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Author Topic: Diary Of A Fenland Punterer  (Read 143210 times)
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« Reply #165 on: January 16, 2011, 01:26:07 PM »

I don't get it. At all. What's the point of having a £50 acca on five or six big guns every Saturday? What's your edge and what do you suppose you know that the bookies don't?
Bookies must love'em. Doing the same old bets even though the Premiership is far more competitive now and anyone can beat anyone on any given day. GG long term innit?

People pick loads of accas then see the pay out odds then can't resist chucking a couple of 1/3's in the mix to bump up the returns a little. Bookies absolutely love them.



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« Reply #166 on: January 16, 2011, 01:36:44 PM »

I don't get it. At all. What's the point of having a £50 acca on five or six big guns every Saturday? What's your edge and what do you suppose you know that the bookies don't?
Bookies must love'em. Doing the same old bets even though the Premiership is far more competitive now and anyone can beat anyone on any given day. GG long term innit?

Betting is no different to Poker in that respect. A little bit of clever money, &  lot of no-hopers.

I learned early doors, when I worked in a bookies on a Saturday, as a settler. (Pre-Genies & Computers, all settling done in the head).

I worked for a Jewish guy, right sharp he was, & he taught me, as did the betting slips, the folly of multiples & accas. "They can beat me once, now & then they can beat me twice, very rarely can they beat me 3 times" he'd say of the Multiple backers. It's like wining at roulette & leaving the winnings on the number.

I was, maybe, 20, & wet behind the ears as to Betting, but I had sole responsibility for settlng all the multiples. In those day, they had something called the "ITV Seven", & the armchair punters loved it. I'd start of with a pile of slips 6 inches high, & work through them after every race. By race three, I'd rarely have a few dozen left, by race 4, it would be 3 or 4.

Dickie Davies would be on the Telly, & after a 20/1 shot romped home in the first, he'd yell "wow, GREAT start to the ITV 7, a 20/1 shot means everyone has £2 going onto Leg 2". And my man would sit there, chewing his fat cigar, smiling quietly.

If it were a favs day, Dickie would say "BAD news for the punters, the ITV 7 is only £400 today", & I'm thinking, "is this bloke MAD?"!

I did the "Board", too, priced it up off Extel, & I had this weird stupid thing of writing 3/2 instead of 6/4, & 10/3 instead of 100/30. Without fail, punters would complain, "oi, they quoted 6/4 not 3/2 you thieving bastard". One day I said "sorry mate, my mistake, I'll let you have a tenner at 11/8", & the geezer bit my hand off.
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« Reply #167 on: January 16, 2011, 01:38:18 PM »


I always wanted to mix with gambing peeps, card players, those sorts. This thread is heaven, I'm right in my zone here.

I'll try not to hijack it though.

 scared
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« Reply #168 on: January 16, 2011, 01:39:01 PM »


I adore seeing the "other side" of a bookmaker, it fulfils my urge to bet, without even betting.

I was thinking it must be pretty interesting to see behind the scenes what's going on
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« Reply #169 on: January 16, 2011, 01:40:13 PM »

I don't get it. At all. What's the point of having a £50 acca on five or six big guns every Saturday? What's your edge and what do you suppose you know that the bookies don't?
Bookies must love'em. Doing the same old bets even though the Premiership is far more competitive now and anyone can beat anyone on any given day. GG long term innit?

Betting is no different to Poker in that respect. A little bit of clever money, &  lot of no-hopers.

I learned early doors, when I worked in a bookies on a Saturday, as a settler. (Pre-Genies & Computers, all settling done in the head).

I worked for a Jewish guy, right sharp he was, & he taught me, as did the betting slips, the folly of multiples & accas. "They can beat me once, now & then they can beat me twice, very rarely can they beat me 3 times" he'd say of the Multiple backers. It's like wining at roulette & leaving the winnings on the number.

I was, maybe, 20, & wet behind the ears as to Betting, but I had sole responsibility for settlng all the multiples. In those day, they had something called the "ITV Seven", & the armchair punters loved it. I'd start of with a pile of slips 6 inches high, & work through them after every race. By race three, I'd rarely have a few dozen left, by race 4, it would be 3 or 4.

Dickie Davies would be on the Telly, & after a 20/1 shot romped home in the first, he'd yell "wow, GREAT start to the ITV 7, a 20/1 shot means everyone has £2 going onto Leg 2". And my man would sit there, chewing his fat cigar, smiling quietly.

If it were a favs day, Dickie would say "BAD news for the punters, the ITV 7 is only £400 today", & I'm thinking, "is this bloke MAD?"!

I did the "Board", too, priced it up off Extel, & I had this weird stupid thing of writing 3/2 instead of 6/4, & 10/3 instead of 100/30. Without fail, punters would complain, "oi, they quoted 6/4 not 3/2 you thieving bastard". One day I said "sorry mate, my mistake, I'll let you have a tenner at 11/8", & the geezer bit my hand off.

Aye, weighty win singles scare the bookie. nothing else.
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« Reply #170 on: January 16, 2011, 02:14:54 PM »

Aah, jumpers for goalsposts...

The ITV7 was before my time but love a bit of reminiscing about the good old days spent in bookies. All afternoon a lot of days the two years I was in the sixth form. Only ever 10p yankees, or 20p each-way doubles back then though.

Then over to the snooker club to play the quiz machine for a change of pace occasionally. We used to pwn that. Me and a guy called Nick Robinson, who's now a postman round these parts. Saw him a few weeks ago. Asked him if he still gambled. "No", he said. "Why not?". "Because I used to lose all the time". Good enough reason I guess.

Myself and two others from school were always in there, Mark McAteer and Paul 'Bullshit' Barnes. No idea what became of either of them. Paul Barnes picked up his nickname after backing a horse called El Toro one day and coming out with some ridic tale of being chased by a bull somewhere or other. Can't remember the exact story but it was pretty standard for him.

Then there was 'Shouty Waitrose Bag'. Guess I've always been one for nicks thinking about it. He used to shout home every winner - he sure did back any of them - and always carried a Waitrose carrier bag with him. Dunno what was in it. Probably road kill but never looked. Inspired piece of nicknamery though obv.

Overriding memories are of prices being penned up on the board by a miserable old Scotch woman. Also, the smell of the carbon copies you used to keep. Ladbrokes slips. Loved that smell. And smoking. A lot. And the Extel commentaries with final furlongs lasting about two minutes and every horse getting a mention.

Think that's why I have fonder memories of horses from back then. There were no pictures so you could only form a sort of mental picture of what they were like from their names.

These names probably won't mean a lot to anyone else but they give me a bit of the warm and fuzzies. Chasers like Kincses, Palace Yard, Yangtse Kiang, The Welder, and sprinters like Cree Bay, Philip, Felipe Toro, Powder Blue, King Charlemagne, Sharlies Wimpy, Vorvados, Valley Mills. Aah, yep, jumpers for goalposts.

I've been thinking about buying a horse recently but have sort of gone off the idea. Just don't have the same connection to horses that I used to, apart from the odd one like Kauto Star. Plus it's farking expensive.
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« Reply #171 on: January 16, 2011, 02:33:26 PM »

Ahhh the old Extel commentaries, they were something else weren't they?

"There's one fallen, can't quite make it out........." followed by a pregnant pause with all punters holding their collective breath.

And the warm glow of "drawing away and winning easily" when yours was the aforementioned.

Being called first in a photo made you about a 1/6 shot as I recall.

Happy days.

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« Reply #172 on: January 16, 2011, 02:41:16 PM »

Ahhh the old Extel commentaries, they were something else weren't they?

"There's one fallen, can't quite make it out........." followed by a pregnant pause with all punters holding their collective breath.

And the warm glow of "drawing away and winning easily" when yours was the aforementioned.

Being called first in a photo made you about a 1/6 shot as I recall.

Happy days.



Extel was the nuts.

If your horse hadn't been mentioned it was cantering in behind and the commentator hadn't noticed it (in your minds eye anyway).
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« Reply #173 on: January 16, 2011, 03:29:11 PM »


I adore seeing the "other side" of a bookmaker, it fulfils my urge to bet, without even betting.

I was thinking it must be pretty interesting to see behind the scenes what's going on

Interesting? I LOVE it. Every day, 10am on the dot, yesterday's numbers come through. Leave me alone boys, I need to study every line.

The World Cup was awesome. Before every match we got a Memo which gave all the liabilities in each match, we had big TV plasmas in every single office. It coincided with the SB&G year end - 30th June - so our whole year could have swung several £mill either way based upon it. (God bless England, all targets met).

Ditto the "big" punting days - Derby Day, Grand National Day, Boxing Day. We went into mourning on Boxing day this year, footie, racing all cancelled. Such a shame. So all the money migrated across the platform to Sky Vegas, & Sky Poker. Sky Poker's Xmas started on the day the snow started in late November. It's still Xmas there, too. Bingo is off the graph, an amazing uptick.  The business model fascinates, the way it all works together so well.

For "Bet" (Sky Bet), each evening we get a "Business Mix", broken into every sport covered, maybe 25 or 30 different books. It comes in before the football kicks off, & again, after the football ends, so we know where the liabilities are pretty early. Typically, on a Sunday, the book liability is not cleared until after the Spanish footie in the evening. Today, the accas will include the Liverpool derby, Man-Utd Spurs, & the big Spanish game.

A lot of money is punted on Sunday's on NFL, too, pardon the punt. I mean, pun.

The Ashes were momentous, too.

On the day after we won The Ashes, I noticed that the cricket book was massive, & then the penny dropped. Liabilities are only accounted for after the Event ends, so long-standing Ashes Series bets all got settled in a single day. Ouch.

Darts is a huge betting medium, too - so simple, A LOT of punters buy money by doing doubles on 1/8 & 1/10 shots. I'm talking 5 figure bets. You'll know how some of those went recently......Wink

My betting urges are being fulfilled in the oddest of ways now.
« Last Edit: January 16, 2011, 03:35:05 PM by tikay » Logged

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« Reply #174 on: January 16, 2011, 03:33:53 PM »

Ahhh the old Extel commentaries, they were something else weren't they?"There's one fallen, can't quite make it out........." followed by a pregnant pause with all punters holding their collective breath.

And the warm glow of "drawing away and winning easily" when yours was the aforementioned.

Being called first in a photo made you about a 1/6 shot as I recall.

Happy days.



I think Compo was big pals with one of the Extel commentators, Dave Smith.

The last furlong was like, 2 miles, as he liked to hype it up. Great stuff!

TV's arrived in the betting shops one day, & Extel was dead. The horse was almost in the winning enclosure, & Dave Smith was still shouting & hollering, "it's Grundy, it's Bustino, it's Grundy, they've flashed across the line together, it's close, photo-finish".

Minutes later would come the Extel result, "1st, 2nd , 3rd, bla de bla, distances, 4 lengths, 5 lengths, 2 lengths"......
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« Reply #175 on: January 16, 2011, 03:41:38 PM »


I adore seeing the "other side" of a bookmaker, it fulfils my urge to bet, without even betting.

I was thinking it must be pretty interesting to see behind the scenes what's going on

Interesting? I LOVE it. Every day, 10am on the dot, yesterday's numbers come through. Leave me alone boys, I need to study every line.

The World Cup was awesome. Before every match we got a Memo which gave all the liabilities in each match, we had big TV plasmas in every single office. It coincided with the SB&G year end - 30th June - so our whole year could have swung several £mill either way based upon it. (God bless England, all targets met).

Ditto the "big" punting days - Derby Day, Grand National Day, Boxing Day. We went into mourning on Boxing day this year, footie, racing all cancelled. Such a shame. So all the money migrated across the platform to Sky Vegas, & Sky Poker. Sky Poker's Xmas started on the day the snow started in late November. It's still Xmas there, too. Bingo is off the graph, an amazing uptick.  The business model fascinates, the way it all works together so well.

For "Bet" (Sky Bet), each evening we get a "Business Mix", broken into every sport covered, maybe 25 or 30 different books. It comes in before the football kicks off, & again, after the football ends, so we know where the liabilities are pretty early. Typically, on a Sunday, the book liability is not cleared until after the Spanish footie in the evening. Today, the accas will include the Liverpool derby, Man-Utd Spurs, & the big Spanish game.

A lot of money is punted on Sunday's on NFL, too, pardon the punt. I mean, pun.

The Ashes were momentous, too.

On the day after we won The Ashes, I noticed that the cricket book was massive, & then the penny dropped. Liabilities are only accounted for after the Event ends, so long-standing Ashes Series bets all got settled in a single day. Ouch.

Darts is a huge betting medium, too - so simple, A LOT of punters buy money by doing doubles on 1/8 & 1/10 shots. I'm talking 5 figure bets. You'll know how some of those went recently......Wink

My betting urges are being fulfilled in the oddest of ways now.

Why such schadenfreude wrt losing punters ?
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« Reply #176 on: January 16, 2011, 03:44:03 PM »

Interesting that back then Dave Smith should want to call photos all the time, as he hardly ever does these days. Known as Smudge The Judge now. Used to be Dave 'Smudger' Smith. Now it's Smudge The Judge. Walking photo-finish-calling ego imo.

Very unpopular with Betfair forumites, as he often doesn't give them the chance to trade out in close finishes. Yep, technology has improved and the photo flashes up on the judge's screen almost straight away, but he's the only Judge that does it. The rest obv like to double check. Quite right too.

It used to be that, if it was less than a neck, a photo was called. Not any more. Fair enough for them to call it if it's a head or a long short-head but if it's a genuine short-head or nose he should call a photo. Word is he doesn't approve of exchange betting on photo finishes. Don't know whether that's true but poor show if that's the reason.
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« Reply #177 on: January 16, 2011, 04:07:25 PM »


I adore seeing the "other side" of a bookmaker, it fulfils my urge to bet, without even betting.

I was thinking it must be pretty interesting to see behind the scenes what's going on

Interesting? I LOVE it. Every day, 10am on the dot, yesterday's numbers come through. Leave me alone boys, I need to study every line.

The World Cup was awesome. Before every match we got a Memo which gave all the liabilities in each match, we had big TV plasmas in every single office. It coincided with the SB&G year end - 30th June - so our whole year could have swung several £mill either way based upon it. (God bless England, all targets met).

Ditto the "big" punting days - Derby Day, Grand National Day, Boxing Day. We went into mourning on Boxing day this year, footie, racing all cancelled. Such a shame. So all the money migrated across the platform to Sky Vegas, & Sky Poker. Sky Poker's Xmas started on the day the snow started in late November. It's still Xmas there, too. Bingo is off the graph, an amazing uptick.  The business model fascinates, the way it all works together so well.

For "Bet" (Sky Bet), each evening we get a "Business Mix", broken into every sport covered, maybe 25 or 30 different books. It comes in before the football kicks off, & again, after the football ends, so we know where the liabilities are pretty early. Typically, on a Sunday, the book liability is not cleared until after the Spanish footie in the evening. Today, the accas will include the Liverpool derby, Man-Utd Spurs, & the big Spanish game.

A lot of money is punted on Sunday's on NFL, too, pardon the punt. I mean, pun.

The Ashes were momentous, too.

On the day after we won The Ashes, I noticed that the cricket book was massive, & then the penny dropped. Liabilities are only accounted for after the Event ends, so long-standing Ashes Series bets all got settled in a single day. Ouch.

Darts is a huge betting medium, too - so simple, A LOT of punters buy money by doing doubles on 1/8 & 1/10 shots. I'm talking 5 figure bets. You'll know how some of those went recently......Wink

My betting urges are being fulfilled in the oddest of ways now.

Why such schadenfreude wrt losing punters ?

I guess it's the obverse of a punters schadenfreude towards bookies.

I'm all of a sudden, after 45 years punting, on the other side of the equation, & Bet's results impact upon my job, &, in fact, my income. Wearing a different pair of shoes after all that time is quite an odd feeling, but I enjoy it enormously.

But it's more than that. It's admiration, awe even, for how the gaming business has been changed by the internet. A losing day on Bet does not bother them, because the money moves around the site. A bad Bet week means a good Vegas week. I think that's rather neat. And, be it modern day Online Gaming, or a smoky betting shop 30 years back, the result is always the same, the bookie is always going to get the lot eventually. It's in the maths. Or math.

I do not feel sorry for any loser in gambling though, be it the punter of the bookie, I'm not sure that's rational. I don't joyfully glee in them losing, either.  And if anyone has lost a small fortune gambling, it's me. I've lost several, in fact. Now, all of a sudden, I'm a winner. Or at least, I feel like I am. But it's a great perspective to be the other side of the bookies counter for once, it really is.

If I were allowed, I'd post up the daily numbers. That'd be some thread, there'd be some chit-chat off that!
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« Reply #178 on: January 16, 2011, 04:08:49 PM »

Interesting that back then Dave Smith should want to call photos all the time, as he hardly ever does these days. Known as Smudge The Judge now. Used to be Dave 'Smudger' Smith. Now it's Smudge The Judge. Walking photo-finish-calling ego imo.

Very unpopular with Betfair forumites, as he often doesn't give them the chance to trade out in close finishes. Yep, technology has improved and the photo flashes up on the judge's screen almost straight away, but he's the only Judge that does it. The rest obv like to double check. Quite right too.

It used to be that, if it was less than a neck, a photo was called. Not any more. Fair enough for them to call it if it's a head or a long short-head but if it's a genuine short-head or nose he should call a photo. Word is he doesn't approve of exchange betting on photo finishes. Don't know whether that's true but poor show if that's the reason.

He's still around? Good God, how old is he?

I was stood in bookies shops listening to him in the 70's, or am I dreaming?
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« Reply #179 on: January 16, 2011, 04:28:23 PM »

Yup, Smith still knocking about, although he's literally just been taken off the commentators' rota (1 January). Graham Goode also dropped, hence his retirement. Still don't know why they don't use Martin Harris a lot more. He's top class.

If I had to guess I'd put Smudge The Judge in his late 50s now, so he'd have been a youngster when doing Extel.
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