Vegas & The Aftermath - Diary

[Mango99]

Interesting stuff. I've been done out of £3k by a world famous grimmer, a few other people for a couple of hundred here and there (including some people on the circuit I'd have considered to be friends).

I now never lend any money. Once (or 8 or 9 times) bitten and all that. What's the point? The best result you get is that you get it back. Hooray!

[kinboshi]

Do they love their mums these Adamses?

Let's hope so.

That way we can class them as great guys same as the Krays etc.

I bet you don't have to lock your front door on their street either.

True gentlemen.

This.

It's also funny that none of these gangsters ever hurt non-villains, ever.  Amazing judgement and refrain they show.

[tikay]

I want to reply to some of this stuff, & I've already forgotten yesterday's aide memoir, but I gotta go do some work.

I blame Ralph for wasting 5 hours of my day. I stuck up a list of things I wanted to wriite about, Ralph stepped in to ask about one (Mad Frankie Fraser) & off we all went!

I must reply to one more though.

[luther101]

I used to work with a guy who was an ex-pro, and a trainer at Repton Boxing Club (a 'proper' tough sort)   .....       his views on Lenny McLean wouldn't tally with yours Tikay.

He'd 'done the doors' all over London over the years, and reckoned the 'Big Man' was an out and out bully - citing an occasion when LM had punched a young peed up student, for no real reason, at a 'do' where they were providing the security     .....       the poor sod suffered brain damage, and ended up in a wheelchair for the rest of his life.

Maybe he wasn't quite the gentleman the stories make him out to be!

[AndrewT]

I used to work with a guy who was an ex-pro, and a trainer at Repton Boxing Club (a 'proper' tough sort)   .....       his views on Lenny McLean wouldn't tally with yours Tikay.

He'd 'done the doors' all over London over the years, and reckoned the 'Big Man' was an out and out bully - citing an occasion when LM had punched a young peed up student, for no real reason, at a 'do' where they were providing the security     .....       the poor sod suffered brain damage, and ended up in a wheelchair for the rest of his life.

Maybe he wasn't quite the gentleman the stories make him out to be!

I'd wager that nearly all these 'gentleman criminal' types were just like that - common bullies.

[gatso]

A geezer called Noye arranged for it's sale, but all the money he receved he paid into his Bank, a little branch in the West Country, so naturally, it looked sussy, & proved his undoing. The cops were on to him, & staked out his house. Something went off, a copper got shot dead in his garden by Noye, but Noye got off on grounds of "self-defence". Ho hum.

Later, the Red-Tops got on his case after a so-called "Road-Rage" incident in which a geezer got shot in his car. Not self-defence this time, & Noye get life. But it was not Road-Rage, Noye & the other geezer were known to each other, both were drug dealers, & it was a dispute over money. Unpaid money.

noye was a snitch, not sure whether that was prior to the first killing and that's why he got off or whether he turned informant in order to get let off

he was on the run out of the country for a couple of years after the second killing but was regularly spotted in a chinese restaurant near brands hatch

[tikay]

Cash.J?

The Man in Black?

Yes.

I'm having a JC week in the car, and some of his lyrics are spectacularly good, he makes it seem so natural.

Others are incredibly cheesy, but still well-put together. "This old Flag (?) is the cheesiest, but I still listen to it over & over.

Here's one part of "Sunday Morning Coming Down".

Well, I woke up Sunday morning
With no way to hold my head that didn't hurt.
And the beer I had for breakfast wasn't bad,
So I had one more for dessert.
Then I fumbled in my closet through my clothes
And found my cleanest dirty shirt.
Then I washed my face and combed my hair
And stumbled down the stairs to meet the day.

Tennessee Flat Top-Box

In a little cabaret in a South Texas border town,
Sat a boy and his guitar, and the people came from all around.
And all the girls from there to Austin,
Were slippin' away from home and puttin' jewelery in hock.
To take the trip, to go and listen,
To the little dark-haired boy who played the Tennessee flat top box.

Well, he couldn't ride or wrangle, and he never cared to make a dime.
But give him his guitar, and he'd be happy all the time.
And all the girls from nine to ninety,
Were snapping fingers, tapping toes, and begging him: "Don't stop."
And hypnotized and fascinated,
By the little dark-haired boy who played the Tennessee flat top box.

Then one day he was gone, and no one ever saw him 'round,
He'd vanished like the breeze, they forgot him in the little town.
But all the girls still dreamed about him.
And hung around the cabaret until the doors were locked.
And then one day on the Hit Parade,
Was a little dark-haired boy who played the Tennessee flat top box.

[kinboshi]

I used to work with a guy who was an ex-pro, and a trainer at Repton Boxing Club (a 'proper' tough sort)   .....       his views on Lenny McLean wouldn't tally with yours Tikay.

He'd 'done the doors' all over London over the years, and reckoned the 'Big Man' was an out and out bully - citing an occasion when LM had punched a young peed up student, for no real reason, at a 'do' where they were providing the security     .....       the poor sod suffered brain damage, and ended up in a wheelchair for the rest of his life.

Maybe he wasn't quite the gentleman the stories make him out to be!

I'd wager that nearly all these 'gentleman criminal' types were just like that - common bullies.

How do they become such hard-men and well-known and feared gangsters without beating the crap out of people?  Then a myth comes about and they become modern day Robin Hoods.

[tikay]

I love this, too.

Well the farmer prayed for a better year
And the crops were good like the Lord did hear
But this barn burned down with winter near
The answer came in white and black in the farmer's almanac
It says if a man could have half his wishes he could double his trouble

A sweet old lady was eighty-four when her kinfolks came for a month or more
Now from overwork she's on the other shore
Much too late was y'all come back and it says in the farmer's almanac
It says visitors and fish smell after three days

Our leader was a silver tongued man he deceived the people of the land
And when he got caught he couldn't stand
It's a little off-beat and a little off-track but it says in the farmer's almanac
It says in rivers and bad government the lightest things flow to the top

Rod said I don't believe in God Rod died and lies beneath the sod
For God did not believe in Rod
Life is a troubled and a weary track but it says in the farmer's almanac
It says feed your faith and your doubts will starve to death

The little boy followed the honeybee and it flew straight to the honey-tree
He got stung but got the honey free
Consolation for the things you lack is in the farmer's almanac
It says God gives us the darkness so we can see the stars

He came home three hours late from work said I had a flat and fell in the dirt
She said and got lipstick on your shirt
Well it turned out like Jill and Jack and it says in the farmer's almanac
It says lies have to be covered up truth can run around naked

He said honey you know I'm true I just look at other women that's all I do
Then she caught him with her best friend Peggy Sue
Sometimes some women will look back and it says in the farmer's almanac
It says there's a lot of difference in window-shoppin' and shop-liftin'

I sat down at a shoeshine stand I had a real slow shoeshine man
I said you don't pop that rag like some of 'em can
He looked at me and then he sat right back it says in the farmer's almanac
It says the trouble with the world today is
There's too much poppin' and not enough shinin'

[tikay]

I used to work with a guy who was an ex-pro, and a trainer at Repton Boxing Club (a 'proper' tough sort)   .....       his views on Lenny McLean wouldn't tally with yours Tikay.

He'd 'done the doors' all over London over the years, and reckoned the 'Big Man' was an out and out bully - citing an occasion when LM had punched a young peed up student, for no real reason, at a 'do' where they were providing the security     .....       the poor sod suffered brain damage, and ended up in a wheelchair for the rest of his life.

Maybe he wasn't quite the gentleman the stories make him out to be!

I'd wager that nearly all these 'gentleman criminal' types were just like that - common bullies.

How do they become such hard-men and well-known and feared gangsters without beating the crap out of people?  Then a myth comes about and they become modern day Robin Hoods.

I don't ask you or anyone else to like or respect them, & I'm not fussed if you do or not - you miss the point completely!

I'm a regular person, & I have some weird ideas about stuff, & I know it makes no sense at all to many. But I can't come on here & tell porkies!

 

[tikay]

I used to work with a guy who was an ex-pro, and a trainer at Repton Boxing Club (a 'proper' tough sort)   .....       his views on Lenny McLean wouldn't tally with yours Tikay.

He'd 'done the doors' all over London over the years, and reckoned the 'Big Man' was an out and out bully - citing an occasion when LM had punched a young peed up student, for no real reason, at a 'do' where they were providing the security     .....       the poor sod suffered brain damage, and ended up in a wheelchair for the rest of his life.

Maybe he wasn't quite the gentleman the stories make him out to be!

Yes, quite possibly/probably. There is usually much embellishment in so many of these stories.

[Woodsey]

How do you stand on Lenny Mclean Tikay?

And his famous fight(s) with Roy Shaw?

Lenny = Proper Legend, THE best of his kind. He was a wonderful bloke. By trade he "minded doors".

I think he was genuinely, the hardest man in Brotain, by any standard. And a good man too, believe it or not.

He was in LS&2SB. I'll bring some photo's of Lenny in from his book - it's a terrific read, really.

I think he fought Shaw twice, or was it 3 times? I can't recall, but it as a very big thing at the time.

I remember seeing this guy in real life many times before he was well known. He used to work the door of the hippodrome in Leicester square, London, which I used to go to a lot when I was a student 18-19 years ago. The first time I saw him, I did a double take on him, he was the sort of bloke that just caught your eye, he is very distinctive looking in real life. I thought bloody hell he looks really hard, he was absolutely massive and looked like a bulldog, you just would not mess with him. I only clocked who he was a few years down the line when he started appearing in the media a bit and, I instantly recognised him from back then, he's the sort of guy you just don't forget.

[thetank]

the entire internet

juuuune, just do the copy paste thing of the url

[tikay]

A geezer called Noye arranged for it's sale, but all the money he receved he paid into his Bank, a little branch in the West Country, so naturally, it looked sussy, & proved his undoing. The cops were on to him, & staked out his house. Something went off, a copper got shot dead in his garden by Noye, but Noye got off on grounds of "self-defence". Ho hum.

Later, the Red-Tops got on his case after a so-called "Road-Rage" incident in which a geezer got shot in his car. Not self-defence this time, & Noye get life. But it was not Road-Rage, Noye & the other geezer were known to each other, both were drug dealers, & it was a dispute over money. Unpaid money.

noye was a snitch, not sure whether that was prior to the first killing and that's why he got off or whether he turned informant in order to get let off

he was on the run out of the country for a couple of years after the second killing but was regularly spotted in a chinese restaurant near brands hatch

Thanks gatters,

Noye was not a proper villain, he was a piece of shit. Drug-dealer, says it all.

Protection rackets ftw, makes for better heroes.

[gatso]

word is he was a bit higher up the chain than being a drug dealer, there was quite a crime syndicate operating from that area of kent in the 90s, doubt the story will ever come out though