Some hands for discussion - 1

[M3boy]

Game #4186296964: Hold'em NL ($0.50/$1) - 2007/01/16 - 13:44:21 (UK)
Table "Deuceofhearts" Seat 2 is the button.
Seat 1: blomstret ($146 in chips)
Seat 2: __echo__ ($76.07 in chips)
Seat 3: M3Boy ($97.50 in chips)
Seat 4: leftfoot ($91.75 in chips)
Seat 5: Eldorko ($125.50 in chips)
Seat 6: Lppy123 ($100 in chips)
M3Boy: posts small blind $0.50
leftfoot: posts big blind $1
----- HOLE CARDS -----
dealt to M3Boy [ ]
Eldorko: folds
Lppy123: folds
blomstret: folds
__echo__: raises to $4
M3Boy: calls $3.50
leftfoot: calls $3
----- FLOP ----- [ Ah ]
M3Boy: checks
leftfoot: checks
__echo__: checks
----- TURN ----- [ Ah ][]
M3Boy: bets $7
leftfoot: folds
__echo__: raises to $21

What do you do?

[Jim-D]

 

[WellChief]

Three-bet it, doesn't need to be quite all in, just do whatever you can to build the pot enough to eventually get all his chips in.

[Smart Money]

With no other info on opponent- call turn bet, and call river bet.

Players will often check a flopped monster after raising pre-flop. When an opponent fails to put in a continuation bet and then shows strength on the turn, which was very unlikely to have helped them, you have to be very wary. There is a good chance he has a set of aces here, and if not then he's not calling an all-in unless he has AJ (unlikely) or lower set (unlikely as he should have bet flop) or T9 (possible hand as he raised from button.)

[Smart Money]

*Just calling may seem extremely passive, but his play is typical of either a very strong hand or a bluff, and this often saves you money when you're behind/makes you money when you're ahead.

[booder]

against this player i repop it.......he has a wide range of raising hands and i am pretty sure you are well ahead. he prob has A 10 or A J

[WellChief]

There's so many hands that you're crushing and will call a 3-bet that he might have not bet the flop with here.  A8, A7, AK even, 8's, 7's, J7/J8. 

[Smart Money]

Well, as it so often does, it comes down to your knowledge of the player. That flop should not be checked with any of those holdings- A8, A7, AK, 88, or 77, and he shouldn't be raising 4xBB, even from the button, with J8 or J7 in cash.

I'm not disagreeing with what you say that they are hands that he may have played like this- just that they shouldn't (generally) be played like this. So if I did have info on him, and I didn't rate him then I would be more aggressive. However I would probably wait to raise on the turn or river as this gives him another chance to bluff if he is holding nothing.

(I'd still be very wary of a set of aces though )

[Royal Flush]

With no other info on opponent- call turn bet, and call river bet.

Players will often check a flopped monster after raising pre-flop. When an opponent fails to put in a continuation bet and then shows strength on the turn, which was very unlikely to have helped them, you have to be very wary. There is a good chance he has a set of aces here, and if not then he's not calling an all-in unless he has AJ (unlikely) or lower set (unlikely as he should have bet flop) or T9 (possible hand as he raised from button.)

This seems truely bizarre logic, why is top set checked and 2nd or 3rd set bet? I really do not get this!

Paul i would re-raise pre flop, now i am in this situation its got to be a 3 bet...........i think.

[boldie]

yep a 3bet would do nicely here.

[M3boy]

Here is what happened :

M3Boy: calls $14
----- RIVER ----- [ Ah ][]
M3Boy: checks
__echo__: bets $51.07 and is all-in
M3Boy: calls $51.07
----- SHOW DOWN -----
__echo__: shows [ ] (A Straight, Jack high)
M3Boy: shows [ ] (Three of a kind, Jacks, Ace high)
__echo__ collected $153.14 from Main pot
----- SUMMARY -----
Total pot $156.14 Main pot $153.14 Rake $3
Board [ Ah ]
Seat 1: blomstret folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 2: __echo__ (button) showed [ ] and won ($153.14) with A Straight, Jack high
Seat 3: M3Boy (small blind) showed [ ] and lost with Three of a kind, Jacks, Ace high
Seat 4: leftfoot (big blind) folded on the Turn
Seat 5: Eldorko folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 6: Lppy123 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
****HAND ENDS****

Badly played hand by me, but did any of you put the guy on T 7 ?

[Royal Flush]

Thats the problem with flat calling pre flop imo, his range is huge and its hard to know how to play against such a large range.

[boldie]

Thats the problem with flat calling pre flop imo, his range is huge and its hard to know how to play against such a large range.

yep...and also once he moves in on the river any ten kills you now. I have to say I don't like the call to have invested 21$ into the pot and then call a river bet for 51$ when any ten kills you. I reckon you'd have to give it up on the river to be honest. But I might be the only one on that one.

[M3boy]

Thats the problem with flat calling pre flop imo, his range is huge and its hard to know how to play against such a large range.

Totally agree, never usually flat call.

One mistake just led to another, and I donked off my stack to him

[booder]

against this player i repop it.......he has a wide range of raising hands and i am pretty sure you are well ahead. he prob has A 10 or A J