying

[Sheriff Fatman]

OK then Mr Pedantic its lower EV than not pushing the flop.  There are approaches with higher expectation than this as you eliminate the folds as outlined above.

Happy now?