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| | | |-+  "Dusk till Dawn" Poker Club In Nottingham Diary (by Rob Yong)
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Author Topic: "Dusk till Dawn" Poker Club In Nottingham Diary (by Rob Yong)  (Read 525522 times)
ripple11
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« Reply #1275 on: April 26, 2007, 05:24:43 PM »


 I mean the objectors are just ****** themselves laughing.....why cant Magistrates see that its a case of the big multi nationals bulling and objecting for the sake of it?.Why cant they see that the whole business/operation needed to be set up to get the gambling licence, and that a delay in opening will cost thousands.So so unfair. Its not even direct competition for the majority of their income, ie Casino games.
 This is a privately owned company ,who have invested millions regenerating the building/area,125 NEW jobs on offer....and a huge amount of income that will come in to LOCAL ancillary businesses...restaurants,hotels,taxis,clubs,etc. from the customers, and no doubt thousands being spent locally on the running/upkeep of the club.

You really feel like making a lot of noise to a lot of people....but on the other hand you dont want to rock the boat to create more problems.


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kinboshi
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« Reply #1276 on: April 26, 2007, 05:27:09 PM »


 I mean the objectors are just ****** themselves laughing.....why cant Magistrates see that its a case of the big multi nationals bulling and objecting for the sake of it?.Why cant they see that the whole business/operation needed to be set up to get the gambling licence, and that a delay in opening will cost thousands.So so unfair. Its not even direct competition for the majority of their income, ie Casino games.
 This is a privately owned company ,who have invested millions regenerating the building/area,125 NEW jobs on offer....and a huge amount of income that will come in to LOCAL ancillary businesses...restaurants,hotels,taxis,clubs,etc. from the customers, and no doubt thousands being spent locally on the running/upkeep of the club.

You really feel like making a lot of noise to a lot of people....but on the other hand you dont want to rock the boat to create more problems.


I have some thoughts on that.
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M3boy
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« Reply #1277 on: April 26, 2007, 05:57:56 PM »

Amazes me why it has been postponed for 5 months! - Other than pure delay tactics.

Im sure that a court somewhere in the land has a 4day slot way before September!

Why can this not be heard in another court?
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« Reply #1278 on: April 26, 2007, 06:04:40 PM »

Why can this not be heard in another court?

I would imagine it has to be Nottingham Magistrates.
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« Reply #1279 on: April 26, 2007, 06:06:22 PM »

anyone fancy an email campaign?

we get set email written by one of the more articulate members of the forum explaining the problems of the big compaines trying to stop compertition and we all email them to ITN,BBC, Sky News our MPs etc etc etc maybe even the monpolies and mergies people first they take gutshot to court for not going down proper channels but when DTD goes down proper channels and get the approval of the gaming commision they put a 5 month block on the whole project this could possible cripple a project with has overheards and no income
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« Reply #1280 on: April 26, 2007, 06:10:23 PM »

Its been very busy (and very very disappointing) today as you would expect. Radio, TV, magazines have all been contacting us, and wanting to speak to me.  I have tried my best to speak with as many people as possible about the 5 month adjournment handed out by Nottingham Magistrates Court today (effectively a 8 months adjournment as you will see below). However, its hard saying the same thing over and over again.

Anyway, for those of you that are interested in what happened today here is a summary:

1. Gala, Stanley and LCI legal council arrived, only LCI brought one of their own employees to the hearing, I had a chat with him, seemed a very nice chap. Stanley and LCI are not open yet in Nottingham, but have already obtained their licences.

2. The Court Clerk explained that due to the fact there is 3 Objectors, the case could not be heard today, and must be adjourned to a date in the future.

3. He consulted each objector, LIC were very co-operative, saying they would make themselves available, but Gala said they could not make another hearing till March 2008, and Stanley said that would suit them better.

4. My legal council, Andrew Woods, objected to these dates, stressing that DTD was effectively financed by an "individual" rather than a "large corporate", and in the end, the court and the legal representives "negotiated" a date of the 24th - 27th September 2007.

5. That was it! 20 minutes........all over

What does this mean, well to be honest, its just one disaster after another. These are the steps I have had to go through which have caused all the delays, I had originally hoped the open this club in April 2006 lol ....

1. Had to secure premises before I could apply for a Certificate of Consent from the UK Gambling Commission

2. Had to change the premiese us to a "new" catergory, the old use used for casinos for past 10 years was replaced by a new code

3. Could not start work on the refit due to point 2 above

4. Well documented delays with the Gambling Commissions, ending with being reported for "illegal online gaming" by certain Uk casinos

5. Finally get my Certificate of Consent in Feb 2007

6. Told today that my hearing has been adjorned to Sept 07 due to the casino objections

7. Told that I cannot apply for employee (dealers etc) licencees UNTIL I have got licence from Magistrates Court - will take another 3 months

So, realistically, lets say I get the local licence on the 27th September, apply for the dealer licences in October, I cannot open this club legally till January 2008, a total of 18 months delay, and at running costs (excluding online costs) of £75,000 per month on wages and premises costs (its £25k per month just for the building!), clearly I am facing a serious problem, even Richard Branson would find this hard to swallow, and I am Vauxhall Conference (no - saturday morning football) compared to his Premiership status.

However, some of the stuff the media and others are saying is a little exagerated, I mean, I just noticed a figure of £7m quoted on the BBC web site which is was way overestimated, I'd be living on a bowl of rice under a trent bridge if I had really donked that amount of money off on Dusk Till Dawn. I also heard recently from a couple of sources inside the poker world that I'd spent a lot more than I was letting on and was way over budget and DTD was going to financially collapse, things are not "great", but this is not the case.

So, what has happened has really happened, I cannot change this, the responsibility for this hole I fnd myself in, is of course, my own. Being honest, I did not plan this venture very well, I went with gut feel and passion to do something different, to be the first legal and largest poker venue in the UK. I never needed to take on these risks, but I ignored some pretty basic business rules, it was not for financial gain, but for the challenge. I also hugely underestimated the task of "becoming legal" for a "regular joe" like me. Let's face it, its not like I have could say to these casinos, "hey, don't object to DTD in Nottingham, and I won't object to your new casino application in Manchester".

Where to now? The answer is I do not know. To be legal DTD cannot open for 8/9 months, a further loss of £600k+, to open illegally would mean that my Certificate of Consent would be revoked and I would be in the same boat as the Gutshot. The online business has only made a small loss (not bad for a start up really), incidental to the capital, set-up and running costs of the live club.

Anyway, these are the facts, you guys have followed me from the beginning, things have taken a turn for the worse, I need to look at these implications after a night's sleep.

On the positive side, one of my dogs, "Numpty", is recovering well from his leg operation.

Cheers Rob
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« Reply #1281 on: April 26, 2007, 06:18:05 PM »

jeez, it makes me feel sick, keep the faith.

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« Reply #1282 on: April 26, 2007, 06:19:43 PM »

3. He consulted each objector, LIC were very co-operative, saying they would make themselves available, but Gala said they could not make another hearing till March 2008, and Stanley said that would suit them better.

4. My legal council, Andrew Woods, objected to these dates, stressing that DTD was effectively financed by an "individual" rather than a "large corporate", and in the end, the court and the legal representives "negotiated" a date of the 24th - 27th September 2007.

I know there are proper legal avenues to go down, but are you able to make the magistrates aware that delaying things until you go bust is exactly what the casinos want - they don't actually want a hearing any time soon? In which case adjournment is actually a victory for them.
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« Reply #1283 on: April 26, 2007, 06:51:09 PM »

3. He consulted each objector, LIC were very co-operative, saying they would make themselves available, but Gala said they could not make another hearing till March 2008, and Stanley said that would suit them better.

4. My legal council, Andrew Woods, objected to these dates, stressing that DTD was effectively financed by an "individual" rather than a "large corporate", and in the end, the court and the legal representives "negotiated" a date of the 24th - 27th September 2007.

I know there are proper legal avenues to go down, but are you able to make the magistrates aware that delaying things until you go bust is exactly what the casinos want - they don't actually want a hearing any time soon? In which case adjournment is actually a victory for them.

Magistrates don't allow human logic in their courts unfortunatly..that's the problem with the law.
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« Reply #1284 on: April 26, 2007, 07:10:19 PM »

Gala are missing the point. DTD will save them money.

I've been going to Notts Gala 4 years and have stake precisely £0 on their table games. I pay £1 for a coke in the bar before the game, pay the £2.50 for my carpark on my way out but in between I use there facilities and drink the free coffees. Me being in there costs them money.

I'm far from the only player like that. You'd think they'd be keen for a poker only club so they could concentrate on their gamblers more.
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« Reply #1285 on: April 26, 2007, 07:17:50 PM »

Absolutely gutted for you all .
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« Reply #1286 on: April 26, 2007, 07:23:50 PM »

gutted,but not at all surprise.

so sorry for you rob and everyone involved in DTD

FRAN
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« Reply #1287 on: April 26, 2007, 07:24:17 PM »

Disgraceful is the only word that describes all this. I would consider the monopolies commision as the big groups are trying to stop you trading legally by a stalling process which could force you into running the club illegally. The rules and regulations are all changing in september anyway so the goalposts will no doubt move again
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« Reply #1288 on: April 26, 2007, 07:26:15 PM »

fancy doing a job on stanleys gaffer ari?

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M3boy
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« Reply #1289 on: April 26, 2007, 07:28:25 PM »

Why can this not be heard in another court?

I would imagine it has to be Nottingham Magistrates.

I do not see why.

Arguments will be put foward by both parties, why does it matter where it is held?
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